UPDATE: Toronto - Jermaine O'Neal is a Raptor

The MVP of West Hollywood · 06-24-2008, 01:15 AM

I'll be watching my computer closely the next couple days, believe me

KirHarold · 06-24-2008, 01:17 AM

I just can't wait until it says-Breaking News:JO to the Raps.

Superjudge · 06-24-2008, 08:40 AM

http://www.athleticadvisor.com/Injur...l_injuries.htm

For you guys.

Read, educate yourselves.

Then form educated opinions.

If you still think he is a massive liability, I respect that, but know all the facts first.

Love you all my little Jackals!

Dr. J. Naismith · 06-24-2008, 12:26 PM

An interesting perspective from the other side from Indiana Star writer Mike Wells:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Wells

“The Pacers need to make the best deal for him before or during the draft. A healthy JO is a big IF and its time to part ways. A draft pick and two expiring contracts is enough to do it and Ford is the bonus”

“The Pacers should not let this one get away. Not too many teams out there are willing to take on J.O.'s contract. Besides, it's about time they part ways.”

“Assuming the Pacers can get the 1st Rounder thrown in, they should pull the trigger without hesitation. O'Neal is a great guy, and was a great player (and maybe will be one again) a few years ago, but he has to go now, and the sooner the better.”

“Bird should pull the trigger. O'neal doesn't make a secret of the fact that he doesn't like Bird ("Me and Bird don't see eye to eye," he said). He has publicly questioned Bird's ability as GM. Who knows what he has said privately about Obie to teamates? That kind of attitude is poison in the locker room, ESPECIALLY from a team captain.”

“O'neal has constantly said he doesn't want to be part of a rebuilding project. Yet he complains and blames management for being unable to bring in free agent talent, even though that it is his own oversized contract takes up a third of the payroll. The Pacers will be better off without him.”

“I say do the trade …I think Ford is just who the Pacers need.”

Source - Click here

KirHarold · 06-24-2008, 12:30 PM

*Crosses fingers* I hope Bird has read this.

jeffb · 06-24-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. J. Naismith

An interesting perspective from the other side from Indiana Star writer Mike Wells:

Source - Click here

After reading that i really really don't want him.We need to move on to something else

Dr. J. Naismith · 06-24-2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

After reading that i really really don't want him.We need to move on to something else

Come'on jeff... you've been complaining 2 days now about not wanting us to acquire O'Neal, so I hardly think that article really made any difference at all.

**Adequate Swag** · 06-24-2008, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

After reading that i really really don't want him.We need to move on to something else

C'mon seriously? You're going to let Pacers fans dictate your opinion on trades?

The Pacers (meaning the organization, as well as it's fans and media members) want him gone for 2 reasons:

1) He's the last tie to their "glory" days, and the team would like to start fresh (media & fans)

2) He's making 20 mill, and you can't rebuild (as I said, they want to start fresh) with a 20 million dollar contract on your roster, especially if he is no longer the MVP-type player he was when he signed the deal (the organization)

The Raptors, on the other hand, are on the brink of contending, can easily afford him, and have no interest in blowing up the roster and starting fresh.

So, you see, it is possible for both sides to like the deal.

Also, you're looking at it in a bit of a one sided manner. The fellow who penned that article (and many other Indy area media/bloggers) LOVE the idea of bringing in TJ. So by your logic, should we hang onto him?

Different situations dictate different reactions. There is no universal consensus, especially when an exchange such as this is involved.

The last place you should be getting your Jermaine O Neal opinions from is an Indy based source. They're bitter that he never became their new franchise guy, and they're bitter that he missed extensive time after signing a huge deal.

It would be like a fan from New jersey saying, "I know we're not giving up much, but the fans in Toronto absolutely hate this Vince Carter guy. We should probably just hang onto Aaron and Eric Williams"

Dr. J. Naismith · 06-24-2008, 02:31 PM

Even Bird is downplaying the trade speculation of O'Neal to Toronto.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indiana Star

Pacers president of basketball operations Larry Bird has downplayed rumors of a trade with the Raptors that involves both Jermaine O'Neal and T.J. Ford, according to The Indianapolis Star.

