Report: Bargnani & Parker Offered for Okafor - Page 5
Old 02-22-2008, 03:43 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Imagine the Raps had drafted Pornstache or Thomas? Yikes!
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:47 PM   #82 (permalink)
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Imagine the Raps had drafted Pornstache or Thomas? Yikes!
Very true. Look at Chicago: they had just as good a chance at getting Roy and Aldridge as we did and they took Tyrus. Charlotte could have had Roy but they took 'Stash.

At least Bargnani is playing meaningful minutes for his team; neither of those guys are right now.

Portland made out from that draft like bandits.
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:51 PM   #83 (permalink)
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Not contradicting myself at all. I said that I thought he would develop into a very good player, but not a superstar. As for second guessing the pick, that's why you're a fan and not a GM.
lol does that mean since u dont second guess it your a GM not a fan?? lmao wtf

Im sure some GMs dont regret picks later on.... only fans do... damn what a silly statement, again.
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:52 PM   #84 (permalink)
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Imagine the Raps had drafted Pornstache or Thomas? Yikes!
i can proudly say that i always hated tyrus and knew he'd be a bust...
but i'm sad to admit how badly i wanted the 'stache.....
YIKES!
thank god we didnt draft him.
at least barg's best years are ahead of him... morrison's best years are 2-3 years ago in a zaga uni.
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Old 02-22-2008, 05:06 PM   #85 (permalink)
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lol does that mean since u dont second guess it your a GM not a fan?? lmao wtf

Im sure some GMs dont regret picks later on.... only fans do... damn what a silly statement, again.
What IS your problem with Colangelo? If you are indeed a Raptors fan - I'm not sure if you are or not, you should be line to kiss Bryan's feet for all the moves he's made to put the team where it is right now. He took the team from a bottom feeder to division champs in 1 year and has created the foundation for stability in the franchise for years to come.

Of course you're gonna second guess. That's what fans do. They second guess. Hindsight is 20-20. You don't know if Bargnani is going to develop into a star ofr not. You don't know if Brandon Roy's knee is going to turn into hamburger in 4 years. So, if you are indeed a Raptors fan, how about you just shut up and enjoy the ride of success we're having instead of bitching and moaning?
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Old 02-22-2008, 07:53 PM   #86 (permalink)
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What IS your problem with Colangelo? If you are indeed a Raptors fan - I'm not sure if you are or not, you should be line to kiss Bryan's feet for all the moves he's made to put the team where it is right now. He took the team from a bottom feeder to division champs in 1 year and has created the foundation for stability in the franchise for years to come.

Of course you're gonna second guess. That's what fans do. They second guess. Hindsight is 20-20. You don't know if Bargnani is going to develop into a star ofr not. You don't know if Brandon Roy's knee is going to turn into hamburger in 4 years. So, if you are indeed a Raptors fan, how about you just shut up and enjoy the ride of success we're having instead of bitching and moaning?
lol you can kiss his feet, and you can shut up. Im a Toronto sports fan i know all about overrating your team, leafs fan been doing it for 40 years. I have no problem with BC if you would read what i said, i think he is a fine GM, but it seems every raptor thinks he is a God, then what is Danny Ainge? or Joe Dumars, or Buford etc etc... This is what makes Americans hate on Raptors fans, they go on like every player we get that is average at best (think rasho, moon, delfino) is a great player. Every move BC makes is pure genius and we have the brightest future in the nba. You wanna look at bright futures? Think Portland, think atlanta, both teams with GMs you prob think couldnt wash BC's car have done a far better job getting a bigger core of young talent then we have. Again this isnt to say BC has done a terrible job, we are definately improved and heading the right way, but i think we are more then a "few" steps away to be real, we are many steps away and what BC does about it, will ultimately tell you what kind of GM he is.

Perhaps being a leaf fan has jaded me. But im a fan and a realist, and from what i see, we dont have this young and upcoming future championship calibre team by a long shot, we have 2 pieces that could be, Bosh and Calderon. Ill give you guys the benefit of the doubt and say Bargs could be, but you gotta give me the benefit and cant say he for sure is yet. Every1 else either underachieves (think rasho, barg, kapono and AP), are injury prone (ford, garbo) or just plain arent that good. I know its lovely to be a fan and think every player we get is great, i guess im just a pessimest by nature, take it how you want to take it.

Unless you pretty much have the best player in the world (which im sure even the homers can admit Bosh will never be), you cant win a championship without a serious inside presence, boards and post up abilitys... not to mention much better overall team defence.

