Lockout official - Page 34
Old 11-08-2011, 08:28 PM   #661 (permalink)
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SpearsNBAYahoo Marc J. Spears
Unless NBA Labor Relations Committee says otherwise, Stern doesn't seem interested in tweeking current labor offer before 5 PM Wednesday.
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Old 11-08-2011, 08:53 PM   #662 (permalink)
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oh awesome, goodbye 11-12 nba season, guess we still got jonas to look at
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Old 11-08-2011, 09:06 PM   #663 (permalink)
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Why would Stern be looking to tweak the deal? He's really holding all the cards right now, he's got the union where he wants them and there's enough rumors circulating that some players would take the deal, as it stands, right now.

My understanding, of the deal right now, is that there is no hard cap in place right now. The players should take it and run.
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Old 11-09-2011, 11:46 AM   #664 (permalink)
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Crunch Time!

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The NBA and NBPA will meet in a small group at 1:00 PM on Wednesday, a source has confirmed.

The NBA is also setting up a large area of the hotel for an evening press conference.

David Stern's ultimatum attached offer to the players will expire at the end of Wednesday. The players are attempting to get a few last minute concessions on system issues from the owners.

Marc J. Spears of Yahoo! Sports reports the NBA is attempting to fly in a few additional owners for Wednesday's meeting.

Via Alan Hahn/Newsday (via Twitter)
Read more: Deadline Labor Meeting In Works For 100 PM - RealGM Wiretap

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David Stern has enough support from ownership to "tweak" some of the system issues that remains points of contention with the union to get a labor deal agreed upon on Wednesday.

“There can be a few things tweaked along the edges, the periphery and this can be agreed upon,” one ownership source told Yahoo! Sports. “I’m confident that would not be an issue if [Stern] did that.”

“It will be a very slight budge,” one high-ranking management source said.

Stern is working under a self-imposed deadline of Wednesday to reach agreement on a deal, otherwise the players have been promised a lesser offer.

“But there’s not enough of [the hardline owners]," said one ownership of getting an even better deal from the players. "Most are not thrilled with current deal, but would take it. But as time goes on and more losses pile up, a majority will need more than the 50-50 deal.”

Read more: Report Stern Has Support From Owners To Tweak System Issues - RealGM Wiretap
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Old 11-09-2011, 12:01 PM   #665 (permalink)
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WOAH biggest meeting yet, still not getting my hopes up
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Old 11-09-2011, 12:15 PM   #666 (permalink)
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NEW YORK -- In a lockout during which most days have been hideous for the players, this one had gone surprisingly well.

They'd presented a united front, made clear to David Stern's owners that they can have their 50 percent already and expertly shifted the pressure of this $4 billion fiasco back to their opposition.

By accepting the economic terms of the owners' offer Tuesday, the players were saying this to the world: If there's no deal Wednesday, Thursday or soon, it won't be because we weren't willing to compromise. It'll be because $3.3 billion over 10 years isn't enough for the owners. It'll be because the NBA wants to hold things up over some obscure system mechanisms that most fans can't relate to -- and for which clear compromises are available.

But here's the thing: Even on what had been a brilliant day for the players, it wasn't such a brilliant day -- for the same reason their days have grown increasingly miserable during this lockout. A great day, one that could go down as ultimately triggering the end of the lockout, was overshadowed by more unfortunate, divisive venom from the league's outside counsel and lead negotiator, Jeffrey Kessler.

Kessler, whose exploding-head theatrics and over-the-top rhetoric had twice contributed to significant blow-ups of the talks recently, told the Washington Post in an interview that occurred before the players' meeting and news conference Tuesday that the NBA was treating players like "plantation workers." No, really, he did.

“To present that in the context of ‘take it or leave it,’ in our view, that is not good faith,” Kessler told the Post in a telephone interview Monday night. “Instead of treating the players like partners, they’re treating them like plantation workers.”

Not only did this verbal assault lack cleverness -- it's a variation on the term commentator Bryant Gumbel had used to defame Stern recently, drawing universal scorn and ridicule -- but it was also offensive. It was not only offensive to Stern, but also to Kessler's clients, 80 percent of whom are black.

