Have we seen the last of Jose Calderon in a Raps uniform? - Page 2

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View Poll Results: Jose's future in T.O
He'll be back and starting next season 18 51.43%
He'll be traded or amnestied this summer (won't be back) 12 34.29%
Will be back as a backup next season 5 14.29%
Voters: 35. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-23-2012, 12:27 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Holy crap, this is getting as old as the Bargs threads.
What Bargs threads?
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:41 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Nope. Collison is a run of the mill PG. Average. We need above average.
and how exactly are you going to get that above average PG?
The FA market outside deron is spotty and the draft has no really good PGs.

We may be able to get one of Houston's PGs, but that's not going to be easy and I don't know if dragic or even lowry are really a long term solution. An upgrade for sure, and lowry is a clear starter, but would you throw 10+ at him if that's his market?

I'd rather bide my time until next summer and ride jose's last year of the contract. Supposedly the next draft is better in PGs.
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:50 PM   #23 (permalink)
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and how exactly are you going to get that above average PG?
The FA market outside deron is spotty and the draft has no really good PGs.

We may be able to get one of Houston's PGs, but that's not going to be easy and I don't know if dragic or even lowry are really a long term solution. An upgrade for sure, and lowry is a clear starter, but would you throw 10+ at him if that's his market?

I'd rather bide my time until next summer and ride jose's last year of the contract. Supposedly the next draft is better in PGs.
Yep. Go for Deron hard, and if he declines, continue with Jose. Perhaps try to find him a better backup option than Bayless, but maybe not even that. The only problem with this approach is that the team is going to be much better next season and will likely be in playoffs contention, so the chances of drafting the PG of the future would be greatly diminished.
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:55 PM   #24 (permalink)
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What Bargs threads?
The non-stop threads aboutBbargs that went on all last year and the year before... and all off-season. I figured that would of been obvious...
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:56 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I was actually in support of trading Jose this past season, but he had a GREAT year, and I think, next year, being on a contract year, we'll see an even better Jose.

I think for facility's sake, it would be good to keep him next year. Casey found a way to hide him a lot better on defense, and I think he will be good for another year, with regards to increasing production for Amir, Bargs, JJ, DeMar, and may even facilitate Jonas, too.

On one hand, I'd like an upgrade at the PG position, but on the other, we have much more glaring needs, and I can see Jose being a PG on a playoff team - which is what we're building towards.

If we can sign a bigger/better FA PG, then I'm all for that (Nash, Deron (yeah right), or trade for someone like Rondo), but if not, I'm fine with either a deadline deal next year, or letting Jose expire, and re-signing him to a backup's contract.
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Old 04-23-2012, 12:57 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Jose's expring contract is attractive, but I can't see a team that needs a player of his ilk being a compatible trade partner.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:07 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Jose's expring contract is attractive, but I can't see a team that needs a player of his ilk being a compatible trade partner.
which teams would be interested that wouldn't be compatble trade partners?
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:45 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Can someone fill me in as to who will play PG when Jose leaves? You can't trade him and get a better PG back. There's no PG in the draft better than him. Dragic, Deron and Nash are all long shots at best.

If you want to tank again next year, sure, go ahead and amnesty him. If you want to make a push for the playoffs you need him.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:47 PM   #29 (permalink)
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If you want to tank again next year, sure, go ahead and amnesty him. If you want to make a push for the playoffs you need him.
yeah, because we've been so successful with him.
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Old 04-23-2012, 01:51 PM   #30 (permalink)
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yeah, because we've been so successful with him.
You keep making this argument, so I suppose I will address it. 1/12th of your roster does not in and of itself determine your result. If you think Jose has been the weakest link, the factor holding us back, I think you need to re-address your position.

Jose is far from perfect, but unless I'm presented with a better alternative (which I'd love, but as stated, is a long shot), why are we getting rid of him?
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:00 PM   #31 (permalink)
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You keep making this argument, so I suppose I will address it. 1/12th of your roster does not in and of itself determine your result. If you think Jose has been the weakest link, the factor holding us back, I think you need to re-address your position.

