The Official RF Trade Proposal Thread - Page 106
Old 06-02-2012, 01:07 PM   #2101 (permalink)
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I'd say he's average, not mediocre. Also, what about LKZ for Prince and Detroit's 1st rounder. We would then have back to back picks in a deep draft. Detroit does it to save at least 11 million in salary. I'd be willing to add Indy's 2nd rounder, possible ours. Prince would start here obviously.
Except that if they wanted to perform a salary dump, they'd trade Charlie V instead. They actually like Prince, and would prefer to keep them lol...

Last edited by Kirby; 06-05-2012 at 07:31 PM.
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Old 06-02-2012, 01:27 PM   #2102 (permalink)
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Except that if they wanted to perform a salar dump, they'd trade Charlie V instead. They actually like Prince, and would prefer to keep them lol...
Thing is, Prince has 3 years left on his deal. If they want to get rid of CharlieV they'll use the amnesty. Also, Detroit needs to do a real rebuild and get rid of older players. Austin Daye needs more mins. Dumars should've never kept Prince, but hey it's Dumars
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Old 06-02-2012, 02:05 PM   #2103 (permalink)
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I agree, people say that Bayless didn't develop properly because of this and that.. but if Lillard is Bayless 2.0, his ceiling is pretty limited. Bayless is still young he can improve his game, so why the fuck do we need Lillard?
Because Lillard has been playing PG... Bayless has never learned the position.... it's not like scoring guards have never done it, but they need to actually spend the time there.
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Old 06-03-2012, 12:40 PM   #2104 (permalink)
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Because Lillard has been playing PG... Bayless has never learned the position.... it's not like scoring guards have never done it, but they need to actually spend the time there.
Please, JB looks part of the new trend of score first PGs. 18 and 6 isn't that bad from a guy has had to play behind the iron man Andre Miller, CP3, and Jose (who will only be dethroned if the raps get a CP3 ish 16+ ppg/8+ apg guy on the team, so never - mediocrity for the win)
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:09 AM   #2105 (permalink)
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Portland picks Harrison Barnes.

Toronto picks Jared Sullinger.

Toronto trades Sullinger + James Johnson to Portland for Barnes + Luke Babbitt.
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:50 AM   #2106 (permalink)
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Please, JB looks part of the new trend of score first PGs. 18 and 6 isn't that bad from a guy has had to play behind the iron man Andre Miller, CP3, and Jose (who will only be dethroned if the raps get a CP3 ish 16+ ppg/8+ apg guy on the team, so never - mediocrity for the win)
a score first pg is ok but they still have to run the offense and Bayless can't. It lacks flow when he's at the position and he's best suited as a combo guard, like Nate Robinson.... and in doses. Stop looking at his stats 'when he starts' and watch the game, Bayless isn't a pg.

Bayless may have been stuck behind them but he sure didn't learn enough from them in terms of running the show. He's a decent combo guard but long stretches of him at pg are just too difficult to watch.
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:33 PM   #2107 (permalink)
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Eggs, you're not the first person here who tried to unload Fluke Crappit to the Raptors. (Toby hehe).

Interesting trade thought though.
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:58 PM   #2108 (permalink)
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a score first pg is ok but they still have to run the offense and Bayless can't. It lacks flow when he's at the position and he's best suited as a combo guard, like Nate Robinson.... and in doses. Stop looking at his stats 'when he starts' and watch the game, Bayless isn't a pg.

Bayless may have been stuck behind them but he sure didn't learn enough from them in terms of running the show. He's a decent combo guard but long stretches of him at pg are just too difficult to watch.
His play is eerily similar to Jennings, except JB isn't a chucker like Jennings. Also, JB would do quite well with another ballhandler on the team but there are none. Hard not to look at his stats when he starts - when he starts he is significantly better than him on the bench. My preference is for him to start or not be on the team.

PS: We're going to talk about role definition - well then, in those regards, Bargs isn't a PF and DD isn't a SG. SGs are supposed to be able to you know, shoot. PFs are supposed to be able to you know, rebound and defend.

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Old 06-04-2012, 10:32 PM   #2109 (permalink)
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Eggs, you're not the first person here who tried to unload Fluke Crappit to the Raptors. (Toby hehe).

Interesting trade thought though.
There's a number of variations on that deal. Since both teams are under the cap for next year it's fairly easy to come up with trades.