Once again, Kessler had poured the kind of needless gasoline on the lockout's smoldering fire, just as he's been doing for weeks.

“Kessler’s agenda is always to inflame and not to make a deal,” Stern said in a response to the Post. “Even if it means injecting race and thereby insulting his own clients. . . . He has been the single most divisive force in our negotiations and it doesn’t surprise me he would rant and not talk about specifics. Kessler’s conduct is routinely despicable.”

So you know what? At this important hour in the talks, a moment when the two sides are coming together at 1 p.m. in Manhattan to try to save the season, let's do something far more productive than Kessler shooting off his mouth and dragging this out for more lawsuits and billable hours.

Let's tell him to button up, get out of the negotiating room and hit the road.

Kessler, the union's lead negotiator and the lockout's chief destabilizer, need not show up at that meeting Wednesday. He needs to be fired.

“I’m sorry you feel that way,” Kessler told me on the phone Wednesday, even as the league and union were arranging the bargaining session. “But anybody who actually knows what my role has been in these and other negotiations, it has been to work and strive towards a deal. That’s what I’ve always done and that’s what I’ll continue to do.”

But all the evidence is to the contrary, and Kessler’s apologies Wednesday – released individually to various news outlets as opposed to en masse from the NBPA – didn’t change that.

“The comments that I made to the Washington Post took place late Monday night after a very long day,” Kessler said. “I look back on those comments as reported and I realize my choice of words was inappropriate. I am sorry about that. I intend to call commissioner Stern and apologize for my inappropriate choice of words.

“I made these comments as a passionate advocate for the players, but I can understand that they can be misinterpreted and viewed as being offensive,” Kessler said. “At this point, we need to put any distractions aside and work to try to get a deal to save the NBA season.”

Perfect advice, to put distractions aside – starting with Kessler. The NBPA should take Kessler’s advice and put him aside

“I did not intend to make any statement that would be interpreted as suggesting any type of racial issue,” Kessler said. “I don’t even remember if the comments were on the record or off the record, but in any event, my use of those words in that context was inappropriate.”

So Kessler had his say, and now I have mine: Go offend somebody else. Go bill somebody else. The players have paid you enough, and have paid enough for your inflammatory tactics that benefit only you.

When union executive director Billy Hunter sees Stern Wednesday, he should open the conversation with an apology on Kessler's behalf. Then, he should deliver news that will be music to the commissioner's ears: "We are no longer retaining Mr. Kessler's services."
Kessler apologizes, but still needs to go - CBSSports.com
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Old 11-09-2011, 01:45 PM   #667 (permalink)
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New interview with Charles Barkley (video)

Conversations With CBS Sports - CBSSports.com
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Old 11-09-2011, 01:47 PM   #668 (permalink)
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The fifth issue, escrows, is not what it might seem, either. Sources insist that this deal will be carefully scripted to ensure that (unlike the old one) over the life of the deal players and owners will each get precisely the percentage of revenues they have agreed to. In the old deal, the most the owners could ever recoup from players was the amount escrowed in the bank. Under the new deal, if that's not enough, owners will make up the difference over time. So this escrow fight is fairly meaningless, too. It's mostly a question of whether the players' money ages in third-party accounts or their own, but it's not an issue of how much each side will ultimately make.
If basketball means anything to owners ... - TrueHoop Blog - ESPN

Looks like the owners are building a back door into the escrow system. So the escrow percentage is going to basically be like it was in the prior deal, with adjustments made in the next year - so it is basically an unlimited escrow already, and it is just a question of when the balance is struck. Look for some extreme over-corrections of salary in the first couple of years, if the rumour of maintaining the salary cap level is true.

