Winning or development?

Go Back   Raptors Forum | Toronto Raptors Forums & Message Boards > NBA Discussion > Toronto Raptors

View Poll Results: Which is more important, winning or development?
Winning 15 44.12%
Development 2 5.88%
Both are equally important 15 44.12%
I don't care 2 5.88%
Voters: 34. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-21-2009, 02:04 PM   #1 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Question Winning or development?

I see a strong following for DeMar DeRozan starting this year from day one. If his pro career goes anything like his one year of college then we as Raptors fans are in for a lot of ups and downs from DeMar until he catches on to the NBA game sometime later this season or the next. It's not realistic to expect anything close to what O.J Mayo did last season after his transition from USC. With that said, playing him at the 2 to start the game against the likes of Kobe, Manu, Roy, etc. is a move to get him experience and not a move to secure more wins. The logic behind this is that there is a man on the bench named Antoine Wright who started last season for the perennial playoff team the Dallas Mavericks. During that season he played strong defense and may be the Raptors' best defender this year. In a starting lineup lacking defense and heavy on offensive weapons one would think such a player who has proven to be able to fit in with a group of shot hungry starters last season would be a good fit for the Raptors to start this season. One could argue he, right now in game one, is the best choice to start at the 2 if winning is the biggest priority for the Toronto Raptors. The future of Chris Bosh in Toronto could be decided this year based on the standings and potential playoff birth...Every game is amplified this season.

With that said, what is most important to you right now, winning or development? Who gives the Raptors the best chance at winning games in the starting lineup? How should minutes be allocated at the 2 and who should be finishing games?

Last edited by Apollo; 09-21-2009 at 02:08 PM.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:15 PM   #2 (permalink)
censored

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,774
Representing:
Default

winning is the best way to develop players.

the way butch Carter handled t-mac is what i'm hoping for from triano.

Last edited by dfunkie1; 09-21-2009 at 02:20 PM.
dfunkie1 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:27 PM   #3 (permalink)
contemplating

The Killing Joke

 
Claudius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Burkina Faso, Disputed Zone
Posts: 10,024
Representing:
Send a message via MSN to Claudius
Default

Hell, we're basing alot on DeRozan's potential, however, Wright is ONLY 25. The kid can still develop too and he's not a bad player and it isn't out of the question that Wright could end up being the better player.

But funkie said it best, winning is the best way to develop players.
Claudius is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:41 PM   #4 (permalink)
adoring his baby girl.

Senior Member
 
Sick, Wicked and Nasty!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 3,288
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollo View Post
With that said, what is most important to you right now, winning or development? Who gives the Raptors the best chance at winning games in the starting lineup? How should minutes be allocated at the 2 and who should be finishing games?
There's no way to know until they start playing together. DD starting might be the best fit for winning..or maybe it's Wright. It's all complete (and beaten to death) speculation at this point

To answer your poll question... Winning!
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:50 PM   #5 (permalink)
Gam zeh ya'avor

The Gatekeeper
 
MikeToronto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3,916
Representing:
Default

The answer to the poll's question depends on where in its life-cycle the team is at the moment. For the current Raptors' team, winning is absolutely paramount.
MikeToronto is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 02:57 PM   #6 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,283
Representing:
Jack -25yrs old
Belinelli- 23yrs old
Bargnani-23yrs old
Derozan- 20yrs old
Bosh- 25yrs old
Wright- 25yrs old
Johnson- 22yrs old

All of these players are still young and still need to develope further. Obviously some more then others (ie: Bosh), but these are all to varying degrees key players going forward for this season and beyond. So i think the quicker these players continue to get better and develop the better we'll be. One can't happen without the other. This team is built not to just to win more games this season but to compete beyond this season.

Last edited by jeffb; 09-21-2009 at 03:00 PM.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:10 PM   #7 (permalink)
LX
present minded

In the Paint


 
LX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 27,677
Representing:
Default

The reason you get a vet like Turkoglu is to allow for proper development within a winning environment. So if winning is not the dominating factor, then they really screwed up and will waste their new acquisition, and they will not get a true assessment of just how valuable their young guys are or can be.
LX is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:20 PM   #8 (permalink)
mooing

Senior Member
 
babyface's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 5,102
Representing:
Default

wouldn't wins be a by product of their development?
babyface is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:34 PM   #9 (permalink)
everybody get off ur arses and vote CB4 to the All Star Game!

Str8 Shooter
 
.40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Maple...by way of Rexdale
Posts: 699
Representing:
Default

I understand why Triano and Co. want to start DD. If they don't start Derozan he risks getting lost in the rotation with insufficient mins. If Wright starts at SG, then how exactly will the rotation work? Colangelo has made it clear that Belinelli will get significant mins (BC's talking of 6th man award already). It looks like the plan is to have Wright backup Hedo at SF. The Dinos will have a difficult time to get enough mins for DD, Belinelli, and JJ at SG if Wright were to start.

I prefer having Wright in the starting line to provide much needed D. We have enough scorers in the starting lineup, that I think it wouldn't be a bad idea to have DD come off the bench. It's obviously a question of how fast you want to develop DD. Personally I think at this point it is more important for the Dinos to WIN games.
.40 Cal Flakes is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:35 PM   #10 (permalink)
is dead inside

you ain't bout that life
 
Gurk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,059
Representing:
Default

To me they are equally important. If we can't win this season it will be a waste. We traded and signed all the new players to win and that's what I am hoping for
Gurk is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:36 PM   #11 (permalink)
a gearbox of epic proportions.

