Thoughts on Bargnani - Page 3
Old 04-09-2011, 09:34 AM   #41 (permalink)
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It's really being overstated.... people need to stop embellishing things to justify their hate.

Yeah I get it, you don't like Bargnani, but he's not the sole defensive issue and he's certainly not the reason we're a losing club.

Say it as many times as you want each thread, but it actually discredits your opinion. Maybe I'm expecting too much when I ask for arguments based in reason, but I'm just tired of reading thread after thread filled with hatred and embellished points. Maybe it's my fault for logging in to RF too often....
You're an embellishment! The number of times I witnessed the horror justifies the amount of times I was inclined to overstate the obvious. Your comments are no less abstract. Don't be JT!
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Old 04-09-2011, 09:38 AM   #42 (permalink)
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I seem to notice everytime all the Bargs loyalists do is copy-and-paste each others' statements defending this SG. Quite frankly, I find it repetitive. "He's young", "Like it or not, he's this team's best player", "He's not injury-prone", "He's only going to get better"...etc How many times do we have to see the same arguments over and over??

While I agree that he shouldn't be the only one to feel the full brunt of many people, we're not talking about the team as a whole, we're talking about an individual here. Nevermind the passing, the steals, the assists and all that other crap. We just want him to grab (offensive/defensive) boards. But I guess for someone who's earning $38 million that's just too much to ask.
I suppose we could say the same for the haters :"No effort No rebounding..."
Maybe is about time to pass to another thread
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Old 04-09-2011, 10:08 AM   #43 (permalink)
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You're an embellishment! The number of times I witnessed the horror justifies the amount of times I was inclined to overstate the obvious. Your comments are no less abstract. Don't be JT!
I'm an embellishment? Don't be JT? Since when did you become Stephen A. Smith?

My comments were meant to be abstract..... I apologize for bringing some brevity to the discussion. lol
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Old 04-09-2011, 04:04 PM   #44 (permalink)
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It's been a while...

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Old 04-09-2011, 04:33 PM   #45 (permalink)
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All he has to do is feign like he's trying, eventually it will become a habit and baddabing baddaboom. hah!

Really though, I'd like to see him come off the bench as a situational scorer if his effort isn't consistently there, but we all know if we take this step it will shatter him. I like him as a player and think a lot of teams would benefit from his skill set as a C coming off the bench. The way I see it, he's like one of those old union workers, too much seniority, not enough effort.
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Old 04-10-2011, 09:52 AM   #46 (permalink)
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All he has to do is feign like he's trying, eventually it will become a habit and baddabing baddaboom. hah!

Really though, I'd like to see him come off the bench as a situational scorer if his effort isn't consistently there, but we all know if we take this step it will shatter him. I like him as a player and think a lot of teams would benefit from his skill set as a C coming off the bench. The way I see it, he's like one of those old union workers, too much seniority, not enough effort.
I like your analogy above ...

Carp ... As you probably know, I've always been a Bargs supporter, but his lack of demonstrated hustle continues to be his downfall.
The question I ask anyone that I work with or participate on a team ... if someone put a million dollars in front of you as a reward (all or nothing), could you of done more when looking back? If the answer is yes .... reflect and improve. It's not clear if Bargs takes his weaknesses to heart ..

If he continues playing the way he does, 6th man is his place in the NBA. A championship team needs way more grit than what he shows.

I hope he has a switch in his head, but he's probably just lazy and lacks the motivation to the be best he can be ... it's a shame frankly. That's not uncommon for people with great natural gifts.

Give Evans 40% of Bargs talent and we would be off to the races with a solid center.
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Old 04-10-2011, 09:58 AM   #47 (permalink)
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I like your analogy above ...

Carp ... As you probably know, I've always been a Bargs supporter, but his lack of demonstrated hustle continues to be his downfall.
The question I ask anyone that I work with or participate on a team ... if someone put a million dollars in front of you as a reward (all or nothing), could you of done more when looking back? If the answer is yes .... reflect and improve. It's not clear if Bargs takes his weaknesses to heart ..

