Lockout official - Page 38
Old 11-11-2011, 01:39 AM   #741 (permalink)
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here we go

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NBA Will Play 72-Game Season If New Ultimatum Deal Accepted
Nov 10, 2011 11:21 PM EST

David Stern and Adam Silver addressed the media following Thursday's bargaining session.

"We've had another couple of intense days," said Stern. "A couple hours ago, after Peter Holt and I were in touch with the labor relations committee, we made a revised proposal to the union to address their concerns as best we could."

Stern says they are looking to have a 72-game season with the first games beginning December 15th, if a deal is reached.

The clock on their offer will remain stopped until the player representatives have a chance to review it. If the deal is not accepted, the owners will revert back to their 47% offer.

Stern said that some players may not like the deal and that certain owners don't like the offer.

If the players accept the offer, the 2012 NBA Playoffs and Finals will be moved back one week, according to Silver.

"There comes a time where you are done negotiation and we are," said Stern.

"We await the response from the union. We've done our best," said Stern.

Read more: NBA Will Play 72 Game Season If New Ultimatum Deal Accepted - RealGM Wiretap
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Old 11-11-2011, 01:43 AM   #742 (permalink)
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SI is reporting what has no been agreed to and what was still considered issues last night updated with new info I have found.

Now agree on
Luxury Tax
bird exception
contract lengths
Minimum team salary
Amnesty clause
sign and trades for tax paying teams
restricted free agency (3 days to match)
stretch clause (teams can waive a player and pay money over double the years plus one)

Still apart (part of proposal that players have not agreed to)

Extra Luxury tax for teams paying tax 3 out of 5 years
Tax cliff (teams paying tax getting cut of the money)
MLE for tax teams
qualifying offers (players want them higher then previous CBA)
Escrow (players want a band owners want set amount)
trade exceptions (union wants them increased from last CBA)
Rookie contracts (union wants bonuses available for performance)
Annual raises (players want 7.5 and 6.5 owners want 5.5 and 3)
Cap holds (union wants them decreased)

sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/chris_mannix/11/08/players.lockout/index.html#?sct=nba_t2_a9
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Old 11-11-2011, 01:49 AM   #743 (permalink)
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more info
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SeanDeveney Sean Deveney
Source says league conceded on sign-and-trades for taxpayers. That's a big one for the union to have.
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Old 11-11-2011, 02:55 AM   #744 (permalink)
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heres another article

Stern offers 72-game season, few alternatives - CBSSports.com
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:39 AM   #745 (permalink)
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more info
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Originally Posted by Sean Deveney
Source says league conceded on sign-and-trades for taxpayers. That's a big one for the union to have.
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Old 11-11-2011, 12:03 PM   #746 (permalink)
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Owners' new offer includes new $2.5 mill exception.Also, will raise minimum payroll for teams (used to b 75% of cap, will now b much higher)
11 hours ago
Quote:
Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Changes in owners new proposal: mini midlevel for luxury tax teams from $2.5 million every other year to $3 million EVERY YEAR
34 minutes ago
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
Raise annual salary increases...union says problem is that owners changed definition of tax payer in way that would destroy Bird rights and
32 minutes ago
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Chris_Broussard Chris Broussard
make it nearly impossible to be a tax payer so exceptions would be lost anyway
31 minutes ago
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:29 PM   #747 (permalink)
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New proposal would allow teams to send players to NBDL first 5 years of career and reduce pay to pro-rated 75K. Talk about non-starters.
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What a sucker punch! The owners don't want a season (yet). They are doing everything they can to convince the players not to take the deal. That 47% and hard cap offer is the real offer.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:35 PM   #748 (permalink)
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haha. this is almost as entertaining as a season. more entertaining than lots of games i've watched, that's for sure.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:38 PM   #749 (permalink)
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haha. this is almost as entertaining as a season. more entertaining than lots of games i've watched, that's for sure.
... the curse of being a Raptors fan...
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:52 PM   #750 (permalink)
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What a sucker punch! The owners don't want a season (yet). They are doing everything they can to convince the players not to take the deal. That 47% and hard cap offer is the real offer.
AHH that is horrible if true, no deal is going to be made for sure
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Old 11-11-2011, 04:19 PM   #751 (permalink)
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What a sucker punch! The owners don't want a season (yet). They are doing everything they can to convince the players not to take the deal. That 47% and hard cap offer is the real offer.
Zach Lowe of SI now reporting that clause is no longer part of the owners offer. No details on if they removed it before sending it to the players and it was missed, or if they have revised it since the offer was made. So there might still be a chance here.

