Slam online: Raptors resurgence - Page 6
Old 01-10-2014, 12:22 AM   #101 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummond so people stop whining

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to be honest, the way the knicks and nets are playing, even winning the division is far from granted. Knicks just beat miami, after winning on the road in SAS and Dallas and almost beating Houston in the process as well. Nets have won in OKC and against GSW and their vets are finally showing some life. Saturday game will be huge and luckily we'll be catching an old team on a B2B. Combined, in the past 3 weeks, raps/knicks/nets have beaten OKC twice, SAS, Miami, Indiana, Dallas twice and GSW. Looks like the Atlantic division may have the last laugh after all ...
Saturday's game is huge. The Nets are now in 2nd, 3.5gms back. I agree, it looks like the NY teams have awakened from their slumber.
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:52 AM   #102 (permalink)
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I think it's hilarious that some people didn't catch onto your sarcasm and thumbed you up and Kirby down for saying the same thing.

I know it's just people who disagree with the notion of tanking and are too stupid to actually debate, so they just thumb down.
I thought it was ridiculously obvious that I was being sarcastic.

That is quite true.
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Old 01-10-2014, 08:11 AM   #103 (permalink)
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Reading a little too far into it. I don't think the east sucks because I want the team to be bad, in fact its the opposite. I want the team to suck because the east sucks and I think a top 5 pick is more valuable to this team than a year of playoff experience, which is really what it comes down to. Its my opinion, you have yours and I am entitled to mine. But that's neither here nor there.

The implication in your post is that we are and will be a 50 win team. My stance is that we are neither one this year (closer to 45) and even less of one over the next 2 or 3 years, with the other teams around you improving at a faster rate than you. Detroit has massive cap room, Orlando, Boston, Milwaukee, and Philly will all be adding top picks and/or injured players back to their roster. Their current players will improve, as will ours. The difference is those teams are making changes by adding better players to their roster, rather than only improving the ones they have. We currently do not have the option to add any such players without losing a significant chunk of the core.

Take the Miami Heat and put them in the NCAA. They likely go undefeated. Put them in a season's worth of games vs the 80s "Jordan Rules" Pistons and they might win 50. Does it mean the Heat are worse? No, it just means the teams around them improved.

Bottom line: You think the Raptors win total will improve over the next few years as the team grows internally, I think it will decline as the competition improves league-wide and other teams improve in a multitude of ways.
You just confirmed all of LX's points. I think the teams win total will improve over the next few years as the team grows internally and improves in a multitude of ways. Being better this year doesn't take mean that Ujiri won't make other moves to improve the team in next couple of years.
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Old 01-10-2014, 08:25 AM   #104 (permalink)
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You just confirmed all of LX's points. I think the teams win total will improve over the next few years as the team grows internally and improves in a multitude of ways. Being better this year doesn't take mean that Ujiri won't make other moves to improve the team in next couple of years.
But our only real option to improve externally until two seasons from now is through trades and 18-22 draft picks. Until then we're stuck with internal growth.

Last edited by KoolAid; 01-10-2014 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 01-10-2014, 08:55 AM   #105 (permalink)
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But our only real option to improve externally until two seasons from now is through trades and 18-22 draft picks. Until then we're stuck with internal growth.
We get internal growth AND trades and draft picks. We're not STUCK with internal growth only for the next two years. You're not making sense.
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Old 01-10-2014, 09:16 AM   #106 (permalink)
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But our only real option to improve externally until two seasons from now is through trades and 18-22 draft picks. Until then we're stuck with internal growth.
This summer we will have no flexibility and will probably lose some of the bench, but hopefully a good draft pick (well chosen, I mean, not highly placed) and maybe a smart trade can keep the team competitive next season. After that, the summer after we could have all the starters plus 2 draft picks locked in plus have max free agent cap space. Lots of ability to improve.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:47 AM   #107 (permalink)
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We get internal growth AND trades and draft picks. We're not STUCK with internal growth only for the next two years. You're not making sense.
My point is that its not very likely you get a rotation player with late picks. And while trades can make a difference possibly, the vast majority of the improvement will be from internal growth.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:34 AM   #108 (permalink)
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My point is that its not very likely you get a rotation player with late picks. And while trades can make a difference possibly, the vast majority of the improvement will be from internal growth.
History has proven this wrong so many times it's laughable.

