Ukraine
Old 02-21-2014, 06:09 PM   #1 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Unhappy Ukraine

Things got completely out of hand there protestants are in the war with government and innocent people are dying. what are your thoughts on all this? who should be blamed the most? what can be done to stop this madness?
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 06:18 PM   #2 (permalink)
payin Dwyane Wade

Senior Member
 
Kirby's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,816
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOG View Post
Things got completely out of hand there protestants are in the war with government and innocent people are dying. what are your thoughts on all this? who should be blamed the most? what can be done to stop this madness?
I'm very ignorant to the things happening in Ukraine and Venezuela, but from my understanding they're protesting against a corrupt government?
I know the protestors are getting murdered for standing up, and they need some help...
I don't know what can be done, but the government is evidently shitty over there and I'm sorry for what's happening .
Kirby is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 06:32 PM   #3 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirby View Post
I'm very ignorant to the things happening in Ukraine and Venezuela, but from my understanding they're protesting against a corrupt government?
I know the protestors are getting murdered for standing up, and they need some help...
I don't know what can be done, but the government is evidently shitty over there and I'm sorry for what's happening .
Yea that's only half of the truth though, both sides are guilty. Yanukovich should be arrested at this point. And I don't agree that protestants should get more help.
Cops are getting killed too, opposition has no intentions to stop the war. They are not there to protest they are there to burn everything and kill whoever doesn't support them(including innocent people). Cops are doing exactly the same thing, and people who have nothing to do with it are dying
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 06:49 PM   #4 (permalink)
payin Dwyane Wade

Senior Member
 
Kirby's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,816
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOG View Post
Yea that's only half of the truth though, both sides are guilty. Yanukovich should be arrested at this point. And I don't agree that protestants should get more help.
Cops are getting killed too, opposition has no intentions to stop the war. They are not there to protest they are there to burn everything and kill whoever doesn't support them(including innocent people). Cops are doing exactly the same thing, and people who have nothing to do with it are dying
Wasn't it a "peaceful" protest at first? I'm sure as it escalated both sides became guilty. If you don't mind, could you fill in some of the details I'm missing?
Kirby is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 06:58 PM   #5 (permalink)
www.torontoraptorsforum.com

giant steps
 
'trane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,191
Representing:
Default

first, they are not protestants. well, they might be, but i doubt it. the word you are looking for is protesters.

second, by and large, this is the climax of a months-long bitter dispute because the president went against the will of the western-oriented public (and the majority of people) by throwing away a law to move closer to the EU in favour of accepting a russian payment to keep close ties with the kremlin. the eastern side of ukraine favours this, but is in the minority. the western side is very much opposed.

also, the president previously threw the leader of the opposition and former president in jail on bogus charges (the laws were reversed as part of the deal today and she will be freed). this imprisonment enraged western-leaning ukrainians.

the bulk of the protest has been peaceful, but as the president became more and more entrenched in his pro-kremlin stance the protesters grew increasingly frustrated. in the end they caved to pressure from a small pro-violence faction. when the (widely despised) interior minister ordered a violent police response to the protesters, things started to get really, really ugly and violence escalated on both sides. the interior minister was deposed today as part of the deal.


this is not about corruption, per se. it is about the identity of the country. pro-west or pro-kremlin? and the people felt that this had already been decided before yanukovych threw it in the garbage to accept cash from russia.
'trane is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 07:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirby View Post
Wasn't it a "peaceful" protest at first? I'm sure as it escalated both sides became guilty. If you don't mind, could you fill in some of the details I'm missing?
Yes it was, but there is a huge group that didn't want to protest peacefully and start burning and breaking shit everywhere. And than the cops started using force too and it just got ugly fast.
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 07:03 PM   #7 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Default

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=2q4TaZyKv3Y
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 07:06 PM   #8 (permalink)
LX
effin' ineffable

In the Paint
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 30,071
Representing:
Default

This is a pretty good overview.

BBC News - Why is Ukraine in turmoil?

I fear this is what the future will look like all over the world. The liberal ideas that came out of the last Century are being squelched bit by bit. Regardless of political institutions or governing structures, citizenship is constantly being undermined and the public sphere is being raided for the benefit of a powerful few. I hand it to the Ukrainian people for standing up for themselves, while we sit here having our metadata collected.
LX is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 07:14 PM   #9 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 'trane View Post
first, they are not protestants. well, they might be, but i doubt it. the word you are looking for is protesters.

second, by and large, this is the climax of a months-long bitter dispute because the president went against the will of the western-oriented public (and the majority of people) by throwing away a law to move closer to the EU in favour of accepting a russian payment to keep close ties with the kremlin. the eastern side of ukraine favours this, but is in the minority. the western side is very much opposed.

also, the president previously threw the leader of the opposition and former president in jail on bogus charges (the laws were reversed as part of the deal today and she will be freed). this imprisonment enraged western-leaning ukrainians.

the bulk of the protest has been peaceful, but as the president became more and more entrenched in his pro-kremlin stance the protesters grew increasingly frustrated. in the end they caved to pressure from a small pro-violence faction. when the (widely despised) interior minister ordered a violent police response to the protesters, things started to get really, really ugly and violence escalated on both sides. the interior minister was deposed today as part of the deal.


this is not about corruption, per se. it is about the identity of the country. pro-west or pro-kremlin? and the people felt that this had already been decided before yanukovych threw it in the garbage to accept cash from russia.
I agree for the most part, but the people from west, especially that huge gang (forgot what it's called) are there to kill. They've been known for years to be Nazi like skinheads, to believe that Ukraine is for ''true'' Ukrainians.
South and East of Ukraine is pro-kremlin mostly. I have fiends who have family in Kiev and according to them it's far from poor protesters are getting killed by cops. Both sides are fucked up.
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2014, 07:16 PM   #10 (permalink)
LOG
Is sick and tired of Casey

Senior Member
 
LOG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 10,741
Representing:
Default

BBC News - Ukraine, as viewed from Moscow
LOG is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24