The thinking is that GSW is probably going to pick a SF, so there's no way Barnes gets past 7.

I think there's even a good chance they'll pick PJ3 if Barnes isn't available.

So, if the Raptors are serious about drafting a quality 3 they'll need to trade up so they're picking before GSW.

On the other hand the Raptors could also trade down and take a project or a long shot. I don't think that's going to happen if BC is planning a playoff run for next year.
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Old 06-05-2012, 12:38 AM   #2110 (permalink)
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I'm curious to see who drafts Q.Miller.
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Old 06-05-2012, 04:00 AM   #2111 (permalink)
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I'm curious to see who drafts Q.Miller.
I honestly hope we make a move to grab a pick to get him.
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Old 06-05-2012, 05:28 PM   #2112 (permalink)
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1.
Boston get Davis
toronto get Bradley + 22#

2.
Houston get 8# + tpe + 2nd rd indy
toronto get dalembert + 14#

3.
we draft Marshall (14) and Q. Miller (22).

4.
spiurs get 2nd rd tor 2012
toronto get C joseph.

5. We offer Nash 9M

6.
portland get Jose + forbes + 2nd rd tor 2013
Toronto get Batum


Nash/Marshall/C joseph
DD/Bradley/Anderson
Batum/JJ/Miller
Bargs/Amir/Kleiza
Dalembert/JV/Magz
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Old 06-05-2012, 05:43 PM   #2113 (permalink)
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1.
Boston get Davis
toronto get Bradley + 22#

2.
Houston get 8# + tpe + 2nd rd indy
toronto get dalembert + 14#

3.
we draft Marshall (14) and Q. Miller (22).

4.
spiurs get 2nd rd tor 2012
toronto get C joseph.

5. We offer Nash 9M

6.
portland get Jose + forbes + 2nd rd tor 2013
Toronto get Batum


Nash/Marshall/C joseph
DD/Bradley/Anderson
Batum/JJ/Miller
Bargs/Amir/Kleiza
Dalembert/JV/Magz
I doubt Boston sweetens Bradley, especially with a first rounder if at all, to get Davis.... but the one for one might be realistic.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:40 PM   #2114 (permalink)
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Calling it, the Gay for #8 deal is happening

In my opinion MEM is going to hold an auction to the lottery teams asking for a top 14 pick, capspace and maybe a cheap role player or two. This is the right deal for them, it gives them a talented rookie on a bargain deal, they played better with a role player at SF in 2011 than this year and they can get more depth

I guarantee Phoenix is on a #13 for Gay deal, possibly with Dudley, Lopez or both. Phoenix gets to sell a Gay/Gortat combo to Nash to resign and I think he does. Worst case scenario he leaves and Gay/Gortat alone is still a good head start to rebuild. I am 95-97% sure Phoenix would be in on a #13 for Gay principles deal. It's a no brainer that they do that deal in some variation.

Good chance one of GS, Detroit, Milwaukee, Houston is interested in a deal with their 7/9/11/14 picks. If you add that to the high high liklihood that us and Phx are interested in Gay, I'm guessing it's practically a lock that someone will do a cap and lotto pick deal for Gay if MEM wants it. But the advantage TOR and PHX have over them is they can offer MEM immediate cap savings so they can go out and spend on depth this summer.

Then wildcard is someone like SAC or WAS (who can amnesty Lewis) being interested in a top 5 pick for Gay which would trump BC but I see them being sold on just taking the prospect personally as the top 5 in this draft (Davis, MKG, Robinson, Beal, Drummond) have a lot more hype than players at 8

I think it ends up being us. I also think BC has been planning since the deadline to make a move for one of Granger, Gay, Iguodala this summer, which is why we traded Barbosa to IND to clear exactly enough capspace for the difference between Kleiza and those guys. It wouldn't surprise me if BC and Memphis have been talking about the future Gay deal for months just like we haggled about JO/Marion for a while/the principles are done and it's a question of whether we throw in our 2nds and throw in Ed or JJ, or whether they throw in the sweetener like giving us #25 taking Amir. I bet we're the ones getting bent over by giving them Ed and our 2nd, just a feeling.

