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-   -   Grange: Raps To Battle It Out For Bottom Playoff Spots (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/grange-raps-battle-out-bottom-playoff-spots-2552.html)

Dr. J. Naismith 07-07-2008 12:38 PM

Grange: Raps To Battle It Out For Bottom Playoff Spots
 
Hmm.... yet another Raptors writer claiming that we'll be battling it out in the bottom tier of the Eastern Conference playoff draw. :(

Ah well, I guess people underestimating us is better than claiming we're one of the best teams now. :mischief:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Grange
I'm back. I know I said I'd be back last Wednesday, but what can I say? I'd sit down in front of the keyboard and just couldn't bring myself to blog. Sometimes you just get tired of seeing yourself think. This week should be a bit steadier. After all, it is the first week of the 2008-09 season, and I'm already excited at the prospect of the Bulls, Heat, Bucks, Sixers and Raptors battling it out for at the bottom half of the Eastern Conference playoff draw. Word is we're going to get to meet Hassan Adams this week, potentially and while Wednesday is going to be Jose Calderon/Jermaine O'Neal day. The new Chuck Swirsky may also be announced word is its this guy.

Source - Click here

Superjudge 07-07-2008 01:04 PM

Grange kills me.

Honestly

jeffb 07-07-2008 01:07 PM

Excited for the prspects of the Bulls/Heat?Two teams that didn't make the playoffs last season.In fact alot of people were saying the same thing last year at this time about the Bulls who were picked by many to go deep into the playoffs.Some picked them to go to the finals over the Celtics & Pistons.:stars:

Major 07-07-2008 01:15 PM

Quote:

After all, it is the first week of the 2008-09 season, and I'm already excited at the prospect of the Bulls, Heat, Bucks, Sixers and Raptors battling it out for at the bottom half of the Eastern Conference playoff draw.
I'm still trying to get this part here. So they're saying that we will be battling with with the bottom 3 teams of last season? What the hell is this guy talking about here. Clearly those teams are going to be in the bottom 5 and clearly we will be no where near them. And now all the sudden the Sixers, the team with the most cap space right now is going to be battling for a play-off spot??

Is this guy okay or...?

Dr. J. Naismith 07-07-2008 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Major (Post 41636)
Clearly those teams are going to be in the bottom 5 and clearly we will be no where near them. And now all the sudden the Sixers, the team with the most cap space right now is going to be battling for a play-off spot??

Is this guy okay or...?

No, Grange isn't that far off Major. Heat and Bulls both had off seasons and will certainly be back in the mix again this season that's if both teams can remain healthy. Bucks are the same with the addition of RJ. They will certainly push for a playoff spot. And the Sixers will definitely be strong assuming they retain Miller or find a nice substitute for Andre to run the point for Philly. Sixers are darkhorses again.

We're definitely going to be in tough next season. :(

Claudius 07-07-2008 01:40 PM

I dunno Doc. I think the Heat are still a mess. Beasley will be good, but I don't expect him to be a dominante force. Marion is a good player and there are still a lot of questions about Wade and his health. They don't have a PG and they don't really have a centre, and they don't have a bench.

The Bulls are enigma. They could do really really well or because Del Negro is a question mark as a coach, really really poorly. The Bucks gained RJ and have Redd but who is going to run that team? Who comes off the bench? Who's their PF?

We're in a LOT better of a situtation than those teams and even if Philly does improve that doesn't mean they'll be better than us. I think right now we're a solid SG away from being in the upper tier of the conference. I really don't see Clevleand being that much better than us at the moment.

LX 07-07-2008 02:03 PM

The more I see Grange think the less I respect his opinion. I would say that a lot of teams are in the mix, but to put the Raptors in that class is just overthinking. OK so maybe he wants to say that we won't be battling Orlando, Cleveland, Boston and Detroit - but even that looks past all kinds of stuff like how unbalanced the Cavs are, how much Detroit is looking to change and all under a new untested coach, and the fact that Orlando saw very few injuries last season.

