What happend to Jose?

gochi · 11-23-2009, 02:56 PM

When we had ford, jose played well. So well in fact, that jose was considered a top tier point guard and a hypothetical trade dealing jose to the suns for the nash would seem disadvantageous for the raptors.

Now, after getting an extension (38mil/4yrs?) and better teammates, jose is not even in the category of top 10 pg's, nor does he have any appreciable trade value.

What happend to Jose?

the_ raps_analyst · 11-23-2009, 03:31 PM

he played off the bench back then, so his defence went unnoticed. Also of the bench, raps would play fast - tempo. Our starters play more of a half-court game.

jeffb · 11-23-2009, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_ raps_analyst

he played off the bench back then, so his defence went unnoticed. Also of the bench, raps would play fast - tempo. Our starters play more of a half-court game.

Back then (the season in question)....he started 60 games because TJ was hurt. And he played so well getting 34MPG that TJ was then traded that summer. In other words he wasn't coming off the bench.

the_ raps_analyst · 11-23-2009, 03:36 PM

my mistake.

the_ raps_analyst · 11-23-2009, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

Back then (the season in question)....he started 60 games because TJ was hurt. And he played so well getting 34MPG that TJ was then traded that summer. In other words he wasn't coming off the bench.

I think u mean 56 games and 30mpg(the season in question.

jeffb · 11-23-2009, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_ raps_analyst

I think u mean 56 games.

OK.............Back then (the season in question)....he started 56 games because TJ was hurt. And he played so well getting 34MPG that TJ was then traded that summer. In other words he wasn't coming off the bench.

Better?

the_ raps_analyst · 11-23-2009, 03:42 PM

no, it was 30 minutes

Sick, Wicked and Nasty! · 11-23-2009, 04:15 PM

Don't forget too that a lot of fans and tv analysts were making more of Jose than perhaps he was worthy off. How much was made of his assist to turnover ratio 2 years ago and last year his free throw percentage? I watched the Utah game with a friend who charted defensive assignments and the amount of made buckets against Jose vs misses, steals, blocks was atrocious...far and away the worst of the team and he didn't score a lot of points to counter his crappiness on D. A lot of his charts look like that for this season, and have for seasons in the past. His rep for poor D is well deserved and will in my opinion haunt him for a long time with respect to overall league appreciation including for allstar.

Sick, Wicked and Nasty! · 11-23-2009, 04:15 PM

In other words i'm saying he was as good as you think

gochi · 11-23-2009, 04:39 PM

if jose continues to play the way he is, i think, at best, he is a backup pg or 6th man. Yet, he is being paid like a starter.

**halphbreedballer** · 11-23-2009, 04:47 PM

Screw all this Jose getting tired shit! It's time for this team to have a gut check play hard or get less minutes!!

waqman · 11-23-2009, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by halphbreedballer

Screw all this Jose getting tired shit! It's time for this team to have a gut check play hard or get less minutes!!

lol i dont think triano has the heart to bench players underperforming haha

he really should send a message perhaps. shake things up.

i think jose is secretly partly injured. yeah.

**halphbreedballer** · 11-23-2009, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waqman

lol i dont think triano has the heart to bench players underperforming haha

he really should send a message perhaps. shake things up.

i think jose is secretly partly injured. yeah.

Then if he is still injured rest him let Jack start then Banks & Beli back him up!!

I'm tired of excuses now...I am not satisfied with this team being a 500 or less team when it should win 47 games!!!

raptor123 · 11-23-2009, 06:23 PM

Again alot more bullshit about Jose. Guys get over it. Jose is still a top tier pg. The question should be asked whether Hedo should have the ball in his hands more then Jose. Hedo is our worst defender not Jose. Jose has out played some of the top pgs so far this year. Yet he gets no respect from his raptor fans. When Jose blows past his man and takes the ball to the rim do we come on here and talk about that. Jack is not the answer also as our point guard.Jack is getting his minutes because he was promised before he signed. Thats my biggest concern , are we going lose games just to have Javck get his minutes.Jack has only played one good game and I hate to burst everyones buble but Jack is no better at d then Jose.

jeffb · 11-23-2009, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

Again alot more bullshit about Jose. Guys get over it. Jose is still a top tier pg. The question should be asked whether Hedo should have the ball in his hands more then Jose. Hedo is our worst defender not Jose. Jose has out played some of the top pgs so far this year. Yet he gets no respect from his raptor fans. When Jose blows past his man and takes the ball to the rim do we come on here and talk about that. Jack is not the answer also as our point guard.Jack is getting his minutes because he was promised before he signed. Thats my biggest concern , are we going lose games just to have Javck get his minutes.Jack has only played one good game and I hate to burst everyones buble but Jack is no better at d then Jose.

