Let's hold the hate for a second...
Old 12-02-2008, 12:08 AM   #1 (permalink)
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.... and take a look at this.

In light of all of the "Chris Bosh never steps up against big teams" stuff that's been going around lately I decided to take a look at what OTHER "star bigs" in the league did against a team like the defending NBA champs.

Rasheed Wallace: 4/17 for 10 pts and 11 rebs. - DET loses by 12.

Dwight Howard: 5/13 for 14 pts and 15 rebs. (4 blks too) - ORL loses by 19.

Yao Ming: 4/14 for 8 pts and 7 rebs. - HOU loses by 4.

Andrew Bogut: 4/11 for 11 pts and 8 rebs - MIL loses by 12.

Al Jefferson: 8/20 for 23 pts and 4 rebs. - MIN loses by 17.

Elton Brand: 8/14 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - PHI loses by 24.

Zach Randolph: 5/15 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - NY loses by 9.


and now...

Chris Bosh (Game 1): 3/8 for 9 pts and 7 rebs. - TOR loses by 7.

Chris Bosh (Game 2): 7/14 for 24 pts and 6 rebs. - TOR loses by 15.


So.... anyone want to tell me why Chris Bosh should take so much heat for having trouble with the Celts when it's clear that EVERY damn big in the whole NBA does?
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:14 AM   #2 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

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Its because Raptors fan always needs to blame someone for the lost or to bash.
Bosh is playing his heart out, 40+ minutes a game and what he gets for having a bad game is getting bash by raps fan.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:31 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
.... and take a look at this.

In light of all of the "Chris Bosh never steps up against big teams" stuff that's been going around lately I decided to take a look at what OTHER "star bigs" in the league did against a team like the defending NBA champs.

Rasheed Wallace: 4/17 for 10 pts and 11 rebs. - DET loses by 12.

Dwight Howard: 5/13 for 14 pts and 15 rebs. (4 blks too) - ORL loses by 19.

Yao Ming: 4/14 for 8 pts and 7 rebs. - HOU loses by 4.

Andrew Bogut: 4/11 for 11 pts and 8 rebs - MIL loses by 12.

Al Jefferson: 8/20 for 23 pts and 4 rebs. - MIN loses by 17.

Elton Brand: 8/14 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - PHI loses by 24.

Zach Randolph: 5/15 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - NY loses by 9.


and now...

Chris Bosh (Game 1): 3/8 for 9 pts and 7 rebs. - TOR loses by 7.

Chris Bosh (Game 2): 7/14 for 24 pts and 6 rebs. - TOR loses by 15.


So.... anyone want to tell me why Chris Bosh should take so much heat for having trouble with the Celts when it's clear that EVERY damn big in the whole NBA does?


thank you ToRap.
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Old 12-02-2008, 12:34 AM   #4 (permalink)
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You forgot to mention Rasho's 8/4/2.
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:15 AM   #5 (permalink)
is.....

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You forgot to mention Rasho's 8/4/2.
too bad rasho isen't a big star by any means, and hes not that good.
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:20 AM   #6 (permalink)
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too bad rasho isen't a big star by any means, and hes not that good.
sure sure..... you also gonna tell me there is no Santa Claus?
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:24 AM   #7 (permalink)
is waiting for the season to start

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
.... and take a look at this.

In light of all of the "Chris Bosh never steps up against big teams" stuff that's been going around lately I decided to take a look at what OTHER "star bigs" in the league did against a team like the defending NBA champs.

Rasheed Wallace: 4/17 for 10 pts and 11 rebs. - DET loses by 12.

Dwight Howard: 5/13 for 14 pts and 15 rebs. (4 blks too) - ORL loses by 19.

Yao Ming: 4/14 for 8 pts and 7 rebs. - HOU loses by 4.

Andrew Bogut: 4/11 for 11 pts and 8 rebs - MIL loses by 12.

Al Jefferson: 8/20 for 23 pts and 4 rebs. - MIN loses by 17.

Elton Brand: 8/14 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - PHI loses by 24.

Zach Randolph: 5/15 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - NY loses by 9.


and now...

Chris Bosh (Game 1): 3/8 for 9 pts and 7 rebs. - TOR loses by 7.

Chris Bosh (Game 2): 7/14 for 24 pts and 6 rebs. - TOR loses by 15.


So.... anyone want to tell me why Chris Bosh should take so much heat for having trouble with the Celts when it's clear that EVERY damn big in the whole NBA does?

thank youuuuuuuuuuuuu
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Old 12-02-2008, 01:31 AM   #8 (permalink)
thinking Stephen Harper has got to go.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
.... and take a look at this.

In light of all of the "Chris Bosh never steps up against big teams" stuff that's been going around lately I decided to take a look at what OTHER "star bigs" in the league did against a team like the defending NBA champs.

Rasheed Wallace: 4/17 for 10 pts and 11 rebs. - DET loses by 12.

Dwight Howard: 5/13 for 14 pts and 15 rebs. (4 blks too) - ORL loses by 19.

Yao Ming: 4/14 for 8 pts and 7 rebs. - HOU loses by 4.

Andrew Bogut: 4/11 for 11 pts and 8 rebs - MIL loses by 12.

Al Jefferson: 8/20 for 23 pts and 4 rebs. - MIN loses by 17.

Elton Brand: 8/14 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - PHI loses by 24.

Zach Randolph: 5/15 for 18 pts and 8 rebs - NY loses by 9.


and now...

Chris Bosh (Game 1): 3/8 for 9 pts and 7 rebs. - TOR loses by 7.

Chris Bosh (Game 2): 7/14 for 24 pts and 6 rebs. - TOR loses by 15.


