Grantland: Raptors late game awfulness

jeffb · 11-27-2012, 02:22 PM

Quote:

1. Toronto's Late-Game Awfulness

Toronto is 1-7 in games in which the scoring margin has been at three or fewer points anytime in the last three minutes of regulation or overtime, per NBA.com. They are a league-worst -41 in those games, with the latest indignity coming in Sunday's double-overtime loss to the Spurs, which featured a five-second violation and Dwane Casey's puzzling decision to sit an active Ed Davis in favor of an ice-cold Andrea Bargnani.

Bad luck has played a role here; remember George Hill's buzzer-beating floater, Charlotte's uncalled foul on a potential Bargnani buzzer-beater, and Al Jefferson's game-tying 3-pointer — the second triple of his career? Injuries to Landry Fields and Alan Anderson have also limited Casey's ability to match up with small lineups in specific late-game situations.

But some of his substitution patterns have been puzzling, including over-playing Bargnani and showing little trust in Jonas Valanciunas and Terrence Ross — even when those guys are going well. A lack of faith in rookies is understandable, but some of Toronto's weaker off-ball defenders — Bargnani, Jose Calderon, and DeMar DeRozan — have really hurt the Raps in crunch-time possessions.

What if the Sixers didn't trade for Andrew Bynum? - Grantland

FLO · 11-27-2012, 02:39 PM

We really should be 0-8 in late-game situations. Our one win we scored 5 points in the 4th quarter. Only by some miracle Indy was equally terrible.

In terms of our defense in the 4th, I've seen horrible play from every single Raptor. As much as it pains me to admit, I can't just blame Bargs or Calderon for it. It's a team failure.

jeffb · 11-27-2012, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLO

I can't just blame Bargs or Calderon for it. It's a team failure.

I can, our two worst defenders should not both be on the floor down the stretch. It kills us!

carp · 11-27-2012, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLO

We really should be 0-8 in late-game situations. Our one win we scored 5 points in the 4th quarter. Only by some miracle Indy was equally terrible.

In terms of our defense in the 4th, I've seen horrible play from every single Raptor. As much as it pains me to admit, I can't just blame Bargs or Calderon for it. It's a team failure.

Agreed, also, our offensive execution is lacking in the 4th. We get bogged down and forget to run the system.

It always feels like we don't have guys that can hit big shots....

LX · 11-27-2012, 03:26 PM

I've been wondering if there is a Triano-like trend to have all the early running end up killing the legs of shooters and defenders by the time the 4th quarter comes along.

MikeToronto · 11-27-2012, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp

Agreed, also, our offensive execution is lacking in the 4th. We get bogged down and forget to run the system.

It always feels like we don't have guys that can hit big shots....

Right on. Raps don't have much of an offensive system to begin with, so when they get tired by the fourth and the other teams take away the early and predictable offensive options, they start to really suck. Personally, if a team plays better through the first three than in the fourth consistently, I'd blame the coaching staff.

Raptors74 · 11-27-2012, 03:33 PM

we have no halfcourt offense whatsoever

**Claudius** · 11-27-2012, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

I can, our two worst defenders should not both be on the floor down the stretch. It kills us!

Defense hasn't been the issue though. It's been execution (as carp mentioned).

Too many times we're settling for jumpers. That's what I've been saying. We're not cutting towards the basket. We're not moving off the ball. Heck, sometimes it's like we're playing iso and clearing out but some of the other guys aren't aware that's what's going on.

MikeToronto · 11-27-2012, 03:37 PM

Wow, a lot of people agreeing on something.

carp · 11-27-2012, 03:41 PM

As has been said, it does seem that we take what the D gives us despite the fact that they're giving us what we should not be content with. LX may be on to something, though I think we're seeing a mental fatigue, an unwillingness to not settle and push for what we can actually get. As Claudius mentioned, too many lazy jumpers.... Bargnani included but not solely him either.

FLO · 11-27-2012, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp

Agreed, also, our offensive execution is lacking in the 4th. We get bogged down and forget to run the system.

It always feels like we don't have guys that can hit big shots....

They can hit big shots, but our offense is really poor and ball movement terrible. The majority of our "big shots" that we need are difficult shots to begin with and would miss anyways. On top of that we don't have a superstar talent who can go beyond that, so we're asking a couple of players who aren't superstars to play like superstars.

Dario · 11-27-2012, 03:52 PM

yup, no late game execution.. we fall a part.

CobraKing · 11-27-2012, 03:59 PM

You'd need a top level coach to make anything out of the talent we have. Rick Carlisle with the Pistons & Pacers comes to mind - but his players were alot more grittier. Hubie Brown did a fantastic job with the Grizzlies too.

Wasn't Avery Johnson available around the same time they hired Casey?

jeffb · 11-27-2012, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CobraKing

You'd need a top level coach to make anything out of the talent we have. Rick Carlisle with the Pistons & Pacers comes to mind - but his players were alot more grittier. Hubie Brown did a fantastic job with the Grizzlies too.

Wasn't Avery Johnson available around the same time they hired Casey?

No, if i recall correctly it came down to Lawrence Frank or Dwane Casey. Avery Johnson was already in NJ at the time.

