Why are we building around the worst rebounding big in the NBA? - Page 2

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Old 04-30-2012, 04:55 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fk24 View Post
Sullinger is the anchor of the best defensive team in college basketball.

What exactly is Bargnani the anchor of?

Rebunding defense inside game Sullinger is better than Bargnani.

What is so laughable?
I'd like to see evidence of his anchoring and the best defensive team in college basketball first of all. I've yet to see Sullinger play defence or score at the NBA level. I have strong doubts he'll be good at either since he struggled when he had to play against length even in NCAA. I think he'll be a solid player, but I'd be surprised if he ended up as anything more than an average starter.

If you're only looking at rebounding and defence, Bargnani will look worse than most. He is capable of being a very good offensive player though. I don't think he's a guy who can carry us anywhere or importance, but with some more pieces around him he can be a very useful offensive weapon.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:56 PM   #22 (permalink)
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i always had-have mix thoughts about bargs.
one season i like him as much as shit, one i don't care, and this one i find him better than shit, but he doesn't play trough a lot.

but to me, trade him to a team who badly need a PF/C scorer (like houston) and grab as many asset as you can.
hi bankiz.

i agreed with most of your point but just to point out that houston has scola and patterson, who they like and who has a good jump-shot. Doubt they would trade for him and play him at C.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:58 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Grizz View Post
If you're only looking at rebounding and defence, Bargnani will look worse than most. He is capable of being a very good offensive player though. I don't think he's a guy who can carry us anywhere or importance, but with some more pieces around him he can be a very useful offensive weapon.
I'd say that "carry" is the right word here. Bargnani is not a player you want to carry your team on a regular basis. Ideally, you'd have a wing or a PG play that role, with Bargs being a great second offensive option while, hopefully, continuing to improve on defensive end.
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:04 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Unless you have Dwight Howard @ C, you can't hide Bargnani. If you're averaging five boards a game playing all those minutes, the opponent is getting alot of offensive boards and getting more possessions. Let's go with Anthony Davis or Thomas Robinson.
puzzled by these comments, given that we've been a very good rebounding team this season with and without bargnani

believe it or not, we've been the 2nd best team in defensive rebounding this season, with only San Antonio ahead of us.

Offensive rebounding is more dependant on the team strategy, some teams like to crash the boards, other like to retreat, so it's more difficult to analyze that, but we've been 22nd, which is bad, but not terrible.

Add JV to the mix and we'll be a top rebounding team next season regardless of other moves.
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:06 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Bargnani at PF is such a liability and presents many holes we have to shore up. He gives up so many offensive rebounds and whatever he scores he gives back on the defensive end. This team shouldn't ignore certain guys in the draft because they play the same position as Bargnani.
and btw, last season we've been 25th in the league in DRs with pretty much the exact same roster.

So effort (players) and being in the right place at the right time (coaching) make all the difference when it comes to defensive rebounding.
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:13 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Bravo, moremilk.
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Old 04-30-2012, 07:38 PM   #27 (permalink)
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According to basketball reference, the (league) average win shares/48 mins is .100. This year Andrea finally surpassed .100. Which is nice. This year his win shares/48 mins was
.104. His career average is .064.

Bargs' defensive rating (an estimate of points allowed/100 possessions) was 106 this year, tying his career best 106 from his rookie season. His offensive rating (an estimate of points produced (players) or scored (teams) per 100 possessions) was 104 this season.

Also, somebody mentioned Brook Lopez. Brook averaged over 8 rebounds/game in his first 2 seasons. Bargs' career high is 6.2 rebounds/game. So, Brook has shown that he can at least rebound and now either can't (due to injuries), doesn't want to, is lazy, lacks effort, plays beside everyone's former favourite raptor in the Hump (sarcasm is present), etc. However, Bargs has never rebounded well so clear indication - he likely will continue to be a subpar rebounder.

