Project Centres
Old 06-20-2011, 09:20 PM   #1 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,271
Representing:
Default Project Centres

How many times do "project" centres end up being at least starting NBA Centres? By project I mean guys in the draft who have good size and measurements at the 5 spot and are taken in the lottery based on their upside?

This is very important because we may end up drafting Valanciunas or Biyombo who are both projects.
fk24 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:24 PM   #2 (permalink)
useless

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,198
Representing:
Default

Basically all centers are projects when they are drafted.

D12, Bynum, Bogut, Gasol, etc, etc, etc.

A polished center with size happens very rarely, and with guys being drafted at 19 now it really doesn't happen any more.
EggsToTheBBQ is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:25 PM   #3 (permalink)
useless

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,198
Representing:
Default

...If you won't draft a project, then you won't draft a center.
EggsToTheBBQ is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
censored

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,356
Representing:
Default

it's not important at all. the only think that's important is the scouting department doing their jobs before they make that selection.

but

chandler, bynum, perkins, gasol and nene were all projects and the exact same type of player we need.
dfunkie1 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:32 PM   #5 (permalink)
10
...

Resident Mavs Fan
 
10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,232
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EggsToTheBBQ View Post
Basically all centers are projects when they are drafted.

D12, Bynum, Bogut, Gasol, etc, etc, etc.

A polished center with size happens very rarely, and with guys being drafted at 19 now it really doesn't happen any more.
Bogut was most certainly not a project center IMO when he came in.

Guy ravaged the NCAA in his sophomore year to the tune of 20+ pts, 12 boards, 3 ast and 2 blks.

Sweeped most player awards after that year too.

If he came into the league and immediately got to play under a guy like Skiles (Instead of Stotts and Krystwokwiak who shat on his development) he'd have reached this point 2-3 years ago.
10 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:43 PM   #6 (permalink)
useless

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,198
Representing:
Default

9 pts, 7 reb, & 0.8 blk rookie year = project.

11 pts, 4 reb, & 0.8 blk rookie year = rookie Bargs (project) in less minutes.
EggsToTheBBQ is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:44 PM   #7 (permalink)
is the baby faced assassin

Banned
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 81,104
Representing:
Default

I was just watching NBATV and they were talking about Bigs and they specifically said most preject Centers don't pan out. Now i don't know the numbers, but it just seems like there are a lot more Thabeets out there then there are Howard's. Which is why i'd rather draft a 1 or a 3 and get an experienced Center via trade or FA if at all possible. Does anyone really believe Alabi will ever pan out to be a good NBA player, a rotation player?
jeffb is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:45 PM   #8 (permalink)
useless

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,198
Representing:
Default

...And Dwight Howard actually had a solid rookie year.

I'm pretty sure he lined up at PF, though.
EggsToTheBBQ is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:51 PM   #9 (permalink)
useless

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,198
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffb View Post
I was just watching NBATV and they were talking about Bigs and they specifically said most preject Centers don't pan out. Now i don't know the numbers, but it just seems like there are a lot more Thabeets out there then there are Howard's. Which is why i'd rather draft a 1 or a 3 and get an experienced Center via trade or FA if at all possible. Does anyone really believe Alabi will ever pan out to be a good NBA player, a rotation player?
Centers who can step in and play starting roles just don't happen. It's like a couple of times a decade that happens, and if it does the guy goes #1 overall.

Like I said, if you won't draft projects, then you won't draft centers. You miss out on the Horfords, Gasols, Hibberts, etc. Those guys play crucial roles on their teams. I doubt we could trade anyone on our roster straight up for one of those guys. Their teams couldn't lose them.
EggsToTheBBQ is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:57 PM   #10 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 516
Representing:
Default

what would constitute as a 'PROJECT" in terms of production?

it's almost certain that centres will never average 15/10 or better in their rookie season. the days of Shaq, Ewing, Olajuwon, Robinson even Yao Ming are gone...

it also doesn't help that it's a guard dominated league where fast break points are key
SoGood is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 10:15 PM   #11 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 10,417
Representing:
Default

the problem with "project" centres are that many times they end up on a different team by the time they develop, because fans/media/gms/gm or coaching changes cause them to be traded ...

some centres have that unique combination of size and quickness which makes it clear from the start they're going to be studs and those will get picked with #1 picks. But most centres have big question marks and you can't be sure about them until late in their first rookie contract.
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 10:19 PM   #12 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 10,417
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffb View Post
I was just watching NBATV and they were talking about Bigs and they specifically said most preject Centers don't pan out. Now i don't know the numbers, but it just seems like there are a lot more Thabeets out there then there are Howard's. Which is why i'd rather draft a 1 or a 3 and get an experienced Center via trade or FA if at all possible. Does anyone really believe Alabi will ever pan out to be a good NBA player, a rotation player?
you will NEVER get a good centre in good health via trades, unless you trade a lot more in return, or they force a trade to your team (not going to happen in T.O.).

what you can do is take a flyer on a centre with an injury history and hope he'll turn out healthy. Which is also a crapshoot, just like the draft. JO was a monster defensively before the injuries, and he was a shadow after, Chandler had a ton of problems but recovered into a top defender. Camby at one time was the poster boy for injury-plagued centers and he's been in top health for years now.