If he continues playing the way he does, 6th man is his place in the NBA. A championship team needs way more grit than what he shows.

I hope he has a switch in his head, but he's probably just lazy and lacks the motivation to the be best he can be ... it's a shame frankly. That's not uncommon for people with great natural gifts.

Give Evans 40% of Bargs talent and we would be off to the races with a solid center.
Give Evans Bargnani's 7foot frame and your looking at bill russell 2.0
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Old 04-10-2011, 10:35 AM   #48 (permalink)
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i say give Bargnani one more year. but use him a a completely different way depending on what team raps are playing. right now, the core of 3 pfs (davis, amir and bargnani) and hopefully get another true centre (doesnt' have to be the best centre alive, but good enough) and rotate them accordingly. try to play Bargnani off the bench at times when playing teams that are good in scoring in the paint. maybe start him when facing a team with a lot of shooters.

if this doesn't work, time to let him go. it's not like the raps are goign to be competing for anyhting next year, so who cares.
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Old 04-10-2011, 10:39 AM   #49 (permalink)
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i say give Bargnani one more year. but use him a a completely different way depending on what team raps are playing. right now, the core of 3 pfs (davis, amir and bargnani) and hopefully get another true centre (doesnt' have to be the best centre alive, but good enough) and rotate them accordingly. try to play Bargnani off the bench at times when playing teams that are good in scoring in the paint. maybe start him when facing a team with a lot of shooters.

if this doesn't work, time to let him go. it's not like the raps are goign to be competing for anyhting next year, so who cares.
No, I'm tired of giving Bargnani one more year. He says he will improve rebounding and defense every year but it just gets worst. He is a lose cause.
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Old 04-10-2011, 11:18 AM   #50 (permalink)
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I think that is impossible to judge correctly Andrea's season. In Italian and European culture we can't conceive to lose always thinking to draft and next years, we are used to play and fight for a title, for relegation, for fans... not for something asbtract and virtual. Andrea has played 82 friendly matches. In Nba if you lose nobody cares, in Europe you find funs under your window shouting against you. If you win, good; if you lose, good. This in inadmissible and incomprehensible for us.

Last year, Raptors were fighting for a playoff spot. If you remember, Andrea has been crucial in some matches with blocks in the final and defense. Now he is playing without aims, stimulus, and this fact has repercussions on his game. This is unconscious, it is a cultural fact.

Sorry for bad English.
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Old 04-10-2011, 11:33 AM   #51 (permalink)
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One thing about Bargs that continues to be over looked beyond his lack of effort and hustle (rebounding and defense) is how his offensive skills translate and effect the rest of the team. Even functioning at a 100%, the pace of his play, how he holds on to the ball, his vision at the high post, stifle this team. Not to mention where on the court he likes to receive the ball and instigate play are out of sink. He rarely plays with his back to the basket or fights for position under the rim. In so doing he puts his teammates at a disadvantage for position and spacing ie. Belli, Hedo, Klieza. I can't watch another year of a C walking around the perimeter, never rushing the lanes for rebounds and getting beat in transition even though he has bullied his way into the safety position at the top of the arc. Not to mention He has terrible hands most notably when he is on the move. Its not just his lack of effort that's burdening this team, its the fact that we have to bend and shape the rest of positions to make his role effective.
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Old 04-10-2011, 12:54 PM   #52 (permalink)
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The question is why has AB floundered in all aspects of the game except offence?

There has to be a reason? Or is he just lazy?

