Grantland: Scouts not impressed with Wiggins
Old 05-23-2014, 02:55 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Scout 1: Don’t trust his shot or his ball skills. Can’t go left. There is no “fuck you” to him. Kobe’s like, “Fuck you, I’m better than you.” Where was that? I think he is a content player. That’s not Bill Self’s fault — he didn’t tell him not to shoot.

He can be your third-best player, but not your best. Say he goes to Orlando. What’s he going to do as an offensive player? Shoot them to more wins? He has one of the best second/third jumps I’ve ever seen and he’ll have some “Fuck … look at that” moments. But that’s not his personality.

He can be an elite defender. He can guard 1-3s.

Wiggins has offensive holes in his game — no dribble, no pass, streaky shooter. His sex appeal is only his athleticism. I’m not saying he’s one of these athletes that comes into the league and doesn’t know how to play basketball, but he’s behind the other three guys on my board.

Scout 2: I think in the draft, if Embiid is healthy, Wiggins goes no. 3. He will be lost in an NBA half-court offense. He is great in transition, but he has no ball skills. All right hand, no idea what to do without the ball. He struggles with confidence. He actually reminds me more of Gerald Green than any of these studs he’s compared to.

He’s an erratic shooter and has no plan when attacking the rim. He will be easy to coach against with his limited game right now. Needs to find out what playing hard is. He tries hard, but I don’t see that second gear. He would scare me as your franchise’s no. 1 pick, with all the stuff that will go along with being no. 1 in this class. Is he really a face of the franchise?

Defensively he can be a stopper right away. A lot of these coaches want to break down these young guys and limit their minutes because they don’t trust them defensively. With him you can play him the minutes you need to develop him because, defensively, he’s already there.
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Scout 3: In general, interesting kid. In fairness to him he played in a very restricted system at Kansas. All interchangeable parts with designated spots, a lot of structure. When he got the ball, there wasn’t a lot of room to create. He didn’t force things, dealt with it well, but sometimes it hurt his rep. Not anywhere near ready, mentally, to take things over, which is unfair to say at this stage. Game isn’t to the level of his athleticism. Humble, coachable, a positive kid, all good things.

Needs go-to moves. He doesn’t have them yet. He has a high dribble. This is normal for a kid his age. Even Kobe and T-Mac struggled out of high school with go-to moves.

He needs to add a whole bunch of other stuff to be the scorer people think he can be. He needs to forget shooting 3s. His shot isn’t great, but it isn’t broken. It’s not as bad as Kidd-Gilchrist where you say, “Where do we start?”

Great natural movement. An NBA coach can still play him right away because he can defend. He defends the wings in isolation, which is extremely valuable. Physically he can do this right away.

Russillo: Agree with Scout 3.

This one is tough. I’ve changed my mind about him versus Parker a few times this season. He isn’t close to being as polished as Parker is on offense. So, the simple solution is to take Parker, right? Nope, it doesn’t work that way.

Athletically, he is off the charts, but it doesn’t do much for you if you can’t dribble. Right now, he can’t. The times he does get free on a drive, he doesn’t finish nearly as much as he should. It’s baffling; he gets by his man, beats the help, and then screws up the layup.

His personality comes off as timid. It’s not what you want from a guy that is supposed to be your leading scorer in a few years. It is worth mentioning that he played on a team that had two other scorers in Wayne Selden and Perry Ellis, plus the emergence of Embiid and Naadir Tharpe, who was supposed to be a point guard. There weren’t many shots to go around and he still dropped 17 ppg.

When LaMarcus Aldridge was coming out of Texas, I heard a lot of the same stuff: “timid” “doesn’t want it,” etc. I’d go back and look at the tape, and it was obvious Aldridge was playing with selfish guards who didn’t get him the ball, so it’s something to think about. I honestly have no idea if Wiggins is just a great athlete with a passive personality, or the next Tracy McGrady.

The thing about the draft that drives fans crazy is when a GM takes someone based on potential, but think about it this way: Sure, you could take a guy who just finished his junior year and put up big numbers. But the reason teams reach is because they need a star in this league. It’s why the Parker-Wiggins debate is frustrating for people. “If Parker is better, why take Wiggins?” It’s easy. Every front office will ask themselves the same question on draft night: “Can this guy grow, become an All-Star in our league?” If the answer is even close to a yes, the team will go for it. Role players aren’t winning you anything.
Ryen Russillo?s NBA Draft Confidential: Real Scouts on Wiggins, Randle, Embiid, and Parker
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Old 05-23-2014, 03:14 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Canadian Hating once again!
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Old 05-23-2014, 03:26 PM   #3 (permalink)
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there is some truth to this, he doesnt have that "be an asshole kobe instinct" and he looks quite content not taking over games but i hope this pisses him off and makes he become more focused.
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Old 05-23-2014, 03:32 PM   #4 (permalink)
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If in the right system, he doesn't NEED that instinct. If anything his humility will help him not become a chucker, which could be even better for his career.

