Simmons' take on the Fields deal - Page 3
Old 07-22-2012, 10:17 PM   #41 (permalink)
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complaining about signing Fields for 6m a year is like complaining about buying that funnel cake at Wonderland. It was more than pricey at about 10 dollars, but where else are ya gonna get something like it?

Fields is a great signing. Besides, it won't break your pocket. 10 bucks is 10 bucks.
Where else are you going to find a Fields type player? Seriously? What is it that makes him that special in your eyes? If the Raps don't have a solid list of guys they wouldn't mind having at his level, and at a better price, then this team is truly hopeless. They didn't overpay this kid because they just had to have him now. Like right NOW! Gotta have a kid as special as all that before they can go any further. Must have funnel cake that can be vomited up after a few rides on the tilt-a-whirl! Fact is it is entirely possible that the acquisition complicates attempts to get the types of guys they need more immediately. They put too much stock in going after Nash. I hope they are just looking to buy some more time to get all the pieces together, and I hope they get lucky here with Fields. But it just narrows my focus all that much more critically as I look to see that plan we heard so much about being carried out.
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Old 07-22-2012, 10:32 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Why go after Fields?

1. Youth.

2. A knack for rebounding the ball.

3. Good bball IQ.

4. 2-way player.


When he was a rookie I liked him better than DD and thought that he brought more to the table on a game-to game basis... And if his play returns to what it was 2 seasons ago (which I think it will) I'm guessing that I'll prefer him over DD again.
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Old 07-22-2012, 10:47 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Kirby View Post
complaining about signing Fields for 6m a year is like complaining about buying that funnel cake at Wonderland. It was more than pricey at about 10 dollars, but where else are ya gonna get something like it?

Fields is a great signing. Besides, it won't break your pocket. 10 bucks is 10 bucks.
I disagree, even if you go by his rookie numbers, he's not a starter in this league, or at least he should not be. He is what he is, a role player and you can get guys like him fairly easy, no need to overpay him.

of course, that's my opinion, maybe bc/ed/casey are seeing more than meets the eye in him and he does fit our needs quite nicely. Assuming last year was an aberration (very likely - he's a guy who needs shots created for him and carmelo is not going to do that), he rebounds and shoots the 3 well and he's a decent defender (apparently he's pretty good against SFs and not so much against 2s).

He'll be a player the fanbase will love and I don't think it's a big mistake going after him. I'd rather overspend for a good fit than underspend for a stiff ... Of course, most of all, I'd rather pay a good fit market price or below.

Anyway, my point is that I really don't think we go after him if we didn't desperately want nash. We may have tried a don quijote move signing him to a 15 million contract with a large 3rd year amount, but Knicks would have matched that (I think).
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:08 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
Why go after Fields?

1. Youth.

2. A knack for rebounding the ball.

3. Good bball IQ.

4. 2-way player.


When he was a rookie I liked him better than DD and thought that he brought more to the table on a game-to game basis... And if his play returns to what it was 2 seasons ago (which I think it will) I'm guessing that I'll prefer him over DD again.
There's some merit to all that.

But now you have DD needing to realize potential, Ross needing to do something as a rookie to show some potential, Kleiza needing to return to form and realize potential to fill a bigger role than he's generally had, and Fields needing to return to the form where he showed some nice potential.

Oh the clarity. I really need more than that. Again, I can wait another year for clarity to emerge, and maybe there will be enough at the non-wing positions to buy some time. Amir, Ed, Bargnani and JV are almost a mirror image of the 4 smalls just mentioned though. Just please get beyond throwing shit against the wall and seeing what sticks, and then I'll feel much better. I don't like that sort of process at all.
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:28 PM   #45 (permalink)
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I am curious, LX. What would you have done with the money we used on Fields? Who would you have realistically targetted that

A) would've come for the same or lower pricetag and

B) would've had the same or better impact than Fields will?
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:40 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Brandon Rush is a better player than Fields and is likely going to get less money than him. We overpaid and gave too many years to Fields.

Same thing with Ronnie Brewer.

Last edited by Ball Don't Lie; 07-22-2012 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:47 PM   #47 (permalink)
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they ain't 24 years old. got dat yung vet.
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:50 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by thriller92 View Post
Brandon Rush is a better player than Fields and is likely going to get less money than him. We overpaid and gave too many years to Fields.

Same thing with Ronnie Brewer.
So role players. We weren't getting any game breakers with that money, so spending it on a guy who can contribute in multiple facets of the game was a smart decision. It just so happened that our guy was pretty coveted by his former team, so we had to hike up the price tag a little. Not a big deal.

But really, this argument is pretty pointless now. Landry is a Raptor. It's time to cheer for the big guy and hope he helps this team win ball games.
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Old 07-22-2012, 11:52 PM   #49 (permalink)
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I disagree, even if you go by his rookie numbers, he's not a starter in this league, or at least he should not be. He is what he is, a role player and you can get guys like him fairly easy, no need to overpay him.

of course, that's my opinion, maybe bc/ed/casey are seeing more than meets the eye in him and he does fit our needs quite nicely. Assuming last year was an aberration (very likely - he's a guy who needs shots created for him and carmelo is not going to do that), he rebounds and shoots the 3 well and he's a decent defender (apparently he's pretty good against SFs and not so much against 2s).

He'll be a player the fanbase will love and I don't think it's a big mistake going after him. I'd rather overspend for a good fit than underspend for a stiff ... Of course, most of all, I'd rather pay a good fit market price or below.