P.S. Jose needs to be traded too (LOL)
Jose needs to be traded way harder then bargs.....the guy is still suffering hamstring injurys that have not been lingering for 2 YEARS...... The guy cant play an entire season with starters minutes....and i doubt he can handle an entire season in a backup role.......Jose, you gotta go!
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Old 04-10-2011, 02:14 PM   #53 (permalink)
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No, I'm tired of giving Bargnani one more year. He says he will improve rebounding and defense every year but it just gets worst. He is a lose cause.
i do'nt mean give him a chance to improve his defence. i mean give him a chance to see if he can play off the bench, basically just use him for his offensive game
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Old 04-10-2011, 02:34 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Jose needs to be traded way harder then bargs.....the guy is still suffering hamstring injurys that have not been lingering for 2 YEARS...... The guy cant play an entire season with starters minutes....and i doubt he can handle an entire season in a backup role.......Jose, you gotta go!
I think Jose shines as a back up PG. He may just be the best back up PG in the league. If we don't draft a PG, then give Bayless the starting job and have Jose come off the bench.

He isn't durable but I still think we should keep him instead of trading him for worse players and contracts.

Jose is a true warrior and he wants to be here and he can be a good veteran leader for our young players.

On topic of bargnani:

Bargnani is good at one thing which is offense and right now I think Demar is getting better than him at that already. I can see Demar being our go to guy next season.
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Old 04-10-2011, 04:07 PM   #55 (permalink)
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so what was the problem last season?
hedo turkoglu
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Old 04-10-2011, 05:19 PM   #56 (permalink)
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One thing about Bargs that continues to be over looked beyond his lack of effort and hustle (rebounding and defense) is how his offensive skills translate and effect the rest of the team. Even functioning at a 100%, the pace of his play, how he holds on to the ball, his vision at the high post, stifle this team. Not to mention where on the court he likes to receive the ball and instigate play are out of sink. He rarely plays with his back to the basket or fights for position under the rim. In so doing he puts his teammates at a disadvantage for position and spacing ie. Belli, Hedo, Klieza. I can't watch another year of a C walking around the perimeter, never rushing the lanes for rebounds and getting beat in transition even though he has bullied his way into the safety position at the top of the arc. Not to mention He has terrible hands most notably when he is on the move. Its not just his lack of effort that's burdening this team, its the fact that we have to bend and shape the rest of positions to make his role effective.
Well said. I just want to watch basketball again.
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Old 04-10-2011, 05:39 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Bargnani is good at one thing which is offense and right now I think Demar is getting better than him at that already. I can see Demar being our go to guy next season.
Ya hes the go to guy for shows >15 feet......guys got no 3 game what so ever right now, and thats going to need to develop if hes going to be any kind of go to guy.
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Old 04-10-2011, 05:41 PM   #58 (permalink)
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I remember Jack Armstrong or somebody saying that Bargnani was something special and to be happy about this year. It seems our team tries harder when Bargnani isn't on the floor too
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Old 04-12-2011, 09:03 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by carp View Post
It's really being overstated.... people need to stop embellishing things to justify their hate.

Yeah I get it, you don't like Bargnani, but he's not the sole defensive issue and he's certainly not the reason we're a losing club.

Say it as many times as you want each thread, but it actually discredits your opinion. Maybe I'm expecting too much when I ask for arguments based in reason, but I'm just tired of reading thread after thread filled with hatred and embellished points. Maybe it's my fault for logging in to RF too often....
I understand where you're coming from. believe or not, i'm just as tired seeing yet-another anti-bargnani thread. but he's our captain now. he's suppose to LEAD. how is he leading if he's holding himself back? and for what? i've also said before, he's not entirely at fault that things are like this. we have several more guys in there who aren't doing everything they can to win.
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Old 04-12-2011, 09:05 PM   #60 (permalink)
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I understand where you're coming from. believe or not, i'm just as tired seeing yet-another anti-bargnani thread. but he's our captain now. he's suppose to LEAD. how is he leading if he's holding himself back? and for what? i've also said before, he's not entirely at fault that things are like this. we have several more guys in there who aren't doing everything they can to win.
Like who?
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