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,051
Representing:
Send a message via MSN to B-RAD
Default

how about winning and development.
B-RAD is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:40 PM   #12 (permalink)
relaxed

Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 20
Representing:
Default

I agree. The more wins throughout the season translates to better development. Show a rookie what it takes to win in the league before giving him more responsibility. If That means putting him on the bench then fine. Wright has a lot of upside too only being 25 years of age.
Mike Klander is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:42 PM   #13 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,283
Representing:
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-RAD View Post
how about winning and development.
We got alot younger basically over night with players that are important to this organization going forward, this season and beyond. So we can't win without players like Jack, Derozan, Belinelli, Wright, Johnson developping. Add to that Bargnani (23yrs old) needs to improve and Bosh (25yrs old) needs to take it up a notch as well.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 03:50 PM   #14 (permalink)
everybody get off ur arses and vote CB4 to the All Star Game!

Str8 Shooter
 
.40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Maple...by way of Rexdale
Posts: 699
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claudius View Post
Hell, we're basing alot on DeRozan's potential, however, Wright is ONLY 25. The kid can still develop too and he's not a bad player and it isn't out of the question that Wright could end up being the better player.

But funkie said it best, winning is the best way to develop players.
Bang on. It seems that a lot of people are forgetting that Wright is ONLY 25 with a lot of potential. From what Rick Carlisle was saying Wright is one tough SOB with a good track for D. Winning is or should be the most important thing for the Raps organization, especially since CB4 has come out and said that his decision to stay in T-Dot will be influenced by the success or failure of the Raps THIS season.

IMHO the Raps would be better suited with Wright starting. Yeah it might be at the expense of derozan's development but the kid is so young that in the long run it might not hurt as bad.
.40 Cal Flakes is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:08 PM   #15 (permalink)
is back baby

Large and in charge
 
Snooch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All up in there
Posts: 8,160
Representing:
Default

If wright is so good at what he does and if he is so solid that Carlisle stated how tough he is.....why has he been traded twice so far in his career?
Snooch is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:09 PM   #16 (permalink)
adoring his baby girl.

Senior Member
 
Sick, Wicked and Nasty!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 3,288
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by babyface View Post
wouldn't wins be a by product of their development?
Possibly... down the road... but not now. The question is focus on winning now or focus on developing DD and the other young prospects. Pick one.
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:18 PM   #17 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,283
Representing:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snooch View Post
If wright is so good at what he does and if he is so solid that Carlisle stated how tough he is.....why has he been traded twice so far in his career?
I have to agree in a sense. This guy has started but in limited minutes. If he was that good, he would have been a more consistent starter and averaged 30+minutes at some point. This guy for some reason on here has become highly overrated. Don't get me wrong, i like his addition to this team, but he's essentially a 20-23MPG player. Which is fine, nothing wrong with that. But people want him to start and end games @ SG and backup Turkoglu as well? Wow?

I think who ever is playing best that game will be finishing that specific game @ SG and it won't be a set thing.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:22 PM   #18 (permalink)
BOOBS

never too old.


 
INSIDER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: richmond hill
Posts: 11,467
Representing:
Default

whens the last time the Lakers ever were in development mode? or the Spurs?
these teams are winners... and the way winners go, they never need to develop anyone because theres always a constant stream of excellent players coming and going through their system. The winners pretty much keep on winning.
I'd rather win then develop... especially in our market, where it seems as though as soon as we develop a star; he bolts.
INSIDER is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:34 PM   #19 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,283
Representing:
Quote:
Originally Posted by INSIDER View Post
whens the last time the Lakers ever were in development mode? or the Spurs?
these teams are winners... and the way winners go, they never need to develop anyone because theres always a constant stream of excellent players coming and going through their system. The winners pretty much keep on winning.
I'd rather win then develop... especially in our market, where it seems as though as soon as we develop a star; he bolts.
They were in delopment mode when they had young teams before they won a championship. The thing is it's all done in cycles. In other words, once you accumulate the right talent and develope them properly in the right system and eventually become a championship winner,usually your moves for the forseeable future is more in the way of tinkering while keeping the nucleas together-Stability. So yeah, those teams aren't developing many players, mainly because they have 8-10 guaranteed players and for the most part are stable because of the veterans who they seem to keep for like ever.

Mostly though they are extremely well coached and have probably the two best GM's in the league.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2009, 04:44 PM   #20 (permalink)
everybody get off ur arses and vote CB4 to the All Star Game!

Str8 Shooter
 
.40 Cal Flakes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Maple...by way of Rexdale
Posts: 699
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snooch View Post
If wright is so good at what he does and if he is so solid that Carlisle stated how tough he is.....why has he been traded twice so far in his career?
Players are traded for a variety of reasons, financial, team going in a different direction, whatever. A player having been traded is not necessarily an indication of that players abilities or lack thereof.
.40 Cal Flakes is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How is Cleveland winning so much!? highonpsi NBA Talk 38 05-10-2009 09:28 AM
I'm winning Everything Kirby Entertainment Lounge 23 04-20-2009 08:00 PM
We're Winning ......Sorta Benzo Toronto Raptors 11 04-23-2008 05:00 PM
Lucas Hired As Basketball Development Consultant Dr. J. Naismith Toronto Raptors 14 03-01-2008 11:33 PM
Smitch on the development on high draft picks Dr. J. Naismith Toronto Raptors 7 01-18-2008 09:23 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:58 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24