Anyway, my point is that I really don't think we go after him if we didn't desperately want nash. We may have tried a don quijote move signing him to a 15 million contract with a large 3rd year amount, but Knicks would have matched that (I think).
so you're gonna lock him up as a non-starter in this leagur after 2 years of play? one season playing with a team of morons?
He cuts really well to add the the strengths you posted. He still will improve, he's doing all of this at the age of 22-24. Obviously Nash had some reason do to with us choosing Fields, but we just robbed a huge chip from our division rival and it'll definitely help us. Look at NYK, they're crippled now with bucket heads like Melo, Amare, Smith, fat ass Felton, party harder than Turk J-Kidd, and Camby. The last 2 will be 40 soon.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:01 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Fields > DD.

Also, I really hope DD isn't extended for a $ 8 million/year type contract.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:12 AM   #51 (permalink)
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There's some merit to all that.

But now you have DD needing to realize potential, Ross needing to do something as a rookie to show some potential, Kleiza needing to return to form and realize potential to fill a bigger role than he's generally had, and Fields needing to return to the form where he showed some nice potential.

Oh the clarity. I really need more than that. Again, I can wait another year for clarity to emerge, and maybe there will be enough at the non-wing positions to buy some time. Amir, Ed, Bargnani and JV are almost a mirror image of the 4 smalls just mentioned though. Just please get beyond throwing shit against the wall and seeing what sticks, and then I'll feel much better. I don't like that sort of process at all.
regardless of the reasons, I think it's quite obvious that the starting 3 for the future is not on this team. Unless they are blind (regardless of public statements), DD and Ross are never going to be successful 3s in this league, and fields is a 6th man at best.

Our goal for the next 12 months is to get that top forward. For that, we can use one of demar/ross + one of amir/ed + cap space/expiring. All we need is a willing partner.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:15 AM   #52 (permalink)
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so you're gonna lock him up as a non-starter in this leagur after 2 years of play? one season playing with a team of morons?
He cuts really well to add the the strengths you posted. He still will improve, he's doing all of this at the age of 22-24. Obviously Nash had some reason do to with us choosing Fields, but we just robbed a huge chip from our division rival and it'll definitely help us. Look at NYK, they're crippled now with bucket heads like Melo, Amare, Smith, fat ass Felton, party harder than Turk J-Kidd, and Camby. The last 2 will be 40 soon.
yeah, because he had 6 years of experience college + nba and he has no physical tools to speak of. Some have compared him with battier, but shane has very long arms and is fairly big for a forward and has an exceptional bb iq. And was a better shooter.

And I wouldn't call taking their 5th or 6th best player "robbing them of a huge chip" ...
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:16 AM   #53 (permalink)
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Brandon Rush is a better player than Fields and is likely going to get less money than him. We overpaid and gave too many years to Fields.

Same thing with Ronnie Brewer.
3 years is minimum I think for RFAs I think, length is not the issue - size of contract is.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:27 AM   #54 (permalink)
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yeah, because he had 6 years of experience college + nba and he has no physical tools to speak of. Some have compared him with battier, but shane has very long arms and is fairly big for a forward and has an exceptional bb iq. And was a better shooter.

And I wouldn't call taking their 5th or 6th best player "robbing them of a huge chip" ...
Well, doesn't mean he can't improve. He did shoot 50/40/70 2 years ago so he was a pretty good shooter. Last year isn't indicative to me cus of Melo. The stats are there to show. Without Melo he was his rookie self (even as a soph when melo was out). With Melo, he was his lost self.

Btw considering their players and JR Smith starting at sg, all I can do is laugh. That team's gonna implode even harder than pre-Lin nyk from last year.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:55 AM   #55 (permalink)
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Fields > DD.
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:42 AM   #56 (permalink)
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I am curious, LX. What would you have done with the money we used on Fields? Who would you have realistically targetted that

A) would've come for the same or lower pricetag and

B) would've had the same or better impact than Fields will?
They didn't target Fields. They wanted to impact the Knicks ability to get Nash.

They weren't going to get much clarity or value in free agency. Like mm says, there needs to be a trade. The guys thriller mentioned would have had less impact on overall flexibility going forward at least. In any case, it's time for BC to do the heavy lifting now. He has to figure out what he wants to give up, what he can give up, and what he has to get back, and zero in on a nice sweet spot that gives this team a well-defined core.
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:53 AM   #57 (permalink)
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i'd just like to say that i agree with every post LX has made in this thread (preach on). The only thing that pisses me off even more is that on top of the off-putting appearance of why fields was signed (the whole Nash thing), the fact that plan A was throw a boat of money to a (almost) 40 year old PG. I mean that's just such a shitty looking plan if you ask me, and to throw all your eggs into that basket?

What happened to Colangelo tapping into the European leagues to find some diamonds? what happened to the good scouting? Does Gherardini still work here? this team pisses me off.

Last edited by fancylad; 07-23-2012 at 08:57 AM.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:01 AM   #58 (permalink)
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Are we still on the Nash argument? He would have been great for this franchise basketball-wise as well as marketing-wise.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:06 AM   #59 (permalink)
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Are we still on the Nash argument? He would have been great for this franchise basketball-wise as well as marketing-wise.
i only brought up nash because it directly ties in to how i feel about the fields signing. there's an obvious connection.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:53 AM   #60 (permalink)
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I remember Simmons was lobbying for an open GM job with the Wolves. LOL.
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