Jose is by far our worst defender. Hell last game was probably his worst game of the season defensively and it was talked about all game on the broadcast. Hedo isn't a great defender by any means but he's been ok from what i've noticed, especially considering he's not 100%.

Apollo · 11-23-2009, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gochi

When we had ford, jose played well. So well in fact, that jose was considered a top tier point guard and a hypothetical trade dealing jose to the suns for the nash would seem disadvantageous for the raptors.

Now, after getting an extension (38mil/4yrs?) and better teammates, jose is not even in the category of top 10 pg's, nor does he have any appreciable trade value.

What happend to Jose?

He's an extremely predictable PG. The book is out on him now and he's doing nothing contrary to it. I mean, really, did he think teams were going to keep giving him that uncontested backdoor layup for his whole career? Chris Bosh and Andrea Bargnani have been constantly, every summer, working on a piece of them game but you never hear that about Jose. When TJ was in town he was offering a change of pace top Jose and he also was taking all the attention/heat. Now Jose has no one to hide behind.

Sick, Wicked and Nasty! · 11-23-2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

Again alot more bullshit about Jose. Guys get over it. Jose is still a top tier pg.

Prove this..Back it up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

The question should be asked whether Hedo should have the ball in his hands more then Jose. Hedo is our worst defender not Jose. Jose has out played some of the top pgs so far this year.

Prove this, back it up!

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

Yet he gets no respect from his raptor fans. When Jose blows past his man and takes the ball to the rim do we come on here and talk about that.

Because it typically only happens 1 or 2 times a game tops! If he got to the line like a Chris Paul or Deron it would mean something but it just doesn't happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

Jack is not the answer also as our point guard.Jack is getting his minutes because he was promised before he signed. Thats my biggest concern , are we going lose games just to have Javck get his minutes.Jack has only played one good game and I hate to burst everyones buble but Jack is no better at d then Jose.

You're basing this on 12 games. We're basing our Jose play on his career.

raptor123 · 11-23-2009, 06:48 PM

We keep on hearing about Jack and his confidence. I am getting sick and tired hearing Leo , Devlin and Jack saying the Jarret Jack is showing signs he could be breaking out. Shit must have heard this for 13 games lol.They will never sit Jack or just play him solely as Joses back up. If Jack plays more we lose. Its already been noted in a previous post that when Jack is on the floor our d is at our worst and when hes on with Jose we are really weak. Jack must get his 20 mins at the 1 thats it because he can't shoot. If Jack can't accept that they we kick his ass out of town just like we did with TJ.

hirmak · 11-23-2009, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raptor123

Again alot more bullshit about Jose. Guys get over it. Jose is still a top tier pg. The question should be asked whether Hedo should have the ball in his hands more then Jose. Hedo is our worst defender not Jose. Jose has out played some of the top pgs so far this year. Yet he gets no respect from his raptor fans. When Jose blows past his man and takes the ball to the rim do we come on here and talk about that. Jack is not the answer also as our point guard.Jack is getting his minutes because he was promised before he signed. Thats my biggest concern , are we going lose games just to have Javck get his minutes.Jack has only played one good game and I hate to burst everyones buble but Jack is no better at d then Jose.

That's really ridiculous.Hedo played very well in Defensive part in this team,but when Jose plays,then I know the guards of the other team will be playing their best and most comfortable games in NBA.Jose is the weakest part of this team.I think Bellinelli earns to play as starter and Jose must sit in the bench.Maybe it'd be better for him like Ginobili

raptor123 · 11-23-2009, 06:54 PM

IT'S simple guys Jose is greater Jack
Carter is 100 % better then Hedo

I am more concerned about Hedo's game then Jose.

Again without going back and showing you facts i will just mention the orlando game. Lets see who had the worst plus minus on they team. It was Jack and Hedo. Not Jose guys.