I would welcome us signing oden to a short-term, high-dollar contract, it's a gamble I'm willing to take. But you'll see a majority of fans oppose such a move.
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 10:33 PM   #13 (permalink)
new, and shiny.

Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 434
Representing:
Default

Kwame Brown is just beginning to be a quality C. You can't draft projects that high; Thabeet is an excellent example. As an 8-12 spot pick, he would have been okay.

In my opinion, the first two to three spots should be reserved for impact guys who can instantly improve the team that's drafting them (who are usually bad).
cloudnine is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 10:44 PM   #14 (permalink)
wanting harrison barnes

Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 479
Representing:
Default

for C's to be good you need to hire a quality big man coach. look who bynum and howard had to work with, 2 hall of famers. if we draft a big guy, again, we need to put the cash into hiring a very proven big man coach.
komot is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 12:11 AM   #15 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 10,417
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cloudnine View Post
Kwame Brown is just beginning to be a quality C. You can't draft projects that high; Thabeet is an excellent example. As an 8-12 spot pick, he would have been okay.

In my opinion, the first two to three spots should be reserved for impact guys who can instantly improve the team that's drafting them (who are usually bad).
some players should just no be drafted at all, thabeet and araujo are two good examples ....
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 12:15 AM   #16 (permalink)
new, and shiny.

Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 434
Representing:
Default

Nobody would have cared if Thabeet and Araujo had gone in the teens or twenties. But where they were picked, they were set up to fail.

Don't get me wrong, it's totally the fault of the organization that drafts a player who is unable to live up to the expectations. Just sayin'.
cloudnine is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 12:39 AM   #17 (permalink)
waiting...

Member
 
myklue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Richmond Hill
Posts: 459
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffb View Post
I was just watching NBATV and they were talking about Bigs and they specifically said most preject Centers don't pan out. Now i don't know the numbers, but it just seems like there are a lot more Thabeets out there then there are Howard's. Which is why i'd rather draft a 1 or a 3 and get an experienced Center via trade or FA if at all possible. Does anyone really believe Alabi will ever pan out to be a good NBA player, a rotation player?
100% agreed jeffb. look at Greg Oden (injury prone), thabeet as you mentioned, Patrick O'Bryant (Picked 9th overall 2006). Center picked at top picks have shown to never pan out as they projected to be.

POINT GUARDS do. Look through the drafts, there are more projected point guards that pan out than projected centers.

PICK KEMBA!
myklue is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 07:53 AM   #18 (permalink)
Likes raw prospects with a great work ethic...

Senior Member
 
LKeet6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Liverpool (UK)
Posts: 2,203
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by myklue View Post
100% agreed jeffb. look at Greg Oden (injury prone), thabeet as you mentioned, Patrick O'Bryant (Picked 9th overall 2006). Center picked at top picks have shown to never pan out as they projected to be.

POINT GUARDS do. Look through the drafts, there are more projected point guards that pan out than projected centers.

PICK KEMBA!
but PG is not a huge area of need for us. There are other options. Try and trade up for number 2 pick, get williams, or trade down involving barg and/or jose for a good player and use the 8-12 pick for a more risky draft pick. if we get lucky with that one, eg someone like biyombo then we've really helped the team. if that pick doesn't work out great at least you've got the strong player you traded in.
LKeet6 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 07:56 AM   #19 (permalink)
Sick, Wicked, and Nasty!

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,222
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EggsToTheBBQ View Post
Basically all centers are projects when they are drafted.

D12, Bynum, Bogut, Gasol, etc, etc, etc.

A polished center with size happens very rarely, and with guys being drafted at 19 now it really doesn't happen any more.
It depends what you mean by "project". If its just someone that is raw then i agree with all the above other than Bogut. But to me someone like D12 is not a project because he was drafted #1. To me if you're drafted #1 then you're already good and if anything you just need to come into your own with experience. You don't risk a #1 overall on a project.
Admiral is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 08:08 AM   #20 (permalink)
is the baby faced assassin

Banned
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 81,104
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LKeet6 View Post
but PG is not a huge area of need for us. There are other options. Try and trade up for number 2 pick, get williams, or trade down involving barg and/or jose for a good player and use the 8-12 pick for a more risky draft pick. if we get lucky with that one, eg someone like biyombo then we've really helped the team. if that pick doesn't work out great at least you've got the strong player you traded in.
It's huge area of need. Plus it was about taking the best player available? And the last thing we need is a risky draft pick. That never ends well for us!

Last edited by jeffb; 06-21-2011 at 08:11 AM.
jeffb is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24