Raptors Forum | Toronto Raptors Forums & Message Boards

Raptors Forum | Toronto Raptors Forums & Message Boards (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/)
-   Toronto Raptors (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/)
-   -   If were only as easy (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/if-were-only-easy-5410.html)

bjjs 12-31-2008 09:51 PM

If were only as easy
 
If it were only as easy as deciding, "I am going to the net, no ifs ands or buts, every time I have the ball.", We would have 200+ NBA players getting to the rim at will, and everyone would be shooting .550+ and the NBA would have to change foul outs to 8 or 9 per player.

It's time for people to start realizing Bosh's limitations as a player (Leo). I hope Jay doesn't keep on Bosh for getting to the rim tonight when it's other weaknesses in the Raps aresnal that are the real problems, it will confuse him, and destory him. He was playing like a superstar making his jumpshot his bread and butter at the start of the year, playing beautiful basketball. FOR BOSH GETTING TO THE RIM PLAYS OFF OF THE JUMPER, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

Kevin Garnett gets points inside. Why? because he has 4 teammates who can get to into the paint and get shots up, and he cleans that shit up because his man has to help. All the other 4 guys are legit threats to score inside. The Raps have 3 guys who might score a few baskets here and their, but they aren't going to make big guys leave Bosh. What is Garnett's best post move? Back to the basket, fake right,turn left, fadeway jumper. His inside stuff comes off of teammates who also can play in the paint.

Watch a Raptor game, and actively look for how many times Bosh's man has to give help on Moon or Parker, or Graham, Jose or anybody. Bosh's man doesn't have to worry about anything but Bosh and only Bosh. Team's don't need two bigs to protect the paint against the Raps' guards. In fact, you put O'Neal on the floor, and opposing coaches can tell both their bigs not to help off them because teams don't need any bigs protecting the paint against our guards.


This team is done, unless we get a legit two guard.

Ugo Ferst 12-31-2008 09:54 PM

Who was our legit guard last year? Delfino?

bjjs 12-31-2008 10:03 PM

We were 41-41.

TJ did more in the paint last year than anyone is for us this year, he would get in their and be disruptive and wasn't guardable one on one when he was on his game, all 5 guys had to be aware of him. But I don't want to make this into a TJ/Jose comparison or anything like that. We sucked going into the playoffs last year anyways. And I wasn't a big TJ fan.

Ugo Ferst 12-31-2008 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjjs (Post 107465)
We were 41-41.

TJ did more in the paint last year than anyone is for us this year, he would get in their and be disruptive and wasn't guardable one on one when he was on his game, all 5 guys had to be aware of him. But I don't want to make this into a TJ/Jose comparison or anything like that. We sucked going into the playoffs last year anyways. And I wasn't a big TJ fan.

lol yea i wont get into TJ either, he obv sucks... and didnt bring anything we are missing desperately this year...

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:07 PM

Bosh has to be one of the worst franchise players I've ever seen. Has he ever made the right decision in a clutch situation? It's like he lacks basic basketball IQ sometimes.

More and more, he reminds me of Shareef.

Ugo Ferst 12-31-2008 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogbert (Post 107469)
Bosh has to be one of the worst franchise players I've ever seen. Has he ever made the right decision in a clutch situation? It's like he lacks basic basketball IQ sometimes.

More and more, he reminds me of Shareef.

I agree, but that sometimes is only in big shot situations, he is very smart in normal situations, but when the pressure is on, he crumbles much more often then comes thru.

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst (Post 107470)
I agree, but that sometimes is only in big shot situations, he is very smart in normal situations, but when the pressure is on, he crumbles much more often then comes thru.

Funny how it sometimes works that way with players. You either have that late game "cluthness" or you don't. I can tell you that Chauncey certainly does...I would love to have that guy on my team. Denver is going to be tough to beat in the West playoffs this season.

