The Official RF Trade Proposal Thread - Page 290
Old 05-15-2014, 09:49 AM   #5781 (permalink)
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You're really becoming more vocal of DD being traded....in your honest opinion, or others that feel the same, is DD really an impediment to the future success of the team?
It's called selling high. Nothing to do with being an impediment.
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Old 05-15-2014, 09:58 AM   #5782 (permalink)
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It's called selling high. Nothing to do with being an impediment.
Well, wouldn't selling high imply that DD is no longer part of the equation for a deeper run in the play-offs? If the suggestion is to move on from him as a team as his defense is terrible and so on and so forth then that would mean he's impeding a more meaningful success to the play-offs? Maybe impediment is too strong of a word.

I'm just curious.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:07 AM   #5783 (permalink)
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Well, wouldn't selling high imply that DD is no longer part of the equation for a deeper run in the play-offs? If the suggestion is to move on from him as a team as his defense is terrible and so on and so forth then that would mean he's impeding a more meaningful success to the play-offs? Maybe impediment is too strong of a word.

I'm just curious.
Impediment probably not the best word.

It's maximizing assets by selling high. Until we are a deep into the playoffs team, we can't afford the " sacred cows" concept.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:19 AM   #5784 (permalink)
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Impediment probably not the best word.

It's maximizing assets by selling high. Until we are a deep into the playoffs team, we can't afford the " sacred cows" concept.
I agree about the "sacred Cow" concept...but trading one all star for another all-star (hopefully) seems like a lateral move unless the Raps feel DD is the wrong type of player for the team long term.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:25 AM   #5785 (permalink)
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I agree about the "sacred Cow" concept...but trading one all star for another all-star (hopefully) seems like a lateral move unless the Raps feel DD is the wrong type of player for the team long term.
All-star is too subjective and limiting a term to use- e.g DD is an all-star- Kawhi Leonard isn't, but the Spurs would never make that trade.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:27 AM   #5786 (permalink)
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I agree about the "sacred Cow" concept...but trading one all star for another all-star (hopefully) seems like a lateral move unless the Raps feel DD is the wrong type of player for the team long term.
Pretty much. Say we can trade him for a SF that can hit 3's and play better defense, which allows us to start Ross at SG who can also shoot and play defense.....might be a better fit. Again, depends who would be coming back in return.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:30 AM   #5787 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DocHoliday99 View Post
Well, wouldn't selling high imply that DD is no longer part of the equation for a deeper run in the play-offs? If the suggestion is to move on from him as a team as his defense is terrible and so on and so forth then that would mean he's impeding a more meaningful success to the play-offs? Maybe impediment is too strong of a word.

I'm just curious.
I'm certainly not a huge fan of DD. His style on offence is not my flavour, as it were, and his defence is atrocious in my opinion. The team is hardly doomed with him here - he is a talented player and has proven he can be part of a winning team - but I think he is the highest value piece in terms of trade value (perception around the league) versus on court value.

In other words, the team as constructed, I feel, will likely plateau without reaching contender status, unless the best case scenario growth occurs for JV and Ross. As such, some move or other needs to be made, and with Ross and DeMar sharing the same position (neither can truly play SF in a league with LBJ, Joe Johnson, etc type players), one of those two is the piece to move.

Players on rookie scale contracts are gold in this salary cap league. And DeMar can be a free agent as soon as two summers from now, when he will likely command close to max salary, and he is not worth that, and there's a risk he walks for nothing at that point. Given that, and my own reservations about DeMar's game, and his very high value around the league (first time all-star, biggest name on Cinderella story team this year, MIP consideration, very high scoring totals), and his relatively low contract value (below 10M is a good deal for an all-star), he seems the obvious choice for a trade. Think Jrue Holiday last year.

Obviously I don't just want him out of the way (although my blood pressure might disagree), I want him moved for top dollar return. A very high draft pick in this draft, or a real blue chip prospect, or part of a package for a truly established superstar.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:41 AM   #5788 (permalink)
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Pretty much. Say we can trade him for a SF that can hit 3's and play better defense, which allows us to start Ross at SG who can also shoot and play defense.....might be a better fit. Again, depends who would be coming back in return.
Deng in a S&T

Makes sense though I got the feeling MU was looking for a back-up and not a replacement - guess it depends on who's available.

I wouldn't mind seeing KL/DD/Deng or same type/Amir/JV as the starters with TR first off the bench

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Old 05-15-2014, 10:49 AM   #5789 (permalink)
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I'm certainly not a huge fan of DD. His style on offence is not my flavour, as it were, and his defence is atrocious in my opinion. The team is hardly doomed with him here - he is a talented player and has proven he can be part of a winning team - but I think he is the highest value piece in terms of trade value (perception around the league) versus on court value.

In other words, the team as constructed, I feel, will likely plateau without reaching contender status, unless the best case scenario growth occurs for JV and Ross. As such, some move or other needs to be made, and with Ross and DeMar sharing the same position (neither can truly play SF in a league with LBJ, Joe Johnson, etc type players), one of those two is the piece to move.

Players on rookie scale contracts are gold in this salary cap league. And DeMar can be a free agent as soon as two summers from now, when he will likely command close to max salary, and he is not worth that, and there's a risk he walks for nothing at that point. Given that, and my own reservations about DeMar's game, and his very high value around the league (first time all-star, biggest name on Cinderella story team this year, MIP consideration, very high scoring totals), and his relatively low contract value (below 10M is a good deal for an all-star), he seems the obvious choice for a trade. Think Jrue Holiday last year.