11-23-2009, 02:56 PM	#1 (permalink)
gochi wtf i dont rep that flag! Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 71 Representing:	What happend to Jose? When we had ford, jose played well. So well in fact, that jose was considered a top tier point guard and a hypothetical trade dealing jose to the suns for the nash would seem disadvantageous for the raptors. Now, after getting an extension (38mil/4yrs?) and better teammates, jose is not even in the category of top 10 pg's, nor does he have any appreciable trade value. What happend to Jose?

11-23-2009, 06:54 PM	#20 (permalink)
raptor123 a Piston Fan ! Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 2,242 Representing:	IT'S simple guys Jose is greater Jack Carter is 100 % better then Hedo I am more concerned about Hedo's game then Jose. Again without going back and showing you facts i will just mention the orlando game. Lets see who had the worst plus minus on they team. It was Jack and Hedo. Not Jose guys. Last edited by raptor123; 11-23-2009 at 06:58 PM.

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11-23-2009, 03:31 PM	#2 (permalink)
the_ raps_analyst confused why the raptors are so consistantly inconsistant Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 856 Representing:	he played off the bench back then, so his defence went unnoticed. Also of the bench, raps would play fast - tempo. Our starters play more of a half-court game.

11-23-2009, 03:36 PM	#4 (permalink)
the_ raps_analyst confused why the raptors are so consistantly inconsistant Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 856 Representing:	my mistake.

11-23-2009, 03:42 PM	#7 (permalink)
the_ raps_analyst confused why the raptors are so consistantly inconsistant Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 856 Representing:	no, it was 30 minutes

11-23-2009, 04:15 PM	#8 (permalink)
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! adoring his baby girl. Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Canada eh? Posts: 3,278 Representing:	Don't forget too that a lot of fans and tv analysts were making more of Jose than perhaps he was worthy off. How much was made of his assist to turnover ratio 2 years ago and last year his free throw percentage? I watched the Utah game with a friend who charted defensive assignments and the amount of made buckets against Jose vs misses, steals, blocks was atrocious...far and away the worst of the team and he didn't score a lot of points to counter his crappiness on D. A lot of his charts look like that for this season, and have for seasons in the past. His rep for poor D is well deserved and will in my opinion haunt him for a long time with respect to overall league appreciation including for allstar.

11-23-2009, 04:15 PM	#9 (permalink)
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! adoring his baby girl. Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Canada eh? Posts: 3,278 Representing:	In other words i'm saying he was as good as you think

11-23-2009, 04:39 PM	#10 (permalink)
gochi wtf i dont rep that flag! Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 71 Representing:	if jose continues to play the way he is, i think, at best, he is a backup pg or 6th man. Yet, he is being paid like a starter.

11-23-2009, 04:47 PM	#11 (permalink)
halphbreedballer Waiting for DD's 1st in game wind mill Dunk Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: T.O. Posts: 4,879 Representing:	Screw all this Jose getting tired shit! It's time for this team to have a gut check play hard or get less minutes!!

11-23-2009, 06:23 PM	#14 (permalink)
raptor123 a Piston Fan ! Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 2,242 Representing:	Again alot more bullshit about Jose. Guys get over it. Jose is still a top tier pg. The question should be asked whether Hedo should have the ball in his hands more then Jose. Hedo is our worst defender not Jose. Jose has out played some of the top pgs so far this year. Yet he gets no respect from his raptor fans. When Jose blows past his man and takes the ball to the rim do we come on here and talk about that. Jack is not the answer also as our point guard.Jack is getting his minutes because he was promised before he signed. Thats my biggest concern , are we going lose games just to have Javck get his minutes.Jack has only played one good game and I hate to burst everyones buble but Jack is no better at d then Jose.

11-23-2009, 06:48 PM	#18 (permalink)
raptor123 a Piston Fan ! Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 2,242 Representing:	We keep on hearing about Jack and his confidence. I am getting sick and tired hearing Leo , Devlin and Jack saying the Jarret Jack is showing signs he could be breaking out. Shit must have heard this for 13 games lol.They will never sit Jack or just play him solely as Joses back up. If Jack plays more we lose. Its already been noted in a previous post that when Jack is on the floor our d is at our worst and when hes on with Jose we are really weak. Jack must get his 20 mins at the 1 thats it because he can't shoot. If Jack can't accept that they we kick his ass out of town just like we did with TJ.