http://twitter.com/#!/zachlowe_si
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:00 PM   #752 (permalink)
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RicBucher Ric Bucher
League official says NBDL rule, along w/20-yr age limit + offseason drug testing are B-List and not take-it-or-leave-it. BRI/tax rules are.
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:01 PM   #753 (permalink)
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The NBDL clause is, apparently, a "soft" one, could be removed or renegotiated. However, the way they are trying to take the leverage away from FAs and their agents is unmistakable and non-negotiable. They are making damn sure the players can't have their cake and eat it too.
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:07 PM   #754 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MikeToronto View Post
The NBDL clause is, apparently, a "soft" one, could be removed or renegotiated. However, the way they are trying to take the leverage away from FAs and their agents is unmistakable and non-negotiable. They are making damn sure the players can't have their cake and eat it too.
= no deal
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:29 PM   #755 (permalink)
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CBA expert Larry Coon believes the owners and players essentially have an agreement.

"They've essentially had an agreement for a long time," writes Coon. "It didn't take a crystal ball to see where they would eventually land on the BRI split and system issues. But they still needed to do the dance that gets them there."

But Coon also believes the decision currently facing the players is their biggest one yet.

"Since the stakes rise over time, this is their biggest decision thus far. But it's possible there are bigger decisions yet to come."

While David Stern said on Thursday that the owners are done with negotiations, this will not be their last, best offer.

"If the players say "no" and counter, they can still meet in the middle of next week, Stern's "we're done negotiating" notwithstanding. And if they say "no" and file a decertification petition, this could all come to a head again in January."

Coon believes the players will ultimately accept the current offer and the NBA will play a 72-game season beginning December 15th, but it will be close.

"Derek Fisher has to sell it to the player reps as the best deal they're going to get, with no better option on the horizon. This could still easily blow up, and it's still pretty close to a coin flip. I'd call it a 51/49 split."

Read more: Larry Coon Believes Players Will Accept Proposal By Narrow Margin - RealGM Wiretap
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:33 PM   #756 (permalink)
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Pacers rep Granger says deal is still no good - CBSSports.com
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:36 PM   #757 (permalink)
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Luxury tax teams will also be able to execute a sign-and-trade during the first two years of the new deal. This two-year grace period clearly makes a huge impact on the NBA landscape because of the impending 2012 free agencies of Dwight Howard, Chris Paul and Deron Williams.
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...#ixzz1dRVCoqvH
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:14 AM   #758 (permalink)
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Last CBA was bad, ok, but why do owners want to change every single thing in their favor?

This whole thing looks like a weird way of negotiationg to me.
Whats with constant ultimatums "if you don't accept this offer we will 47% your ass"? This has been going since July. And it will work only if players are on the verge of caving in. Else it will just cancel the season
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Old 11-12-2011, 09:14 AM   #759 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Shifty.py View Post
Last CBA was bad, ok, but why do owners want to change every single thing in their favor?

This whole thing looks like a weird way of negotiationg to me.
Whats with constant ultimatums "if you don't accept this offer we will 47% your ass"? This has been going since July. And it will work only if players are on the verge of caving in. Else it will just cancel the season
Owners ate the only ones who lose money. Why should players get anything. They make plenty and live a very good life.
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:50 PM   #760 (permalink)
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Owners ate the only ones who lose money. Why should players get anything. They make plenty and live a very good life.
It was not always the case that players were well taken care of. It wasn't out of the goodness of the hearts of owners that they changed that, and movement back towards that would have to be worrisome. The players are not looking to get anything in these negotiations. They have looked towards giving up enough to make up for suggested losses. And those losses hardly represent anything that any owner can't handle. Much of it gets made up for in tax breaks, subsidies, income from arenas, and ultimately the value of teams appreciating. The worst case of a team not being able to sustain itself for real presently, would probably be the Hornets, and they were brought there by an owner who made a terrible business decision while fleeing legal action in Charlotte for sexual harassment. And he was happy to take his financial losses, and ultimately retire with all of the advantages he had always known.
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