But seeing how forward seeing you can be, what am I having for dinner next Wednesday?
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:47 AM   #109 (permalink)
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Slam is unreadable. Unless you actively use the street slang in your regular daily conversations. I had a year of free issues and started throwing them out after reading two issues. Sorry. But if the biggest compliment you can give a players is being "dope", then you have nothing to say.
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:29 PM   #110 (permalink)
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But our only real option to improve externally until two seasons from now is through trades and 18-22 draft picks. Until then we're stuck with internal growth.
You jumped all over my comment, not guarantee, about 50 wins, and suggested it was flawed due to not considering complicated formulas about other teams. But you failed to address my assertion about this team that would hold true regardless of any other external factors. If they play at a level of a top 5 defense they are going to have every chance of winning 50 games or more in any given season. Do you not agree with this? Of course there could be injuries or drop-offs for reasons beyond their control, but mostly an ingrained culture stressing defensive intensity is going to have a good amount of control over their ability to win a good load of games. And if a drop-off does happen, then they get a high pick, which will likely develop into a better player, more quickly, than otherwise, thanks to the foundational play that he will come into. Of course it will not be your magical draft, but could you not live with that anyways?

I have to say that i have asked you guys many questions to try to help me get a better understanding of what you expound, and i mostly just get the same looped messages in return. You insist on how stuck this team is and will be. Even if i give you that, two years does not seem like being terribly stuck. What seems most stuck is your thought patterns.
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:56 PM   #111 (permalink)
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We get internal growth AND trades and draft picks. We're not STUCK with internal growth only for the next two years. You're not making sense.

Some men you just can't reach...

Last edited by LX; 01-10-2014 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:09 PM   #112 (permalink)
and that's the bottom line, cause JV said so!!!

This is how U(jiri) do it
 
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Not easy to build a team through trades, our best bet is signing a few key FAs in the next two off seasons.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:11 PM   #113 (permalink)
doesn't care where LeBron plays. Or Melo.

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Not easy to build a team through trades, our best bet is signing a few key FAs in the next two off seasons.
Have you told this to Masai?
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:16 PM   #114 (permalink)
and that's the bottom line, cause JV said so!!!

This is how U(jiri) do it
 
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Have you told this to Masai?
Masai had Carmelo Anthony. This idea that Masai will simply wave his wand and turn us into a contender overnight, through a trade, is a false hope.

We don't have that asset to make such a move.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:18 PM   #115 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummond so people stop whining

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Masai had Carmelo Anthony. This idea that Masai will simply wave his wand and turn us into a contender overnight, through a trade, is a false hope.

We don't have that asset to make such a move.
Even the Carmelo trade didn't truely make them contenders. It made them a great regular season team, but i doubt many thought of them as a threat to get to the WC finals, let alone the finals.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:19 PM   #116 (permalink)
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Masai had Carmelo Anthony. This idea that Masai will simply wave his wand and turn us into a contender overnight, through a trade, is a false hope.

We don't have that asset to make such a move.
Your right, we went downhill so fast after he traded Rudy and Pasta.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:19 PM   #117 (permalink)
and that's the bottom line, cause JV said so!!!

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Exactly, built for the regular season, not for a seven game series against the top teams.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:21 PM   #118 (permalink)
and that's the bottom line, cause JV said so!!!

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Your right, we went downhill so fast after he traded Rudy and Pasta.
We went from terrible to the best of the worst from those two trades. We aren't a championship caliber team.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:40 PM   #119 (permalink)
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We went from terrible to the best of the worst from those two trades. We aren't a championship caliber team.
Didn't say we were championship calibre. That's not an overnight thing.

Those trades started to set us on the path. All the posters that advocated tanking seem to act like we can win an instant championship. Anything less and they're moaning: but, what if,we should, we have to, it won't work, on and on ad nauseum. They're the real fool's gold.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:28 PM   #120 (permalink)
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History has proven this wrong so many times it's laughable.

But seeing how forward seeing you can be, what am I having for dinner next Wednesday?
which part of "likely" you misundertood?
history totally proves him right, as evidenced in this historical chart:

NBA Draft Analysis -- Expected value of a pick

there's a 8% chance of drafting a star outside the lottery and a 15% chance of drafting a solid player. Role players and less don't count, since you can get those on the market easily (unless you are lucky to get a role player who can contribute at that level right away, so at least you save some money).

So there's about 75% chance of NOT drafting a solid player or better outside lottery, which qualifies as "likely" by most people's accounts.

As for drafting a superstar, try 0% (rounded down to the nearest integer).
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