Truth behind Chris Bosh’s rebounding numbers
Old 12-14-2009, 06:02 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Truth behind Chris Bosh’s rebounding numbers

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Without digging too deeply into the numbers, looks like this: despite being tied for the most boards, Bosh doesn't have the greatest offensive rebounding percentage; when it comes to extending a possession, he's a tad behind the four players immediately behind him on the offensive rebounding chart.



Why does this matter? Offensive Rebounding Percentage is what's known as a rate statistic: it measures the rate at which Bosh (and Randolph and Bargnani) grab rebounds. Essentially, it helps add context to the stats.



For instance, just looking at the leaderboard shows that Bosh is on top. It doesn't show that he's played over 100 more minutes or 100 more potential rebounds to grab this season than the other four.



And what does it prove? When you consider what his offensive boards mean to the team's offensive rebounding percentage, his numbers don't seem too bad - Bosh is in the top 10 for the NBA, I'd imagine - but they're not as good as they seem, either.



It's true he's a good rebounder. He's grabbed more off the offensive glass than almost anybody else, no easy feat.



But is he the best rebounder in the NBA? He's not far off, but he's not there either. In fact, he might actually be the second-best rebounder on his team.

LINK - The Good Point
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Second best on his team? I'm not following that one.

Anyway, as much as his numbers might get skewed a little beneficially against other beasts in the league, they also skew downward in comparing his own numbers from previous seasons.
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:16 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:17 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I wouldn't expect Bosh to get as many offensive boards as other guys because he shoots that mid-range jumper so often that he isn't in position to get the board.

So the very fact he has so many speaks volumes
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:22 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renihan_00 View Post
I wouldn't expect Bosh to get as many offensive boards as other guys because he shoots that mid-range jumper so often that he isn't in position to get the board.

So the very fact he has so many speaks volumes
That's a nice way to put it. Sometimes I see Dwight Howard getting 2-3 offensive rebounds in 1 posession because he kept on getting his own misses. When your directly under the basket it is easier to rebound your own miss rather then someone elses miss.
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:22 PM   #6 (permalink)
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A few games in beginning of season he was dedicated to camping under offensive glass. Right now he is back to his usual "wait for the pass on the elbow".The former improves his team, the latter only pads his contract year scoring stat.
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Old 12-14-2009, 06:24 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Sorry, at the end of the day nothing is going to convince me that 12 RPG (3.7oreb) isn't enough.

A guy grabs a dozen boards a game and people are still complaining?
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Old 12-14-2009, 07:29 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I dunno that article really proved nothing to me. Especially ending it saying "bosh's production is no easy feat".

Yes Bosh's numbers may be inflated due to not have another true option on the floor but they are good.

Guys godda but this statisitcal overload to rest.
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Old 12-14-2009, 07:50 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Shifty.py View Post
A few games in beginning of season he was dedicated to camping under offensive glass. Right now he is back to his usual "wait for the pass on the elbow".The former improves his team, the latter only pads his contract year scoring stat.
Last week he had something like 21 offensive boards over three games. How do you explain that?
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Old 12-14-2009, 08:03 PM   #10 (permalink)
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For instance, just looking at the leaderboard shows that Bosh is on top. It doesn't show that he's played over 100 more minutes or 100 more potential rebounds to grab this season than the other four.
WTF is that guy talking about? It matters how many minutes per game he plays... Gerald Wallace averages 5 more minutes a game than Bosh. Bosh plays 1 more minute than 2nd place howard and 4th place Noah. He plays 1 less minute than 5th place Carlos Boozer.

NBA.com:

Bosh's rebounds per 40 is 3rd best in the league still lol.
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Old 12-14-2009, 08:09 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Way too much over-analysis, Bosh is the best rebounder in the NBA presently, plain and simple. I guess some people have never heard of the KISS principle, (keep it simple stupid).
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Old 12-14-2009, 08:28 PM   #12 (permalink)
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The other side of the coin of those extra minutes, is the tough schedule that he's fought through.

Here's the funny thing - Al Jefferson doesn't play close to a full season but has averages that people consider to be on par to Bosh. To me - that is far more inaccurate of a reading. Still numbers are just numbers when you get down to it.
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Old 12-14-2009, 09:12 PM   #13 (permalink)
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With Table D, I'd enjoy seeing these results, as Bmats7 was suggesting subject to the amount of playing time these players have, which he alludes to. As well, I'd enjoy a further statistic showing points scored off these offensive rebounds, and to extend that analysis slightly further, whether or not the game was won or not. In fact, this is hardly over analyzing, the statistical results are definitely exposed to omitted variable bias.