Obviously I don't just want him out of the way (although my blood pressure might disagree), I want him moved for top dollar return. A very high draft pick in this draft, or a real blue chip prospect, or part of a package for a truly established superstar.
That is probably the most succinct reasoning I've read in regards to trading DD - and difficult for me to not agree with you. BTW, never did it cross my mind that you wouldn't want top dollar return
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:49 AM   #5790 (permalink)
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Seriously doubt we go after Deng. Masai seems like the type to grab younger guys - Deng's got loads of miles on those legs.

I agree with the "type" - Deng, Iggy, defensive 3's with range who can run a PnR and pass a bit. Shame Landry's shot has abandoned him or he'd fit great. Barnes would be a good gamble if GSW is giving up on him.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:49 AM   #5791 (permalink)
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Deng in a S&T

Makes sense though I got the feeling MU was looking for a back-up and not a replacement - guess it depends on who's available.

I wouldn't mind seeing KL/DD/Deng or same type/Amir/JV as the starters with TR first off the bench
Deng doesn't have upside. He is what he is. The trade should be for upside.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:52 AM   #5792 (permalink)
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Seriously doubt we go after Deng. Masai seems like the type to grab younger guys - Deng's got loads of miles on those legs.

I agree with the "type" - Deng, Iggy, defensive 3's with range who can run a PnR and pass a bit. Shame Landry's shot has abandoned him or he'd fit great. Barnes would be a good gamble if GSW is giving up on him.
That was the reaoning behind the trade I suggested.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:55 AM   #5793 (permalink)
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Seriously doubt we go after Deng. Masai seems like the type to grab younger guys - Deng's got loads of miles on those legs.

I agree with the "type" - Deng, Iggy, defensive 3's with range who can run a PnR and pass a bit. Shame Landry's shot has abandoned him or he'd fit great. Barnes would be a good gamble if GSW is giving up on him.
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Deng doesn't have upside. He is what he is. The trade should be for upside.
I had such high hopes for LF for much the same reasons and with the luck of the Raps, he'll go and then find his shot again.

As for the "looking for youth with upside" - that would be nice and Barnes would be very nice.
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Old 05-15-2014, 12:55 PM   #5794 (permalink)
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You don't trade a 24 year old DeRozan for a 29 year old Deng. Makes no sense, especially with our current roster (Deng will be way on the down-slope of his career in 2-3 years when Ross and Valanciunas mature).
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Old 05-15-2014, 12:57 PM   #5795 (permalink)
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Pretty much. Say we can trade him for a SF that can hit 3's and play better defense, which allows us to start Ross at SG who can also shoot and play defense.....might be a better fit. Again, depends who would be coming back in return.
How about Rudy Gay, hahaha.
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Old 05-15-2014, 01:08 PM   #5796 (permalink)
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How about Rudy Gay, hahaha.
This is the weird thing, Rudy and demar have a very similar mould. It would be interesting to see where we would be if demar was traded instead. But there were definitive reasons why Rudy was traded, his lacklustre effort, his fucked up unconscious shooting, if he had the same mindset as demar, I dunno, both are very similar at a talent level but Rudy has the size and strength needed for the 3, showed some good d when he wasn't lazy.

But demar earned that spot including his all star berth. on a another note, I believe Lowry and Ross wouldn't have responded the same way they did post trade if Rudy stayed
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Old 05-15-2014, 03:56 PM   #5797 (permalink)
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You don't trade a 24 year old DeRozan for a 29 year old Deng. Makes no sense, especially with our current roster (Deng will be way on the down-slope of his career in 2-3 years when Ross and Valanciunas mature).
Hey now.....no one said trade DD for Deng

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Old 05-16-2014, 02:41 PM   #5798 (permalink)
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This is the weird thing, Rudy and demar have a very similar mould. It would be interesting to see where we would be if demar was traded instead. But there were definitive reasons why Rudy was traded, his lacklustre effort, his fucked up unconscious shooting, if he had the same mindset as demar, I dunno, both are very similar at a talent level but Rudy has the size and strength needed for the 3, showed some good d when he wasn't lazy.

But demar earned that spot including his all star berth. on a another note, I believe Lowry and Ross wouldn't have responded the same way they did post trade if Rudy stayed
The main reason Gay was traded was his absurd salary, all the holes in the roster and the belief the team was going to be blown up. If they had the same salary and Gay knew he was going to stay (and no blowing up the roster) then I think you would have seen a different player. Timing with where the team was at just didn't mesh for either. Too bad really, if TRoss was a little more consistent and JV a little further along in development then I would have loved a line of KL/TR/RG/AJ/JV - tough defensively and a little of everything on offense. Tough to say, the Raps huge leap in playing wasn't so much about Gay leaving (though yes that was big) but with the bench players coming back. I'm not sure how much DD would fetch compared to Gay at the time.

- at least that's how I saw it, though I'm sure there are several variations of the above.

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Old 05-17-2014, 02:05 PM   #5799 (permalink)
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1. Draft Night
OKC get Horford
Atlanta get Salmons + TH + Lamb + 1st Dallas 2014 + 1st OKC 2014+2015 + 2nd rd OKC 2014 (tor) + a futur 2nd rd tor
Toronto get Perkins + Carroll

2. Draft
at 20 : Grant
ar 37 : McGary

3.10th july
Dallas get Novak + 2nd rd NYK 2017
tor get Carter (S&T : 11M/3yr)

so if we manage to retain KL, PP GV and De Colo we should have this roster next season :


Lowry/Vasquez/De Colo
DD/Carter/Fields
Ross/Caroll/Grant
AJ/PP/McGary
JV/Perkins/Hayes

we would have AJ, Perkins, Fields, Hayes (26M) off the book summer 2015.

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Old 05-17-2014, 09:37 PM   #5800 (permalink)
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Would not even give up 2nd round picks and salmons to get Perkins tbh. He's on a worse contract than salmons and turned the ball over on 29%(!!!) of his possessions last year.

And Atlanta gets hosed.
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