Ugo Ferst 12-31-2008 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogbert (Post 107473)
Funny how it sometimes works that way with players. You either have that late game "cluthness" or you don't. I can tell you that Chauncey certainly does...I would love to have that guy on my team. Denver is going to be tough to beat in the West playoffs this season.

hehe, well he does have the coolest nick in all of Bball, i mean come on "Mr. Big Shot" that F'ning owns!!!

Also agree, Denver will be tough, funny that one move made them so much better, kudos to them.

Jay 12-31-2008 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjjs (Post 107457)
It's time for people to start realizing Bosh's limitations as a player (Leo). I hope Jay doesn't keep on Bosh for getting to the rim tonight when it's other weaknesses in the Raps aresnal that are the real problems, it will confuse him, and destory him.

Wow, you really couldn't be any more wrong than you are here. The great thing about Bosh's game is that there are a lot of possibilities. Bosh has had success when he has used his athleticism to get to the rim and has shown that he has enough speed on the first step to get an angle and then go up hard. To suggest that he is using the jumper to then work inside is ludicrous. As Bosh has gotten stronger over the years, he has been more physically able to attack the rim, so now that he has the talent and the body for it, he should be doing it routinely. Seriously, who was there to stop him tonight? The Birdman? K-Mart? I'll take Bosh attacking either of those guys any night. Nene plays tough inside, but I'll take Bosh's speed on him too.

As for the other weaknesses the Raps have, those have been well documented. That's why they need Bosh to get inside, so that he can get to the line, get the opposition in foul trouble, score points with the clock stopped and then open things up for his teammates as the D will not be able to be as aggressive.

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst (Post 107476)
hehe, well he does have the coolest nick in all of Bball, i mean come on "Mr. Big Shot" that F'ning owns!!!

Also agree, Denver will be tough, funny that one move made them so much better, kudos to them.

Iverson may be the bigger "star," but there's no doubt who is the bigger winner of the two. Chauncey does own.

Jay 12-31-2008 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogbert (Post 107469)
Bosh has to be one of the worst franchise players I've ever seen. Has he ever made the right decision in a clutch situation? It's like he lacks basic basketball IQ sometimes.

More and more, he reminds me of Shareef.

HUH? One of the worst franchise players? Are you insane? He has singlehandedly won a few games for the Raptors this season, has improved his game season over season, is an All-Star...

More often than not, he makes good plays in clutch situations, but when he doesn't, they get over-analyzed, which leads to inaccurate comments like this. To say that he reminds you of Shareef is crazy. Shareef was all talent, zero desire, zero effort, zero brain.

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay (Post 107480)
HUH? One of the worst franchise players? Are you insane? He has singlehandedly won a few games for the Raptors this season, has improved his game season over season, is an All-Star...

Yeah, he really took it to those Bobcats earlier this year, LOL.


Quote:

More often than not, he makes good plays in clutch situations, but when he doesn't, they get over-analyzed, which leads to inaccurate comments like this.
I'm not sure what games you are watching, but I've never seen Bosh come up big in the late minutes in an important game. The only player who does it even a little bit on this team is Calderon. That's it. We have no onions.

Quote:

To say that he reminds you of Shareef is crazy. Shareef was all talent, zero desire, zero effort, zero brain.
It's not crazy at all if you have any memory of Shareef. The guy never came through in the clutch.

bjjs 12-31-2008 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay (Post 107477)
Wow, you really couldn't be any more wrong than you are here. The great thing about Bosh's game is that there are a lot of possibilities. Bosh has had success when he has used his athleticism to get to the rim and has shown that he has enough speed on the first step to get an angle and then go up hard. To suggest that he is using the jumper to then work inside is ludicrous. As Bosh has gotten stronger over the years, he has been more physically able to attack the rim, so now that he has the talent and the body for it, he should be doing it routinely. Seriously, who was there to stop him tonight? The Birdman? K-Mart? I'll take Bosh attacking either of those guys any night. Nene plays tough inside, but I'll take Bosh's speed on him too.