Bargs' total rebounding % this season was 9.8. not exactly great.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:24 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Bargs is one of the toughest players in the NBA to defend. That should speak for itself. Stop expecting him to be a presence on the glass because he never will be. He is the player that he will bitch about not having when he is gone and mark my words. His versatility rivals only a certain few when you look at his height and length.

This thread is wack, the guy barely even played this season and already people are ready to cut the man loose. Typical of a toronto sports fan.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:25 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:48 PM   #30 (permalink)
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This thread is wack, the guy barely even played this season and already people are ready to cut the man loose. Typical of a toronto sports fan.
Yeah, we've seen him play since the fall of 06. He had one stretch of good games this year and now he's apparantly untouchable. Asking him to average 7 boards is not asking him to be a presence on the boards. It's the bare minimum in terms of rebounding for a starting PF.

We have to get a SF who can rebound, play great D and hit the three to make up for his flaws.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:52 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Yeah, we've seen him play since the fall of 06. He had one stretch of good games this year and now he's apparantly untouchable. Asking him to average 7 boards is not asking him to be a presence on the boards. It's the bare minimum in terms of rebounding for a starting PF.

We have to get a SF who can rebound, play great D and hit the three to make up for his flaws.
Ya! His name is Ersan
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:54 PM   #32 (permalink)
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+ he'll probably cost $10 million/year. + we only will have about 9 million in capspace once we take into account JonasV, the incoming draft pick, and no amnesties.

+ we aren't the only team with "capspace".
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:56 PM   #33 (permalink)
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+ he'll probably cost $10 million/year. + we only will have about 9 million in capspace once we take into account JonasV, the incoming draft pick, and no amnesties.
And he'd be worth every penny and if anyone can make a crazed deal it would be BC - that guy can manuever the CBA!

This is where BC trade's DD and whomever for OJ Mayo, drafts Marshal and flips JC to another team.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:58 PM   #34 (permalink)
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On the other thread Kirby said something interesting: Ersan is not a 3.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:59 PM   #35 (permalink)
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On the other thread Kirby said something interesting: Ersan is not a 3.
Actually he is a 3 and a 4 AND can play both. In Mil it was better suited for him to play the 4 with the make-up of that team. In TO he would be much better suited playing the 3- given Ersan's and Brag's strengths and weaknesses, they'd pair up well.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:27 PM   #36 (permalink)
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A big who starts & plays 33+ minutes and averages 5 boards a game is starting quality? Dirk averages 3+ more boards and is a good help defender.

I don't think Bargnani will be better than Sullinger.
Bargnani is already better than Sullinger.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:28 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Bargnani is already better than Sullinger.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:35 PM   #38 (permalink)
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He is. Doesn't take much to be better than Bargs - you just have to be able to rebound and defend - things which he can't/is horrible at. + If you have some offense in your game, then even better. So, yes, Sullinger + T.Robinson are most likely already better than Bargs.

Last edited by LET'S GO RAPTORS!!!!!; 04-30-2012 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:42 PM   #39 (permalink)
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He is. Isn't take much to be better than Bargs - you just have to be able to rebound and defend - things which he can't/is horrible at. + If you have some offense in your game, then even better. So, yes, Sullinger + T.Robinson are most likely already better than Bargs.
You must be joking. If not, pretend you are and save face. They are both better rebounders than Bargs. There's a chance they might be better overall one day. If you were trying to win a game today and wanted one of those guys over Bargs, well I'd gladly be on the other team.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:46 PM   #40 (permalink)
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He is. Doesn't take much to be better than Bargs - you just have to be able to rebound and defend - things which he can't/is horrible at. + If you have some offense in your game, then even better. So, yes, Sullinger + T.Robinson are most likely already better than Bargs.
I want what you're smoking cause it has to be some good shit! Those 2 players haven't come close to the career that Bargs' has had (before he got to the NBA)

Stop the hatin and start the lovin cause Bargs isn't going anywhere for at LEAST another year.
^^^My avatar has said that all year so it MUST be true
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