To me he has just caught wind of all of the overall negativity out there and he's riding it, which is a shame since he can be good at looking at the big picture in a balanced manner. The problem is that Toronto fans will accuse you of being in bed with the team if you approach things rationally and fail to join in on their whine-fest. I really think he's looking to appeal to those folks more than he's suggesting that the other teams on his list stand to rise that much, which I have much less of a problem with.

Gurk 07-07-2008 02:04 PM

the rap battling it out for the last spot?
this guy is a retard
he should get hit in the head with something to knock that sense back in

'trane 07-07-2008 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gurkang (Post 41663)
the rap battling it out for the last spot?
this guy is a retard
he should get hit in the head with something to knock that sense back in

please don't use the word 'retard' in that way gurkang. It doesn't mean stupid. this is insulting and degrading.

further, you can't hit someone with an intellectual disability in the head to knock some sense back in. i know it's a figure of speach, but it's insensitive and feeds on negative stereotypes.

thank you.

Gurk 07-07-2008 02:23 PM

srry:dead:

jeffb 07-07-2008 02:27 PM

Granger is a dolt.If you've ever heard him speak, he constantly pauses and ahhhhhhhhhhh's and sounds like he has marbles in his mouth.It's as if he's written his answers down and can't remember or find them.
He's a tool!:vomit-smiley-020:

rapsfan087 07-07-2008 02:29 PM

Cavs have Lebron, Dummars has said he is only trading his players for players with the same level and Orlando won us badly this season ... Grange isn't so wrong, last year Phil only played well the second half of the season and they almost stole our spot. If Hawks keep the Joshes, they are only going to improve, Miami went through all the bad things a team can go ... and we went worse than previous season and this season we don't know how we are going to do.

I can see why Grange said that.

Adequate Swag 07-07-2008 02:30 PM

It's just a prediction...and it's not that wildly off.

Do I disagree? Yes. But no more than I disagree with the writer (ESPN the mag, I think) who said the Raptors will make the ECF.

Every team listed there (Bulls, Heat, Bucks) is improved. Philly will be much improved if they sign Smith. If they don't, then Atlanta will remain in the mix, and Philly will still be pretty decent.

Boston and Detroit (barring major moves or injuries) are likely going to be near the top without question. Then you have second tier teams like Cleveland, Orlando and Toronto, who really aren't all that far ahead of the next tier consisting of Philly, Atlanta, Milwaukee and Miami. And then there's teams like New Jersey, Chicago and Charlotte who could push for the playoffs if things go right for them.

So while I wouldn't predict the Raptors to finish in the bottom part of the conference (my guess would be 4th or 5th) it could easily happen.

I agree with LX though, that Grange didn't really explore the possibility that Toronto could move up in the standings. Cleveland and Orlando are certainly teams Toronto could move on, and possibly Detroit if they follow through on the roster shake up Dumars talked about (or even if they don't)

The East is tight this year. Boston is the class of the conference, and after that it's a bit of a toss up. Injuries to major players will play a key role, as will any moves made over the rest of the summer.

So while he's not wrong to express that the Raps COULD be fighting for a playoff spot (given that it seems many of us, as fans, are penciling the Raps in for a top 4 spot already) he is wrong to not suggest the potential for a move upward as well. Anything can happen.

Major 07-07-2008 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41683)
Every team listed there (Bulls, Heat, Bucks) is improved. Philly will be much improved if they sign Smith. If they don't, then Atlanta will remain in the mix, and Philly will still be pretty decent.

Without a doubt, Philly will be high up there this season. It's when he says teams like Bulls, Heat, Bucks will make the playoffs. I realize that there's a good chance that maybe 1-2 or those will actually make the playoffs but just because you get a great, promising draft pick, doesn't mean the next season you're going to shoot up 12 spots in the league standings. Just ask the Pittsburgh Penguins when they signed Crosby in 2005, the next season they finished 2nd last. Look at Charlotte when they draft Okafor in 2004, they finished 5th last the next year.