So.... anyone want to tell me why Chris Bosh should take so much heat for having trouble with the Celts when it's clear that EVERY damn big in the whole NBA does?
Okay I agree that nobody should give Bosh any heat, he has played his heart out this season and every season he has been here, but the only player on that list that is Bosh's equal talent wise is maybe Howard. The first game you can't really count because that was Mitchell's stupidity not Bosh's fault, he was just following the coach's game plan. The second game 24 points is not that shabby against a team like Boston. Also Bosh has been playing a lot of minutes plus the Olympics maybe he is starting to get a little tired.
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Old 12-02-2008, 03:37 AM   #9 (permalink)
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because people are just greedy. that's how we're built. we always want it all and now.

bosh will be back. he's gonna be better next game against the lakers.

bosh wasn't that guy who was just blessed with incredible talent. he's just the hardworking and determined guy. ever since he's been here, he's shown that he's the guy that adapts and learns from his mistakes. he's always been bad at things his first couple of tries. now he's taken notes and he'll be more prepared next time. no big deal.
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Old 12-02-2008, 07:28 AM   #10 (permalink)
playoffs please dont end

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thank you for the positive post

one thing to add: Lakers took away the paint from Bosh, but our wingmen punished them for it with lotsa threes. If our defense was better Lakers would regret that decision
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Old 12-02-2008, 07:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I still wasn't overly happy with his approach to the Laker's game, but I personally don't see that as a pattern that makes him guilty of fading against strong competition. I think you can look at not just bigs, but stars like Kobe when the Lakers were more of a .500 team, and find games against upper echelon teams that just went south. We all want Bosh to be able to put his team on his back against strong teams, but if you look at those strong teams, the particular thing that makes them dominant is not having to rely on one guy every night. Kobe's numbers are way down, and both he and his team look that much more formidable. The criticism against Bosh is that much more unfair if you consider he was missing JO.
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Old 12-02-2008, 08:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
is back baby

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Half the players listed play Center.
Excluding the GS game...

Charlie V 13 and 12
Anderson Verajao 9 and 9
Tyrus Thomas 11 and 6
Troy Murphy 10 and 8
Luis Scola 21 and 9
Kenyon MArtin 16 and 4
Luc Mbah a Moute 14 and 9
Zach Randolph 18 and 8
Jason Maxiel 10 and 6 and Sheed 13 and 6
Al Jefferson 21 and 4
Emeka Okafor 9 and 7
Rashard Lewis 30 and 5
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:43 AM   #13 (permalink)
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how did andrew bogut make the stars list?
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:51 AM   #14 (permalink)
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For me personally this isn't about whether Chris Bosh is a good player or not, it's about why he withers and plays scared against fierce competition. If you haven't noticed it or it doesn't concern you then I don't know what to say.

TO you provided a list of players who either aren't PF's, who aren't their teams go to guy or play on horrible teams to begin with.

Last edited by Acie; 12-02-2008 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:55 AM   #15 (permalink)
what he is.

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You're comparing Bosh with Rasheed Wallace,Andrew Bogut, Al Jefferson, Zach Randolph and out-of-injury Brand? Also he is not comparable to Yao 'cause their positions are different. You should compare him with Garnett, Duncan, Nowitzki, Stoudemire etc. But you know what, Bosh is at the Top-3 according to Hollinger efficiency ratings!

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/holli...seasonType%3d2

The problem is that when the opponent team is strong on defence, he can't create his own shot. Not many PFs can do that either except for Nowitzki. That's why Stoudemire needs Nash.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:30 AM   #16 (permalink)
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You should compare him with Garnett....
He hasn't played against Boston yet this season.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:40 AM   #17 (permalink)
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For me personally this isn't about whether Chris Bosh is a good player or not, it's about why he withers and plays scared against fierce competition. If you haven't noticed it or it doesn't concern you then I don't know what to say.

TO you provided a list of players who either aren't PF's, who aren't their teams go to guy or play on horrible teams to begin with.
Oh, I've noticed it... and I've said that it's an area where he has to get better (and he will). I just made this thread so that people would relax and realize that this guy is still a young player who's getting better all the time.

As for the players that I listed.... what's wrong with talking about Sheed, Jefferson, Zach and Yao?

It doesn't matter if some of those guys don't play PF.... they are star calibre players who are capable of putting together big double-doubles.

And at this point I don't think that we can really say that we're head and shoulders above ANY team... lol.....
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Old 12-02-2008, 04:02 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I think Bosh has gone through stages where he's paid too much respect to the great players, then he was intimidated by fierce, physical defenders, and now I really think that he mostly just gets game-planned pretty well. I think he's played much better against guys like Sheed and Evans over the last year. And he still needs to get better at being able to find ways of having an impact in games where the whole roster shuts him down. That's what bugged me about the LA game - he needed to get more boards and just didn't get it done.

But look at how badly he used to get shut down, and it doesn't really compare to what happens now.
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Old 12-02-2008, 06:08 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I think Bosh has gone through stages where he's paid too much respect to the great players, then he was intimidated by fierce, physical defenders, and now I really think that he mostly just gets game-planned pretty well. I think he's played much better against guys like Sheed and Evans over the last year. And he still needs to get better at being able to find ways of having an impact in games where the whole roster shuts him down. That's what bugged me about the LA game - he needed to get more boards and just didn't get it done.

But look at how badly he used to get shut down, and it doesn't really compare to what happens now.
Exactamundo.

Tonight's gonna a BIG test for him though... because Nene and K-Mart have to be two of the most intimidating PFs out there....
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Old 12-02-2008, 06:11 PM   #20 (permalink)
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two problems with this topic:

1. Bosh had the lowest number of rebounds in both games, compared with all the other players on the list. Nothing the Celtics can do on defense can stop Bosh from being a best on the defensive boards.

2. Bosh doesn't struggle only against Boston, he struggles against most good defensive players.
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