CobraKing · 11-27-2012, 04:03 PM

Thanks for clarifying - at this stage I'd welcome Butch Carter back, but he looks like he'd stir up some more trouble with management.

KoolAid · 11-27-2012, 04:46 PM

Avery Johnson is poop.

raptor123 · 11-27-2012, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLO

We really should be 0-8 in late-game situations. Our one win we scored 5 points in the 4th quarter. Only by some miracle Indy was equally terrible.

In terms of our defense in the 4th, I've seen horrible play from every single Raptor. As much as it pains me to admit, I can't just blame Bargs or Calderon for it. It's a team failure.

Its team defence thats hurting us. We are suppoesed to be better this year we have Lowry.....but then he runs all over the place ...hes a dog a pitbull...Casey still has to address this just like he keeps throwing out Bargs out there he does the same with our hero. Casey will get it going we will be on a winning streak come christmas !

jeffb · 11-27-2012, 06:37 PM

Can't keep puting Bargnani and Calderon on the floor at the same time late in games. The defense those two give us puts way too much pressure on everyone else, one of them being a rookie. It kills us everytime, and sorry but the Lowry/Calderon combo to end games doesn't work either.

Trade the two ole's.

raptor123 · 11-27-2012, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

Can't keep puting Bargnani and Calderon on the floor at the same time late in games. The defense those two give us puts way too much pressure on everyone else, one of them being a rookie. It kills us everytime, and sorry but the Lowry/Calderon combo to end games doesn't work either.

Trade the two ole's.

Well we cant sit Lowry who will run the offence and Lowry has been getting burned late in games on d. Bargs spreads the floor and played well down the stretch on d using his length very effectively. Making shots late in games has to get better. Our d from start to finish has to get better.

**box92** · 11-27-2012, 06:54 PM

we really need to bench Bargs when he does play bad, he isnt a player who should be given a free pass to play no matter how bad he is doing

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11-27-2012, 02:39 PM	#2 (permalink)
FLO sick of the Raptors Axis of Evil: Colangelo, Casey and Bustnani Banned Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 970 Representing:	We really should be 0-8 in late-game situations. Our one win we scored 5 points in the 4th quarter. Only by some miracle Indy was equally terrible. In terms of our defense in the 4th, I've seen horrible play from every single Raptor. As much as it pains me to admit, I can't just blame Bargs or Calderon for it. It's a team failure.

11-27-2012, 03:26 PM	#5 (permalink)
LX with pink peppercorns In the Paint Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 27,540 Representing:	I've been wondering if there is a Triano-like trend to have all the early running end up killing the legs of shooters and defenders by the time the 4th quarter comes along.

11-27-2012, 03:33 PM	#7 (permalink)
Raptors74 is pounding the rock! Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Vancouver Posts: 233 Representing:	we have no halfcourt offense whatsoever

11-27-2012, 03:37 PM	#9 (permalink)
MikeToronto Gam zeh ya'avor The Gatekeeper Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 3,908 Representing:	Wow, a lot of people agreeing on something.

11-27-2012, 03:41 PM	#10 (permalink)
carp . Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Toronto Posts: 11,485 Representing:	As has been said, it does seem that we take what the D gives us despite the fact that they're giving us what we should not be content with. LX may be on to something, though I think we're seeing a mental fatigue, an unwillingness to not settle and push for what we can actually get. As Claudius mentioned, too many lazy jumpers.... Bargnani included but not solely him either.

11-27-2012, 03:52 PM	#12 (permalink)
Dario straight ballin' Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 8,146 Representing:	yup, no late game execution.. we fall a part.

11-27-2012, 03:59 PM	#13 (permalink)
CobraKing is rooting for the Raptors! Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Toronto Posts: 238 Representing:	You'd need a top level coach to make anything out of the talent we have. Rick Carlisle with the Pistons & Pacers comes to mind - but his players were alot more grittier. Hubie Brown did a fantastic job with the Grizzlies too. Wasn't Avery Johnson available around the same time they hired Casey?

11-27-2012, 04:03 PM	#15 (permalink)
CobraKing is rooting for the Raptors! Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Toronto Posts: 238 Representing:	Thanks for clarifying - at this stage I'd welcome Butch Carter back, but he looks like he'd stir up some more trouble with management.

11-27-2012, 04:46 PM	#16 (permalink)
KoolAid If I ruled the world... Sippin' On Myself Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Yes Posts: 3,600 Representing:	Avery Johnson is poop.

11-27-2012, 06:37 PM	#18 (permalink)
jeffb is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: YO MAMMA Posts: 72,847 Representing:	Can't keep puting Bargnani and Calderon on the floor at the same time late in games. The defense those two give us puts way too much pressure on everyone else, one of them being a rookie. It kills us everytime, and sorry but the Lowry/Calderon combo to end games doesn't work either. Trade the two ole's.

11-27-2012, 06:54 PM	#20 (permalink)
box92 Follow @raptorsforum on twitter Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 6,268 Representing:	we really need to bench Bargs when he does play bad, he isnt a player who should be given a free pass to play no matter how bad he is doing