As for the other weaknesses the Raps have, those have been well documented. That's why they need Bosh to get inside, so that he can get to the line, get the opposition in foul trouble, score points with the clock stopped and then open things up for his teammates as the D will not be able to be as aggressive.

So again, like others, you think he should be doing it routinely, and can do it routinely, but he CHOOSES not too? He's a high center of gravity player. Nene, Kmart, Anderson are all quick players. Bosh isn't going to leave any of them in the dust when the race is starting only 5 feet from the rim. When Bosh isn't hitting that jumper and making them standup with a hand in his face, they sit down, and they crash his attempt to go the net with a forearm or quick jab to his hip, and a quick 2 inch shuffle to their right or left.

Bosh relies on his jumper. That's the way it is. And that's not a bad thing. Their have been many great bigs in this game that have relied on their jumper.

Jay 12-31-2008 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dogbert (Post 107484)
It's not crazy at all if you have any memory of Shareef. The guy never came through in the clutch.

Yeah, exactly, he never came through in the clutch because he wasn't even a guy anybody went to in the clutch. He was D-League quality. This comparison makes no sense.

bjjs 12-31-2008 10:24 PM

And if I couldn't be more wrong, I would love an example of a game where Bosh put up 30+ without hitting more than 5+ jumpers outside of 10 feet.


I know you won't find an example, it would be too time consuming of a task, but think about it for a second. It's never happened.

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay (Post 107488)
Yeah, exactly, he never came through in the clutch because he wasn't even a guy anybody went to in the clutch. He was D-League quality. This comparison makes no sense.

He was D-League quality? WTF? I guess Hollinger is seriously off the mark when he lists him as Chris Bosh's greatest comparable in his profile for him then?

Shareef put up Chris Bosh-like numbers for over 7 years, and was routinely the #1 option late in games for the Grizzlies and Hawks. He never came through.

I even remember one particular game in which the Hawks were tied with the Raptors late, and Leo kept going on and on about how Shareef couldn't hit shots in clutch situations, and sure enough, he didn't and the Raptors won. I wonder how long before he says the same about Bosh (probably when Chris leaves, of course).

dogbert 12-31-2008 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjjs (Post 107490)
And if I couldn't be more wrong, I would love an example of a game where Bosh put up 30+ without hitting more than 5+ jumpers outside of 10 feet.


I know you won't find an example, it would be too time consuming of a task, but think about it for a second. It's never happened.

Bosh shoots a lot of jumpers, that's a major part of his game. Unfortunately, he just doesn't seem to hit any of them agaisnt good defensive teams.

bjjs 12-31-2008 10:29 PM

saying shareef was D-league quality is beyond silly. But why is shareef being talked about in this thread.

Jay 12-31-2008 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjjs (Post 107490)
And if I couldn't be more wrong, I would love an example of a game where Bosh put up 30+ without hitting more than 5+ jumpers outside of 10 feet.


I know you won't find an example, it would be too time consuming of a task, but think about it for a second. It's never happened.

Um...so? If Bosh puts up 30+ in a game, it's not inconceivable to think that he's going to hit some jumpers. I'm not saying that the jumper shouldn't be a part of his game, it should. What I am saying is that he is quick enough, a good enough finisher and good from the line, which all lead to him attacking the rim.

If Bosh hits 5 jumpers from outside of 10 feet, that's one third of his points on the jumper, with the rest (66%) coming from inside and from the line. Sounds about right, doesn't it?

Jay 12-31-2008 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjjs (Post 107498)
saying shareef was D-league quality is beyond silly. But why is shareef being talked about in this thread.

Okay, true, maybe I did go a little overboard saying he was D-league quality, but I don't think people (other than Hollinger, who really is off his rocker half the time) can seriously put those two players in the same bracket.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:58 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011


1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24