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-   -   The pieces. (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/pieces-6303.html)

bjjs 02-08-2009 12:58 PM

The pieces.
 
First of all, I'm just looking at our team as it is. I know to get the missing pieces we'll have to give up pieces. But IMO, this team is really close to having a championship competing team despite their horrible season. A couple key pieces and we're there.

C Bargnani
PF Bosh


Bargnani and Bosh form one of the most dynamic frountcourts in the game.

SF Joey

Joey has a post up game that is good for 2,3 baskets a game on almost any SF in the league, and he has the ability to take over games with his athleticism. He can be the right piece at that position for a winning basketball club. He also can play minutes at the 4.

SG ?????????????? Raptors don't have a SG that can defend, and drive the paint. They need an elite guard at this position with a offensive game that has no holes, the ability to shoot the three, and be an effective playmaker against elite teams, and of course, he needs above average defensive abilities.

PG Jose provides heart, and stable backcourt play. He's not the guy who is going to take your team to the next level on his own though, because when teams key in on him, he struggles. With an elite SG he's more than capable of being the right PG and a on-court leader.

Bench.
6.???? - Need an athletic beast, ala Joey, who can come on, throw his weight around, and guard multiple positions. Somebody who makes things happen with physical play, and likes the challenge of guarding the game's best.
7. JO - if he stayed around for a smaller contract, has the ability to take over on the offensive end, and can replace bargs or bosh in the starting lineup when injured.
8. Anthony Parker. Veteran leadership, solid player at the 2 and can provide minutes at the 1.
9. Roko - A decent backup pg. He can get to the whole, and has shown signs of being a good defender.
10. Moon - Doesn't have the mental stamina to be a big minute contributor. However, his athleticism could be used in a deep bench roll and could provide a burst of energy the odd game where things aren't going well.
11. Voskuhl. Good deep bench big guy.
12. Hump. See Voskuhl.

13-15. These guys are supposed to suck.
Solomon, Jawai, Kapono.

Kapono and Moon alternating on the IR.

Gurk 02-08-2009 01:01 PM

We really need more on our bench. Not just one more player but we need atleast 2-3 more good bench players and the SG is the position we need to fill the quickest

m5racer 02-08-2009 01:07 PM

Nice, I cant totally agree with this. The biggest reason is beucase all these players have no chemestry when they play together. So although they might be great on paper or imagaining these players playing togerher the chemestry just is not there to have this team go anywhere. Their mindset seems to be a large hurdel to overcome. Also going 30% for an entire game tell me this team is no where close......not even kinda sorta close to becoming a "championship" team. Oh an in 2 years time, this will be and entirely diffrent team (player wise)

zachus 02-08-2009 01:19 PM

I don't see Joey bringing enough to the table to start on a contending team. I can easily see him being a key bench player, maybe even a sixth man of the year candidate, but his defense is far too overrated and his jumpshot is nowhere near as consistent as it needs to be for him to be at that point.

Claudius 02-08-2009 01:30 PM

Right now, this team in my opinion seriously needs a 6th man who is able to push the starters and provide some instant offense. I'd argue it's someone who's traditionally been coming off the bench and wouldn't have a problem with it.

As for Joey. I still see him more a 7th man type than an actual starter. I like what he gives and I like his versatility off the bench more than simply starting.

Ball Don't Lie 02-08-2009 01:40 PM

I think if we had a decent defensive PG we could get away with starting Parker at the 2 if we had that star player as well. I think he'd be great on a really good team just playing the Michael Finley role.

Joey is a 8th/9th man on a good team right now.

I dont think Bosh/Bargs is going to work in the longrun because theyre not tough enough on defence or the boards. Bosh needs a Dampier/Rasho, just like how a lot of the other star PFs have.

Kapono and Moon would also be good pieces off the bench for a good team. Kapono is sucking now because hes too involved and he plays too much, but you put him on a good team where he only plays 12-15 mpg and only takes 5 shots or so and have him in there on the same side of the floor as your star player to spread the court you have something.

And with Jamario when hes forced to work for his minutes he rebounds the ball like crazy. You have him on a good team where hed get benched for t aking those dumbass fadeaways hed be a great piece for any teams bench.


In the future, I'm hoping the team will look like this:

Jose, Roko
Star SG, Parker
Solid SF, Graham
Bosh, Humps
7 foot center who does all the dirty work, 7 foot center who does all the dirty work(a la Dallas)

And thats only if Roko and Graham keep developing then our bench will be solid. If they dont then I'd look to get a good veteran backup PG like Dooling and try and trade for a quality sg/sf like a Webster or CJ Miles to be the 6th man.

Dark Knight 02-08-2009 02:24 PM

We purposly don't have a bench this season. BC claims that our depth of all things was our fault. We could play all of them at the same time. So he let them go, signed some scrubs, and formed a 8 man rotation.

Superjudge 02-08-2009 02:24 PM

You have Joey in there after a few nice games.