Adequate Swag 07-07-2008 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Major (Post 41687)
Without a doubt, Philly will be high up there this season. It's when he says teams like Bulls, Heat, Bucks will make the playoffs. I realize that there's a good chance that maybe 1-2 or those will actually make the playoffs but just because you get a great, promising draft pick, doesn't mean the next season you're going to shoot up 12 spots in the league standings. Just ask the Pittsburgh Penguins when they signed Crosby in 2005, the next season they finished 2nd last. Look at Charlotte when they draft Okafor in 2004, they finished 5th last the next year.

The Penguins didn't feature two other All Stars, one being a top 5-10 player in the league.

The Bobcats were a recent expansion franchise, not a recent NBA champion.

You seem to equate making the playoffs with some meteoric rise. Milwaukee and Chicago weren't that far out last year, and both teams added an impact player to their starting line up. Miami was way out, but they were playing without their two best players for the majority of the year.

No one is saying Michael Beasley or Derrick Rose immediately put a team in the playoffs. But Miami (when healthy) was already a playoff team before they pulled off the Shaq/Marion heist, and New Jersey, Milwaukee and Chicago weren't that far off in the first place.

He never said any of those teams will for sure make the playoffs. he said, going into the season, that there are plenty of teams fighting for the bottom playoff spots in the East.

He's absolutely right about that.

Major 07-07-2008 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41755)
The Penguins didn't feature two other All Stars, one being a top 5-10 player in the league.

Mario Lemieux? Evgeni Malkin?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41755)
You seem to equate making the playoffs with some meteoric rise. Milwaukee and Chicago weren't that far out last year, and both teams added an impact player to their starting line up. Miami was way out, but they were playing without their two best players for the majority of the year.

Milwaukee and Chicago weren't that far out? Dude, they were 2 of the 3 worst teams in the league, one of that was actually THE worst.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41755)
He never said any of those teams will for sure make the playoffs. he said, going into the season, that there are plenty of teams fighting for the bottom playoff spots in the East.

He's absolutely right about that.

Well obviously there are going to be teams fighting for a playoff spot. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out.

Adequate Swag 07-07-2008 06:08 PM

Don't think you can slip hockey misinformation by me! Evgeni Malkin didn't come over until the year AFTER Crosby. Lemieux, at whatever age he was at (35+) and with all his inuries was hardly a star player. Do you consider Gary Payton a star? How about Scotty Pippen in his last couple seasons?

So that point was, you know, totally erroneous.

Chicago finished 4 games out of a playoff spot. Milwaukee was further back, but added an all star player. Neither of those teams was amongst the worst in the league. Miami was, but if you read what I wrote before, they have good reason to expect to fight for a playoff spot this year, so I'm not going to bother re-stating that.

And if it doesn't take a genius to figure out my last point, why is everyone arguing with it when Grange said it?

Major 07-07-2008 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41765)
And if it doesn't take a genius to figure out my last point, why is everyone arguing with it when Grange said it?

Because Grange was saying that WE would be battling for a playoff spot. Which is totally fucked up seeing as we're a better team than last year. And last year we came 6th. So if we're a better team, how the hell would we be battling for a playoff spot??

:frustrated:

Adequate Swag 07-07-2008 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Major (Post 41768)
Because Grange was saying that WE would be battling for a playoff spot. Which is totally fucked up seeing as we're a better team than last year. And last year we came 6th. So if we're a better team, how the hell would we be battling for a playoff spot??

:frustrated:

Because every other team improved too?

You know, as I've been saying in my past few posts...

Major 07-07-2008 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adequate Swag (Post 41770)
Because every other team improved too?

You know, as I've been saying in my past few posts...

Oh please, the 4 teams that really improved in the East, and might make a little bit of a difference are Philly, Chicago, Miami, and Toronto. I would say Minnesota for picking up Mayo but I don't think he'd be that much of an impact.


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