I've never seen Bosh as an offensive rebounder, primarily because of the amount of shots he takes, and where he takes those from. However, on the defensive end his stats are definitely inflated. He gets quite a few uncontested rebounds; pull downs from missed shots after the team has retreated back. However, other players are guilty of that too, which is why my interest in Bosh is more so the impact his rebounds have on the team - whether or not they result in points or not. Otherwise, and this goes for any player in the NBA, the rebound was pretty useless whether offensive or defensive.

It's an interesting look, and delves a little deeper (not much) than searching the player up on NBA.com and stating his stats.
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Old 12-14-2009, 09:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Bosh is an incredible rebounder. Somebody said on this forum earlier that he's the best rebounder they've seen since Rodman.

Which is ridiculous.

But with his play this year, it's surprising that their aren't more internet "raptor" fans making comparisons like that rather that spouting the usual "only grabs uncontested rebounds" garbage.

I wonder how many people notice how good Bosh has become at tipping the ball to himself and his teammates. Tipping the ball off the backboard to himself. He has his moments where he gets beat by another player, like everyone. But his actual skill on the glass is becoming that of a wiley veteran. He's real good.
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Old 12-14-2009, 09:26 PM   #15 (permalink)
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If you look at what Bosh brings versus who is considered the #1 big man in the league Howard. Teams are beginning to expose Orlando #1 weakness which is Howard. While a dominating big man he can be nuetralized just by fouling him. Forcing him to the line where his shooting percentage is terrible. He loses his concentration and trys to force the issue. Bosh on the other hand is excellent while not a top 5 player definitely a top 10. Almost every player has a weakness Bosh isn't perfect but he is very very good.

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Old 12-14-2009, 09:35 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Lao Wai View Post
If you look at what Bosh brings versus who is considered the #1 big man in the league Howard. Teams are beginning to expose Orlando #1 weakness which is Howard. While a dominating big man he can be nuetralized just by fouling him. Forcing him to the line where his shooting percentage is terrible. He loses his concentration and trys to force the issue. Bosh on the other hand is excellent while not a top 5 player definitely a top 10. Almost every player has a weakness Bosh isn't perfect but he is very very good.

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Old 12-15-2009, 03:42 AM   #17 (permalink)
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If I understud correctly the writer is trying to say that Amir might be better rebounder than Bosh because he grabs offensive rebounds with better %. Thats just silly. These two guys have totally different roles. One is a guy who playes a lot, has a lot of responsibility offensively, and cant afford to take stupid fouls climbing on people on offensive class. The other guy is a role player who is in the game just to bring hustle and grab rebounds. He rarely takes shots himself, which leaves him more opportunities to concentrate on going for the rebounds in offensive end.

Dont get me wrong, its nice to have guys like Amir, but the offensive rebounding percentage should only be compared between guys that have similar roles in offense and in the game in general.

I dont know if Bosh is the best rebounder in the league, but he certainly is pretty damn good and Im really happy he has elevated his play from last years in that regard.
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Old 12-15-2009, 07:13 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Bosh is an incredible rebounder. Somebody said on this forum earlier that he's the best rebounder they've seen since Rodman.

Which is ridiculous.

But with his play this year, it's surprising that their aren't more internet "raptor" fans making comparisons like that rather that spouting the usual "only grabs uncontested rebounds" garbage.

I wonder how many people notice how good Bosh has become at tipping the ball to himself and his teammates. Tipping the ball off the backboard to himself. He has his moments where he gets beat by another player, like everyone. But his actual skill on the glass is becoming that of a wiley veteran. He's real good.
Good point. He has a fantastic touch with the tips or the one-handed floaters off the boards. It reminds me of the little bit I've seen of Russell. Of course that comparison isn't meant to equate the two, but still - very nice control.
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Old 12-15-2009, 08:52 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Really they were lucky beat Indy with them doing that if it hadn't been Vince having a great night.
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Old 12-15-2009, 09:55 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Bosh hits the glass nicely. I think his numbers are good. He doesn't affect the Offensive boards a whole lot though, so I know what the writer is saying, and I think it's fair. I'm with Bjjs on this one, Bosh is a great rebounder, but he's no Dennis Rodman.

Consider this though, what else did Rodman really have to do on the floor but look for ways to grab boards.
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