Thats a big IF.

However, not bad if he gave the effort he did against Kobe the other night...everynight.

The MVP of West Hollywood 02-08-2009 02:37 PM

Jose/Bosh/Bargs won't work. To get away with a frontcourt without intimidation like Bosh/Bargs, you have to minimize the penetration. That's why I'd rather draft Jrue Holiday and trade Jose for wing help and go from there

Dr. J. Naismith 02-08-2009 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thriller92 (Post 138689)

In the future, I'm hoping the team will look like this:

Jose, Roko
Star SG, Parker
Solid SF, Graham
Bosh, Humps
7 foot center who does all the dirty work, 7 foot center who does all the dirty work(a la Dallas)

So I guess its safe to say you've written off Bargnani, Thrills? :confused2:

Dann38 02-08-2009 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thriller92 (Post 138689)
I dont think Bosh/Bargs is going to work in the longrun because theyre not tough enough on defence or the boards. Bosh needs a Dampier/Rasho, just like how a lot of the other star PFs have.

This is precisely what I think is the number one issue with the Raps. Our bigs are always too far out, facing the basket. I'm more of a traditionalist. I want my 4 to play defense and rebound first. Then gets his on the offensive glass.
I don't believe running all your offense through the high post can work unless you're Stockton/Malone.

Dr. J. Naismith 02-08-2009 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dann38 (Post 138745)
This is precisely what I think is the number one issue with the Raps. Our bigs are always too far out, facing the basket. I'm more of a traditionalist. I want my 4 to play defense and rebound first. Then gets his on the offensive glass.
I don't believe running all your offense through the high post can work unless you're Stockton/Malone.

Yup and if anyone has noticed lately that Bargnani is falling back on old habits. It's no coincidence that he's again had some sub-par games when he's playing beyond the arc once again. When he was on his tear he definitely was playing the post more and driving more often. Right now he's settling for either that pump fake jumper he loves to take or the three pointer. He need to get back to the post again because he was doing so well there for a couple weeks. :(

Ball Don't Lie 02-08-2009 03:09 PM

I dont think we can contend with the Bosh/Bargs duo downlow. If you want to contend you have to be a good rebounding team and good defensively on the interior, and although Bosh has his moments on D and Bargs' post D is greatly improved, those 2 together just isnt going to work IMO unless we get like Prince and a really good defensive SG around them as well which isnt going to happen.

Too many things have to happen for that duo to work and it really isnt possible. You have to put a really good defensive sg/sf around them that can rebound or youll be exposed bigtime.

And if youre asking who we should keep, its not even close.

m5racer 02-08-2009 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. J. Naismith (Post 138747)
Yup and if anyone has noticed lately that Bargnani is falling back on old habits. It's no coincidence that he's again had some sub-par games when he's playing beyond the arc once again. When he was on his tear he definitely was playing the post more and driving more often. Right now he's settling for either that pump fake jumper he loves to take or the three pointer. He need to get back to the post again because he was doing so well there for a couple weeks. :(

Ya but you can say this entire team is falling behind at this point. I see no one getting better except JO and he will be down again soon enough. I dont see how bargs is falling off when except for this last game is has been having pretty much 15-20 point games with 5-7 rebounds.

LX 02-08-2009 03:38 PM

It's no coincidence that the team's struggles match Parker's struggles pretty closely. The value he brought to this team in the past is unmistakable, and now that it is just not there as much on either end, it hurts a lot. I also agree that Jose's role would fit much better with more strength at the 2 spot. So we need Vince? You know what - he's probably exactly what we need, and I think he's evolved enough mentally to allow myself to accept him.

I know - I'm not the first on the bandwagon with this, and I'm not even sure it would ever even be considered, but it does work in terms making the pieces fit together better.

Bmats7 02-08-2009 03:49 PM

How can we write off bosh and bargs together?? How can u write off any frontcourt with the 2/3's as shitty as ours?

I dont even think dwight and Lewis could do anything with a 2/3 of moon,parker,kapono etc.

Whoever u think the best frontcourt in the league is... maybe gasol / bynum (healthy) none of those guys can do anything with our 2/3... just try to imagine. No one can win anything... ever... with a starting line of parker and moon @ the 2/3.

Ball Don't Lie 02-08-2009 03:55 PM

Dwight/Lewis and Bynum/Gasol rebound very well collectively and play great defence CONSISTANTLY. It helps they also have great coaches and very good players beside them but again from what Ive seen from Bosh/Bargs together we're way too soft inside on both side of the ball. I just dont think itll ever work.

bjjs 02-08-2009 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thriller92 (Post 138784)
Dwight/Lewis and Bynum/Gasol rebound very well collectively and play great defence CONSISTANTLY. It helps they also have great coaches and very good players beside them but again from what Ive seen from Bosh/Bargs together we're way too soft inside on both side of the ball. I just dont think itll ever work.

It might not ever work, but it's to early to give up on it now.


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