With that in place, do you think the owners trade the system concepts the players want for a lower BRI split? If the owners want 52% of revenues to give up their tax-team restriction demands, do the players take it?
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Old 11-09-2011, 02:20 PM   #669 (permalink)
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Basketball is the inane product, its the widget in all of this. It isn't about basketball, and it obviously isn't to anyone involved.
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Old 11-09-2011, 02:33 PM   #670 (permalink)
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Small groups in the meeting today

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Ken Berger
@KBergCBS Ken Berger
In meeting for players: Hunter, Fisher, Mo Evans, Kevin Murphy, Klempner, and yes, Kessler. Other exec board members could join.
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@KBergCBS Ken Berger
For league: Stern, Silver, Peter Holt, Dan Rube and possibly Rick Buchanan. Small groups.
Kessler has to go
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Old 11-09-2011, 02:38 PM   #671 (permalink)
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Kessler? That isn't good.
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Old 11-09-2011, 03:04 PM   #672 (permalink)
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For some reason I got a feeling that they are going to come out today, say they are going to continue to meet tomorrow, and then no deal will be made towards the end of the week, and this trend will continue
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Old 11-09-2011, 03:15 PM   #673 (permalink)
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sounds like some good news i guess
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Sam Amico: ESPN reports Cavs' Dan Gilbert no longer hardline owner. "Multiple sources have confirmed ... (Gilbert) has moved into a more moderate mode" about 13 minutes ago
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Old 11-09-2011, 03:21 PM   #674 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by box1992 View Post
sounds like some good news i guess
I'm so tired of the rollercoaster.
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Old 11-09-2011, 04:01 PM   #675 (permalink)
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Wednesday 3:15 p.m.

Ken Berger of CBSSports.com emailed this in:

As of 3 p.m. ET, here's how I see the storylines taking shape:

* The players wisely turned the ultimatum back on the owners by signaling a willingness to agree on the economics of the proposal -- a 50-50 split that would transfer $330 million a year to the owners, or $3.3 billion over 10 years.

* The pressure is now on the owners to make the few system concessions that the players need to shake hands on a deal and sell it to the membership.

* Is there a but? Oh, theres always a but. In this case, there are several. Allow me to shatter your optimism and list them:

1) But league negotiators have long insisted that, even if the players conceded every penny of their $300 million in annual losses, it still wouldn't be enough because that would merely make the NBA a break-even business as a whole.

2) But the league feels it needs major system changes -- especially a harder luxury-tax line -- to flatten out the payroll disparity and make the product better so it can grow its way out of zero-profit mode. That is why deputy commisssioner Adam Silver has said repeatedly that the two issues are separate. Presumably, so that when the league finally gets all its economic concessions, it can continue to push for more on the system.

3) But the players haven't even missed a paycheck yet. (The first ones would've been set to be cut Nov. 16). If they haven't lost a dime yet, and are already at 50 percent of BRI, how much further would they go? An inquiring owner may ask himself such a question.

The real question is, as it always has been: How much of a victory do the owners want/need, and how do they balance that against the collateral damage of lost games AND the chaos that would ensue if the players began the decertication process with no deal Wednesday. The uncertainty -- both legally and timing-wise -- that would come with a failure to compromise at this point could outweigh the desire to get more concessions from the players. There is a risk-reward construct here, and it's a serious one, with a big downside.

Not the least which is the fact that you, the fans, are informed about what the players have conceded in the negotiations and that the owners would be trifling with the game over a few system issues when they've already won on the economics in a landslide to the tune of $3.3 billion. Not even David Stern could successfully spin that one.

Remember, though. All of this didn't dawn on the league and the owners in the past 24 hours. They've been planning for all of these contingencies -- including the possibility of the union dissolving and instigating a long, uncertain antitrust battle.

When is enough enough? A case can be made that today is the day, and a case can be made that it isn't.
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Old 11-09-2011, 04:24 PM   #676 (permalink)
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KBergCBS Ken Berger
Astute tweeps point out w/o rollbacks, players won't go down to 50 percent until year 3 of deal. So slight change in players' giveback ...
9 minutes ago
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Old 11-09-2011, 05:01 PM   #677 (permalink)
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And not getting very good feedback. Very few people with credible perspective are expecting a deal.
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Old 11-09-2011, 05:13 PM   #678 (permalink)
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AH this sucks
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Old 11-09-2011, 05:16 PM   #679 (permalink)
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lol
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An NBA spokesman just came into the media room and said "They're still meeting. That's your update." So much for 5 p.m. deadline.
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Old 11-09-2011, 06:43 PM   #680 (permalink)
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they are ordering dinner lol
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