I can see Parker being a chucker.
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Old 05-23-2014, 03:55 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I heard someone that used ti coach Wiggins who said he was at times lazy, not a gym rat was quiet not seeking to be the guy. He seems like a player that may try to coast on his athletic ability and not work to continue to improve. Just the impression I've had at times when watching him.
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Old 05-23-2014, 04:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jeffb View Post
I heard someone that used ti coach Wiggins who said he was at times lazy, not a gym rat was quiet not seeking to be the guy. He seems like a player that may try to coast on his athletic ability and not work to continue to improve. Just the impression I've had at times when watching him.
I think humility will be the opposite for him. Carter was a showoff. And he rode his athletisiscm to his career. Ended up having only a few years of his top level, if he even got there.

wiggins's humility will help him not buy into his own hype, and thus work hard to get better.
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Old 05-23-2014, 04:29 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Old 05-23-2014, 05:10 PM   #8 (permalink)
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So the biggest knock on Wiggins is that he is a team player, and not a selfish chucker..
He will have plenty of time to become selfish, hell knock on Rudy Gay coming out of college was that he doesn't shoot enough.
I agree with scout 3 somewhat, but I think he will be just fine
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Old 05-23-2014, 05:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I don't think Tim Duncan has that “Fuck you, I’m better than you” mentality, but still one of the best PF ever!!
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Old 05-23-2014, 05:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I don't think Tim Duncan has that “Fuck you, I’m better than you” mentality, but still one of the best PF ever!!
Think back a little ways. Hell even many times this season. He definitely has that mentality, on both ends of the floor.

I don't like the Kobe analogy, because Kobe crosses over to arrogance a lot of the time. Duncan's mentality is all fuck you to the other team without ever forgetting what he needs to do for his own team.
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Old 05-23-2014, 06:13 PM   #11 (permalink)
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So the biggest knock on Wiggins is that he is a team player, and not a selfish chucker..
He will have plenty of time to become selfish, hell knock on Rudy Gay coming out of college was that he doesn't shoot enough.
I agree with scout 3 somewhat, but I think he will be just fine
Oh boy, how times have changed.
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Old 05-23-2014, 06:36 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I heard someone that used ti coach Wiggins who said he was at times lazy, not a gym rat was quiet not seeking to be the guy. He seems like a player that may try to coast on his athletic ability and not work to continue to improve. Just the impression I've had at times when watching him.
I heard that too. Don't see him getting picked top 2
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Old 05-23-2014, 07:18 PM   #13 (permalink)
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i don't think he slips past philly
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Old 05-23-2014, 07:25 PM   #14 (permalink)
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top 3 for sure, without a doubt
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Old 05-23-2014, 07:29 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I actually hope he ends up on Philly..Or Giannis and him on the wings on the bucks would be a crazy long wing lineup.
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Old 05-23-2014, 07:29 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Him not going to the combine doesn't help, then again he wasn't the only one so who knows.
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Old 05-23-2014, 07:38 PM   #17 (permalink)
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if wiggins goes to the bucks, man we would struggle against them. we have so many matchup problems against the bucks for some reason, struggled getting W's
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Old 05-23-2014, 08:49 PM   #18 (permalink)
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if wiggins goes to the bucks, man we would struggle against them. we have so many matchup problems against the bucks for some reason, struggled getting W's
The Bucks imo are prime to trade some of their players and we should enquire.

Mayo, Ilyasova, Sanders are all candidates.
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Old 05-23-2014, 09:05 PM   #19 (permalink)
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The Bucks imo are prime to trade some of their players and we should enquire.

Mayo, Ilyasova, Sanders are all candidates.
I would definitely like to see the last two, leave out the mayo.

Sanders has a long and uneasy contract, I would love him to backup JV,but most around the league would look to him as a starter

If we would take on ilyasova, we would have to decide on between amir and ppat.

Wondering what mil would be looking for, picks and expiringS? Mind you there long 10millper year contracts probably strain the cap that might influence next summer
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Old 05-23-2014, 09:09 PM   #20 (permalink)
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The Bucks imo are prime to trade some of their players and we should enquire.

Mayo, Ilyasova, Sanders are all candidates.
Pass on all accounts. All are just guys who are extremely overpaid (Sanders/Ilyasova) and Mayo is just worthless.

Oh, and these scouts, I'm sorry, I gotta wonder if watched the same kid play. When he was asked to dominate by his team, I can recall on a number occasions when he would just take-over.

But whatever, a lot of the same things being said about him were said about Durant.

Last edited by Claudius; 05-23-2014 at 09:11 PM.
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