BC gets to sell that we can get top 5-6 seed in a weakened East next year and how Gay/Bargnani can carry the load and help Demar break out/Valanciunas develop long term. He gets to sell that we're on a long term Indiana Pacers path with Gay/Bargnani/Valanciunas = Granger/West/Hibbert in talent. It also lines up perfectly for us to amnesty Calderon and go after a BC gonna BC PG free agent overpay like Dragic, Lin, Nelson, etc. (obviously Nash is Option A but don't count on it). He basically can't take a Perry Jones III or Jeremy Lamb and hope to make the playoffs by their and Jval's 3rd season, all the pressure is on him to make the playoffs next year or else I think MLSE finds a new GM. The idea of BC planning on adding Gay and a PG like Dragic this summer fits both Colangelo and particularly the pressure on Colangelo perfectly

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Old 06-05-2012, 08:45 PM   #2115 (permalink)
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Calling it, the Gay for #8 deal is happening

In my opinion MEM is going to hold an auction to the lottery teams asking for a top 14 pick, capspace and maybe a cheap role player or two. This is the right deal for them, it gives them a talented rookie on a bargain deal, they played better with a role player at SF in 2011 than this year and they can get more depth

I guarantee Phoenix is on a #13 for Gay deal, possibly with Dudley, Lopez or both. Phoenix gets to sell a Gay/Gortat combo to Nash to resign and I think he does. Worst case scenario he leaves and Gay/Gortat alone is still a good head start to rebuild. I am 95-97% sure Phoenix would be in on a #13 for Gay principles deal. It's a no brainer that they do that deal in some variation.

Good chance one of GS, Detroit, Milwaukee, Houston is interested in a deal with their 7/9/11/14 picks. If you add that to the high high liklihood that us and Phx are interested in Gay, I'm guessing it's practically a lock that someone will do a cap and lotto pick deal for Gay if MEM wants it. But the advantage TOR and PHX have over them is they can offer MEM immediate cap savings so they can go out and spend on depth this summer.

Then wildcard is someone like SAC or WAS (who can amnesty Lewis) being interested in a top 5 pick for Gay which would trump BC but I see them being sold on just taking the prospect personally as the top 5 in this draft (Davis, MKG, Robinson, Beal, Drummond) have a lot more hype than players at 8

I think it ends up being us. I also think BC has been planning since the deadline to make a move for one of Granger, Gay, Iguodala this summer, which is why we traded Barbosa to IND to clear exactly enough capspace for the difference between Kleiza and those guys. It wouldn't surprise me if BC and Memphis have been talking about the future Gay deal for months just like we haggled about JO/Marion for a while/the principles are done and it's a question of whether we throw in our 2nds and throw in Ed or JJ, or whether they throw in the sweetener like giving us #25 taking Amir. I bet we're the ones getting bent over by giving them Ed and our 2nd, just a feeling.

BC gets to sell that we can get top 5-6 seed in a weakened East next year and how Gay/Bargnani can carry the load and help Demar break out/Valanciunas develop long term. He gets to sell that we're on a long term Indiana Pacers path with Gay/Bargnani/Valanciunas = Granger/West/Hibbert in talent. It also lines up perfectly for us to amnesty Calderon and go after a BC gonna BC PG free agent overpay like Dragic, Lin, Nelson, etc. (obviously Nash is Option A but don't count on it)
you know what, I hope you're right. That way, if we end up with Nash as well, maybe we can compete for something.

Both Gay and Nash are big time.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:47 PM   #2116 (permalink)
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:57 PM   #2117 (permalink)
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I guess we'll be a treadmill team at best though.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:58 PM   #2118 (permalink)
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Yeah you just know BC would amputate a pinky toe to get both Rudy Gay and Steve Nash this summer. Would be EOY #3 and MLSE would give him a 7 year extension for all the extra bucks he got them.
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:00 PM   #2119 (permalink)
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I guess we'll be a treadmill team at best though.

How so? Dude we have to start aquiring talent other than just draft picks. Adding Gay and upgrading the PG position could be a big step for us, not to mention if Valanciunas pans out the way most think he will. Our weakest starter could end up being Derozan, which is far better than him being the #2 option.
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Old 06-05-2012, 09:03 PM   #2120 (permalink)
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I guess we'll be a treadmill team at best though.
If the Raps landed Gay AND Nash, there is a decent chance Toronto wins 50 games. I'd take a couple of years of that.

Keep in mind, we're already too good to get any top 5 picks in the near future, so we aren't getting any superstars via the draft. Given the assets we have to work with, you can't expect to do much better than Gay and Nash.
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