I think Calderon and Bosh are awesome building blocks, but we could just as easily be one of those teams that makes the playoffs and never threatens to do anything if some serious changes arent made. Again, theres alot of $ coming off the books so the true judgement of BC can start then, for now i will say he is a good GM, but not the best, or remotely close.

BTW i like the good point made about the disadvantages Grunwald had in terms of MLS and the Canadian dollar strength at the time. I really dont know how you can argue this team is better then that one was, we literally had a top 5 player in the world at the time, big bodys to grab boards, still had great shooters and a deep bench.

Wasnt JP Riccardi some bigtime exec with all kinds of prestige and awards?? He was gonna save the Blue Jays?? Im not saying BC will end up like that cuz he doesnt have the disadvantages JP has, but every1 was kissing JPs ass for a few years like u guys kissing BC's...
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Old 02-22-2008, 07:56 PM   #87 (permalink)
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I still like JP
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:31 PM   #88 (permalink)
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JP was cheap that's why he came to the Jays. And trust me he was NOT highly regarded by many. He was just one of the few guys in Billy Beane's cabinent who became overrated. Trust me there was no prestige.

Secondly, the difference between the teams Colangelo has built and those of Grunwald is Grunwald handcuffed himself with the moves he made. He signed jyd, alvin et al to high priced long term deals. Yes, we were coming off a good year but he managed the cap incorrectly and it led us to the mess and subsequently the Babcock era. The one thing Colangelo has done, and successfully at that, is rebuild this team on cheap contracts that are incredibly cap friendly except for TJ Ford. However the contracts of Garbo, Parker, Delfino, Hump are all tradeable and more importantly they are seen as assets in the league, something we likely could not say during the Grunwald era (see what we got for Davis and JYD?)

Next, is in regards to draft picks and I'm gonna choose the year 1998. In 1998, we drafted Vince Carter. A great pick at that time. Up until 2001, we were the clear winners of the draft because as some would argue we drafted the most nba ready player at the time. However also chosen were Antwan Jamison, Dirk Nowitzki and Rashard Lewis all of whom have had arguably more successful careers then the one Vince Carter. Hell, I would argue, Dirk is the best player to come out of that draft. Now, how long did it take to see a clear cut winner or "best player" from the draft? About 6-8 years. That's how long it takes to see if a player is likely going to be labelled a bust or not.

So, as nice as Roy looks now and I admit he does. Will he look as good three years down the line? Are we assuming that a player like Bargnani will not learn his position (likely the most difficult position to learn, centre?) We can't be quick to jump the gun here, however antsy we may be.

I just don't see why we need to be seen as an NBA championship team just yet? It takes time. Oh, and by the way, when the Pistons in 2000 I believe traded for Ben Wallace and signed Chauncey Billups and traded for Corliss Williamson how many people saw that as the foundations of a championship team? Wallace had no offensive game, Billups was widely seen as a bust and Williamson was seen as the quintessential role player. However, with this foundation, Detroit has won a championship. It just shows you that maybe we should leave the talent judging to people who really understand it and make it their job. We can think we know what we're talking about, but if that was the case we'd be employed by an NBA team or at least think we're employed by one.
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:43 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Wicked Post CG...BRINGING THE FIYA.....

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but if that was the case we'd be employed by an NBA team or at least think we're employed by one
Does former caterer count??....
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:59 PM   #90 (permalink)
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Oh and I just realized that someone said that Atlanta has done a good job of amassing talent. That's quite laughable considering that the talent they have passed up is quite astounding in itslef. It has taken that team the better part of 10 years to become a contender for ONLY a playoff spot and collectively between the basketball IQ of Marvin Williams and Josh Smith and Josh Childress youmight as well be coaching a high school team IQ wise. But I guess people are impressed by the flashiness of numbers and dunks ahead of winning. That's ok. Sign me up for guys who can play and win at the same time.
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:59 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Wicked Post CG...BRINGING THE FIYA.....



Does former caterer count??....
Hmmmm.....no. :cheeky-smiley-013:
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Old 02-22-2008, 10:18 PM   #92 (permalink)
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I don't think aldridge is a very good player, he's more like a poor man's chris bosh, without the getting to the line part. I doubt he'll ever become an all-star contender, once oden starts playing, aldridge numbers will fall dramatically. He's already taken a step back from last year in many categories (fg%, rbs/40, blks/40 etc). And it's not like he had a very good rookie season to fall from. He's scoring 16 points on 14 shots, Bargnani is 10 on 9, which is pretty much the same number. Replace him with Andreea in their lineup, and I'm positive he would have 20 per game. Not a good 20, true - but nevertheless.
Roy's health concerns make him a big gamble, he looks good now, probably better than people anticipated, but there's a reason he fell so low in the draft.
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