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-   -   Hollinger Chat from ESPN - Raptor Related (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/hollinger-chat-espn-raptor-related-939.html)

Dr. J. Naismith 02-26-2008 05:43 PM

Hollinger Chat from ESPN - Raptor Related
Ahh ... the "what if's" regarding Jose not making the All-Star team will never get old. ;)


Originally Posted by ESPN
Jimmy (Chicago): John, what was the bigger mistake ... leaving Manu off the West or Calderon off the East?

SportsNation John Hollinger: (3:40 PM ET ) I can't decide. Calderon was a bit more of a slap because they took two injury replacements and still didn't pick him -- I mean seriously, putting Ray Allen on the team ahead of Calderon was just shameful. At least the guys that beat out Manu were having All-Star caliber seasons.

Regarding the Raptors come playoff time:


Originally Posted by ESPN
]T Cell (Whitehorse, Yukon): So who are the Raptors going to beat in the playoffs? Cavs? Magic? Doubt it. They still need another *great* starter. The reason their margin is high is their bench is so much better than anyone else's bench.

SportsNation John Hollinger: (4:01 PM ET ) Check out Bosh's numbers -- he's a legit MVP candidate. They have two top-notch PGs in Calderon and Ford, and their role guys are all decent. I would have no problem whatsoever picking them over Orlando. I want to see how Cleveland looks like with the new guys, but pre-trade I'd have taken them over the Cavs too.

raptor123 02-26-2008 06:04 PM

We should all get over the fact about Jose not making the all star team. This was Joses year to make it, he didn't and as long as he plays for the raptors and shares time will never come close again. Jose plays better with more minutes and will always look better when he does. With reduced minutes he will not shine as much because of his style of play. Great to hear Hollinger support our team against the magic and the cavs.

Kuzzy 02-26-2008 06:25 PM

Bosh MVP candidate?
this guys an idiot.

Raptorman 02-26-2008 07:03 PM

Other than the MVP comment, he's dead on.

Although I called him an idiot on RealGM. So we agree.

alseaf 02-26-2008 07:07 PM

John Hollinger is a retarded midget with pair of awkward looking eyebrows who spends his days formulating gay little equations that nobody gives a quarter of a shit's worth about. I mean FUCKKK, was he not the dude who said that Jose will have a significant drop off from his 'career year' last season... and now hes he's leading the 'Jose got snubbed' parade. What a douche bucket.

'trane 02-26-2008 07:33 PM

I don't mean to defend Hollinger, because he is a douche, but he should be allowed to change his mind. Although his pre-season call was turrible, I'm actually quite impressed that's he's devoted a fair amount of his column space to pointing out how good Jose has been over the past couple of months. In contrast to his colleagues...

moremilk 02-26-2008 08:36 PM

hollinger is very smart - he really knows basketball. But he has a major flaw, he will trust his math over his eyes, which would be understandable for a guy who doesn't know the game, but he really is one of the most competent analysts at espn.

So it comes as no surprise that he thinks we're good, his math tells him we're no #5 in the NBA (according to his power rankings), therefore we must be good, right?

alseaf 02-26-2008 09:10 PM

Don't you see the irony in what your saying? His formulas tell him we are the 5th best team.... well, are we even the 15th??? lol its debatable, but thats the point. His idea of determining the goodness of a team strictly thru numbers is a bad one because the performance of an NBA team does not rest solely on the things he keeps statistical track of.

pimpery 02-26-2008 09:12 PM

off topic but wow that pic of kapono on your avatar with the 1980s haircut made me LOL for real ;)

moremilk 02-26-2008 09:41 PM

there's no irony - the same way religiuos people will accept stuff that normally contradicts everything they know about the world, Hollinger will trust his math more than his eyes. He does that because he believes that mathematics is always objective, while his judgment could be influenced by outside things.

As for those particular rankings, while having the Raptors at #5 might seem like an obvious invalidation, you have to look a bit deeper. Newton's gravity theory is still taught in most schools around the world, despite the fact that it was proven as incorrect. But in the end, it's the best aproximation that could be explained to the average kid.

I am a mathematician myself, so I understand his position. I'm not agreeing with him, sometimes he will make the most stupid comments because of this. Sometimes his formulas are way way off, and therefore any conclusion based on them are completely irrelevant. But, for what it's worth, I actually think his power rankings formula is one of the better ones - not perfect by any stretch, but I do agree with most of his ground rules used to establish it. And really, look at the rest of the standings, is the order that much farther from your own rankings? Remember, all positions are CALCULATED, by a computer, using a set of mathematical rules. The same rules are used for all teams - and it looks to me like a pretty accurate ranking. What if we're actually better than we think we are?

Superjudge 02-27-2008 10:50 AM


I maybe hard on Bosh, but to say he isn't an MVP calibre guy is just wrong.

Just ....wow.

Thug 02-27-2008 11:36 AM

Haha, is this guy a Canadian or Raptors fan?

Superjudge 02-27-2008 12:13 PM

I sense hostility Doc.

Better get out your discipline stick.


I'm both Thug.


And Bosh is un Guardable, and an allstar.

So ya, he's MVP calibre.

moremilk 02-27-2008 01:02 PM

MVP calibre? Sure - why not. MVP candidate? Not right now - for sure he isn't. He's a top 25 player in the league though, he is right at the entry door for mega-stardom. I remember there were quite a few games last season when the crowd was chanting MVP ... (not this season though ...).

alseaf 02-27-2008 01:10 PM


Originally Posted by pimpery (Post 13320)
off topic but wow that pic of kapono on your avatar with the 1980s haircut made me LOL for real ;)

I was googling raptors players names in the image search and spit out my drink laughing when i came across it.

Belsius 02-27-2008 01:16 PM

square head + 80s hair= Strange sharpshooting mutant

alseaf 02-27-2008 01:18 PM

the last 3 weeks or so, he had a nice little beard going on. I was calling him Jesus Kapono for a while. I guess his beard grows faster with less playing time :P

moremilk 02-28-2008 01:12 PM

Raptors at #4 ... :) These blowouts are really helping us ...

pimpery 02-28-2008 10:27 PM

if only what this math nerd thot really translated in2 reality ;)

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