"We have talked to a number of teams, but to speculate on trades right now, obviously we’re getting close to the draft right now," Bird said Tuesday at his predraft press conference. "There are a lot of things we’re doing; it’s all speculation right now."

Various newspapers reported that the Pacers and the Raptors have discussed a possible deal to send Jermaine O’Neal to Toronto for T.J. Ford, Rasho Nesterovic and possibly the Raptors’ first-round pick (No. 17).

**•LX•** · 06-24-2008, 02:34 PM

Pacers fans and media cannot be happy with what they have paid out for nothing already. Toronto risks one year, after which the big expiring contract becomes a big trade asset, so even in a worst case scenario, Toronto does not suffer the kind of pain anyone in Indy has, and they potentially get much more value for the guy at the end of it all.

**Adequate Swag** · 06-24-2008, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. J. Naismith

Even Bird is downplaying the trade speculation of O'Neal to Toronto.

All front office types will be downplaying everything until the minute it happens.

If Bird were to say "Yeah, we're really interested in this Ford deal", then there go any other offers

BC would say the same thing. It's all about driving up the asking price.

Remember...the Garnett and Allen to Boston talk was downplayed last summer. Everyone knew they were getting moved though, and look what happened.

Same thing with JO and TJ. They're both getting moved, and everyone knows that, so the best business move from a front office standpoint is to let the rumours come out, and then deny deny deny. That'll keep the offers coming in right up until Toronto picks on Thursday night.

jeffb · 06-24-2008, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag

C'mon seriously? You're going to let Pacers fans dictate your opinion on trades?

The Pacers (meaning the organization, as well as it's fans and media members) want him gone for 2 reasons:

1) He's the last tie to their "glory" days, and the team would like to start fresh (media & fans)

2) He's making 20 mill, and you can't rebuild (as I said, they want to start fresh) with a 20 million dollar contract on your roster, especially if he is no longer the MVP-type player he was when he signed the deal (the organization)

The Raptors, on the other hand, are on the brink of contending, can easily afford him, and have no interest in blowing up the roster and starting fresh.

So, you see, it is possible for both sides to like the deal.

Also, you're looking at it in a bit of a one sided manner. The fellow who penned that article (and many other Indy area media/bloggers) LOVE the idea of bringing in TJ. So by your logic, should we hang onto him?

Different situations dictate different reactions. There is no universal consensus, especially when an exchange such as this is involved.

The last place you should be getting your Jermaine O Neal opinions from is an Indy based source. They're bitter that he never became their new franchise guy, and they're bitter that he missed extensive time after signing a huge deal.

It would be like a fan from New jersey saying, "I know we're not giving up much, but the fans in Toronto absolutely hate this Vince Carter guy. We should probably just hang onto Aaron and Eric Williams"

Dude, my opinion of this trade has been clear from the begining! It's a bad idea IMO!

**Adequate Swag** · 06-24-2008, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

Dude, my opinion of this trade has been clear from the begining!

Yes, and backing it up by referencing an opinion piece by an Indianapolis columnist makes your case seem pretty weak.

Your original argument revolved around his injury concerns, and now you point to an article from an columnist in Indy that brings absolutely no new information to light and say "now I really dont want him"

That reasoning is bogus

jeffb · 06-24-2008, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag

All front office types will be downplaying everything until the minute it happens.

If Bird were to say "Yeah, we're really interested in this Ford deal", then there go any other offers

BC would say the same thing. It's all about driving up the asking price.

Remember...the Garnett and Allen to Boston talk was downplayed last summer. Everyone knew they were getting moved though, and look what happened.

Same thing with JO and TJ. They're both getting moved, and everyone knows that, so the best business move from a front office standpoint is to let the rumours come out, and then deny deny deny. That'll keep the offers coming in right up until Toronto picks on Thursday night.

We don't know that JO is getting moved? He's been rumored for the last 2-3 years to be on the move and he's still a Pacer. Why?His salary/injury woes!!We may be the only ones dumb enough to take him.