Jose is far from perfect, but unless I'm presented with a better alternative (which I'd love, but as stated, is a long shot), why are we getting rid of him?
who says we are getting rid of him? Even when we had pretty good teams we've underachieved other then 06-07 season. The last season we had a shot at the playoffs he was outplayed by Jarrett Jack, then he sucked coming off the bench and was given his starting spot back, we then promptly lost our playoff position. The last couple years he's been inconsistent and has had injury problems, this season he has raised his stock and he's finally worth trading. Now, if a better PG can't be brought in then sure keep him but that's not up to us. It's now up to BC to upgrade the PG position along with the SF position.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:01 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grizz View Post
You keep making this argument, so I suppose I will address it. 1/12th of your roster does not in and of itself determine your result. If you think Jose has been the weakest link, the factor holding us back, I think you need to re-address your position.

Jose is far from perfect, but unless I'm presented with a better alternative (which I'd love, but as stated, is a long shot), why are we getting rid of him?
If by "we" you mean people on this forum who keep repeating "yeah, because we've been so successful with him" argument, then we are not really getting rid of anyone.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:06 PM   #33 (permalink)
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then we are not really getting rid of anyone.
Anyone?
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:07 PM   #34 (permalink)
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who says we are getting rid of him? The last couple years he's been inconsistent and has had injury problems, this season he has raised his stock and he's finally worth trading. Now, if a better PG can't be brought in then sure keep him but that's not up to us. It's now up to BC to upgrade the PG position along with the SF position.
I am very confused. You advocated trading or amnestying him. Right after asking "who says we're getting rid of him", you discuss trading him?

I agree completely that Jose has flaws, and if BC can move him and get an upgrade at the PG position, please do so. I just don't see a feasible plan for that. You're essentially stuck with him unless you convince Dragic, Nash or Deron to come here. None of which I think most people would put at even a 50/50 proposition. I cannot watch a season with Bayless at the helm of our team.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:08 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Anyone?
Ok, Jeff, name a player on the Raptors you can get rid of?
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:09 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Ok, Jeff, name a player on the Raptors you can get rid of?
Dude, if we can trade Turkeypoo anyone is tradeable. Besides we have what 6-7 free agents......don't need to get rid of them at all. lol
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:14 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Dude, if we can trade Turkeypoo anyone is tradeable. Besides we have what 6-7 free agents......don't need to get rid of them at all. lol
Never mind. I was attempting a joke, basically suggesting that it's the Raptors' management who'd be making personnel decisions and not Raptors Forum posters, and so it's unlikely that they'd trade away or amnesty Jose without ensuring a better player is going to be playing the position next season.

Forget the whole thing, I hope Grizz got it.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:42 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Never mind. I was attempting a joke, basically suggesting that it's the Raptors' management who'd be making personnel decisions and not Raptors Forum posters, and so it's unlikely that they'd trade away or amnesty Jose without ensuring a better player is going to be playing the position next season.

Forget the whole thing, I hope Grizz got it.
I said as much already, but whatever....

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Now, if a better PG can't be brought in then sure keep him but that's not up to us. It's now up to BC to upgrade the PG position along with the SF position.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:32 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Yep. Go for Deron hard, and if he declines, continue with Jose. Perhaps try to find him a better backup option than Bayless, but maybe not even that. The only problem with this approach is that the team is going to be much better next season and will likely be in playoffs contention, so the chances of drafting the PG of the future would be greatly diminished.
I would be ok with going after someone like lowry

it's extremely unlikely we'll ever get a guy like paul/rose etc, so having a solid all around PG is not a bad option.

PG is a position where you can easily get away with not having an all-star, as long as you have an all-star wing. IMO, the sine qua non for a title contender is an elite big and an elite wing. An elite PG like Paul can hide a lot of the problems in your roster, but when it's all said and done, how often do really good PGs win titles?

The other thing is, PGs are the easiest to get deep in the draft. A ton of quality point guards were drafted in the mid/high teens recently, because teams rarely overreach for point guards. After the sure prospects are gone, you will see a lot of so called "high potential" bigs and wings get drafted.

So I'm also quite ok with calderon, I would definitely not break the bank to go after lowry or dragic. If we have to overpay, let's do it at the other positions ...
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:37 PM   #40 (permalink)
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as for nash, I really don't like that option, even though part of me would be ecstatic if we get him. it's like tanking, during games you hate when they're losing, but after an hour you hate that they won ...

the problem with nash is that he has at most 2 seasons, so he's a stop gap during which he'll tie up a ton of our cap space and compromise our draft chances next summer. He'll almost certainly get us in the playoffs, but we won't win anything in the next 2 years even if we'd get chris paul.

As far as development of other players, not sure I buy this argument. Nash could definitely increase the value of our players and will make them look better, but in terms of actual improvement, I don't see it.
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