**Adequate Swag** · 06-24-2008, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

We don't know that JO is getting moved? He's been rumored for the last 2-3 years to be on the and he's still a Pacer. Why?His salary/injury woes!!We may be the only ones dumb enough to take him.

You're welcome to think that. But why would you be sure about TJ and not JO?

Garnett was rumoured to be moved every year too. And guess what? Everyone and their brothers knew last summer that it was going to happen.

Jermaine O Neal will be moved, even if Indiana ends up having to take pennies on the dollar for him, which I doubt they will.

**•LX•** · 06-24-2008, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

We don't know that JO is getting moved? He's been rumored for the last 2-3 years to be on the and he's still a Pacer. Why?His salary/injury woes!!We may be the only ones dumb enough to take him.

And his contract. His injury might not be as much of a risk and the contract is not as scary as it was even a season earlier.

Dr. J. Naismith · 06-24-2008, 03:12 PM

Hmmm ... take it for what its worth ... its coming from Hoopsworld.com.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoopsworld

Adding a Player to the O'Neal Deal: Apparently the Pacers may need to add someone to the rumored Jermaine O'Neal for T.J. Ford and Rasho Nesterovic deal, and the Raptors would like that someone to have an expiring contract. Who could it be that would help get the deal done?

Indy really only has one player who could qualify and that's restricted free agent center David Harrison. His cap number for 07-08 is $1.7 million and if the Raptors wanted to they could renounce him as a free agent, taking a hold of their 08-09 cap number. They have little use for Harrison, especially if they are adding O'Neal, and he hasn't shown enough in his NBA career to warrant any kind of big extension.

Source - Click here

jeffb · 06-24-2008, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag

You're welcome to think that. But why would you be sure about TJ and not JO?

Garnett was rumoured to be moved every year too. And guess what? Everyone and their brothers knew last summer that it was going to happen.

Jermaine O Neal will be moved, even if Indiana ends up having to take pennies on the dollar for him, which I doubt they will.

I'm sure T.J will be moved because of the PG situation and his contract for 8 million dollars is insured!Much easier to get rid of T.J IMO.

Kuzzy · 06-24-2008, 04:58 PM

relax you little kittens.
we'll find out thursday!

The MVP of West Hollywood · 06-24-2008, 06:08 PM

Even PTI was talking about this

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06-24-2008, 01:15 AM	#121 (permalink)
The MVP of West Hollywood is it's so cold in the d Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 3,148 Representing:	I'll be watching my computer closely the next couple days, believe me

06-24-2008, 01:17 AM	#122 (permalink)
KirHarold is alive inside. Amir Johnson! Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,660 Representing:	I just can't wait until it says-Breaking News:JO to the Raps.

06-24-2008, 08:40 AM	#123 (permalink)
Superjudge is a Genius Meter. You're a bad guy Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: I live in Toronto. Posts: 7,371 Representing:	http://www.athleticadvisor.com/Injur...l_injuries.htm For you guys. Read, educate yourselves. Then form educated opinions. If you still think he is a massive liability, I respect that, but know all the facts first. Love you all my little Jackals!

06-24-2008, 12:30 PM	#125 (permalink)
KirHarold is alive inside. Amir Johnson! Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,660 Representing:	Crosses fingers I hope Bird has read this.

06-24-2008, 02:34 PM	#130 (permalink)
•LX• is doing the laundry in his mind, and pocketing all the change he finds In the Paint Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 8,139 Representing:	Pacers fans and media cannot be happy with what they have paid out for nothing already. Toronto risks one year, after which the big expiring contract becomes a big trade asset, so even in a worst case scenario, Toronto does not suffer the kind of pain anyone in Indy has, and they potentially get much more value for the guy at the end of it all.

06-24-2008, 04:58 PM	#139 (permalink)
Kuzzy is a disappointed raptors fan. Say NO to J.O ! Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: toronto Posts: 1,597 Representing:	relax you little kittens. we'll find out thursday!

06-24-2008, 06:08 PM	#140 (permalink)
The MVP of West Hollywood is it's so cold in the d Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 3,148 Representing:	Even PTI was talking about this