The Five Biggest IF's in the East - Re: Jermaine - Page 4
Old 08-14-2008, 03:51 PM   #61 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollo View Post
Thats total overkill. The guy was playing on one leg last year. He's one of the purest shooters in the league and he may have the fastest release...Throw in that he's 7ft and you've got a dangerous shooter. Now that he has two legs to get under his shot with he will bounce back. No miracle required.
How can you base what you said off one year? lol one of the purest shooters in the league with the fastest release?? man oh man.

He had one DECENT at best year, and that proves he is one of the best, he has one terrible year, and its 10 excuses, but he is still one of the best. Damn i wanna have leeway like Andrea at my job. Pure shooters dont hit the front of the rim so much, or get so little arch on their shot, or get so little lift when shooting.

BTW if you ever saw the Kapono video of his doing 3s with like .4 seconds on the clock, you know who has the fastest release in the league :P
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 03:54 PM   #62 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

How can Bargs be better right now when Rasho was clearly more useful in EVERY facet of the game last year, defensively, rebounding, scoring, leadership, boxing out etc etc etc, name it.

Just because you choose to give a guy that was originally the starter on the team, got bumped to the bench, a million excuses, oh his poor legs, he couldnt breath, he couldnt do this or that. He was well enough to play, most of the time he didnt play hard and committed silly fouls and Sam pulled the plug on him.

Love Sam or hate him, he knows what effort is, and if you give none, you get benched, like Bargs last year. If his shot isnt falling, he gives up on the rest of the game and becomes a plague on the court, thats not the sign of a great player, great players find other ways to contribute, unless of course you count getting 3 cheap fouls in a few min contributing :P
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 06:21 PM   #63 (permalink)
LX
with pink peppercorns

In the Paint


 
LX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 27,533
Representing:
Default

Understood Ugo - but remember that Rasho was not entirely useful in every lineup. He looked very nice alongside TJ. Without TJ, his overall effectiveness dropped off to the point where I really believe that he had to move to the starting lineup to be with TJ more than Bargnani needed to go to the bench to recoup. And when that couldn't be worked out, we saw DNP's from Rasho. Bargnani relies much less on who else is around him in order to get his game off. And he did box out and defend. He didn't get the numbers with respect to rebounding, but he did his job in boxing out.
LX is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 07:16 PM   #64 (permalink)
kicking himself for being so emotionally invested in the Roller-coaster Raptors

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,458
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claudius View Post
I think we'll miss Rasho more defensively than we think. He became a solid, solid anchor and he always played his position really well. And if you notice, he's always talking, always aware where he is on the court. The offense that he provided last year was a big, big bonus.
Absolutely, though replacing him with Jermaine in the starting lineup softens the blow.

Rasho is in the haloed company of players like Clifford Robinson, guys who, every single team they were on made the playoffs. Cliffy's game of unselfishness on O and busting his ass on D was always an underrated factor for his teams making the playoffs. Rasho was berated as a "token white center" for so long when in reality he was always an anchor at both sides of the court. His scoring ability was crap but his spacing and intangibles were through the roof. He knows how to box out, set picks and space the floor better than the rest of our roster combined.
BballWatcher is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 07:18 PM   #65 (permalink)
kicking himself for being so emotionally invested in the Roller-coaster Raptors

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,458
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adequate Swag View Post
I too was speaking in the NOW

As in, as of August 14, 2008, Andrea Bargnani is a better basketball player than Rasho Nesterovic.

If you read my essay, I presented a number of points that had nothing to do with potential, none of which you have addressed.

I certainly hope you aren't accusing me of not reading your posts, seeing as it seems you chose to ignore my entire argument.
I disagree, and Andrea is in a "prove it to me" stage in my opinion. He regressed from his rookie season, and I'm not willing to pin it all on injuries/excuses yet.
BballWatcher is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 07:21 PM   #66 (permalink)
is dead inside

you ain't bout that life
 
Gurk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,017
Representing:
Default

Yea if Bargs can't prove that he is good this season
IT's Bye Bye Bargnani
Gurk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 08:14 PM   #67 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
How can you base what you said off one year? lol one of the purest shooters in the league with the fastest release?? man oh man.

He had one DECENT at best year, and that proves he is one of the best, he has one terrible year, and its 10 excuses, but he is still one of the best. Damn i wanna have leeway like Andrea at my job. Pure shooters dont hit the front of the rim so much, or get so little arch on their shot, or get so little lift when shooting.

BTW if you ever saw the Kapono video of his doing 3s with like .4 seconds on the clock, you know who has the fastest release in the league :P
I never once said he was one of the best. I said he is one of the purest shooters in the league and he has a quick release. I'm not the only one. Its been well documented in the media, many people think this. He has a fundamentally sound, lightning quick release. He didn't hit shots last year because his legs weren't into his shots due to injuries. Thats a fatal flaw for the best of shooters. If Kapono didn't get his legs into his shots he would not be a great shooter. Speaking of Kapono, yes, he can get if out quickly but... In the end it all comes down to comfort and Andrea's natural shot is faster than Kapono's.

Moral of the story: shot consistency comes for the legs. You'll see even the best of shooters decline in FG% when they log huge minutes and its because their legs get tired.

One might pose the question why are you hating on him after only ONE bad season...

Last edited by Apollo; 08-14-2008 at 08:19 PM.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 08:43 PM   #68 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollo View Post
I never once said he was one of the best. I said he is one of the purest shooters in the league and he has a quick release. I'm not the only one. Its been well documented in the media, many people think this. He has a fundamentally sound, lightning quick release. He didn't hit shots last year because his legs weren't into his shots due to injuries. Thats a fatal flaw for the best of shooters. If Kapono didn't get his legs into his shots he would not be a great shooter. Speaking of Kapono, yes, he can get if out quickly but... In the end it all comes down to comfort and Andrea's natural shot is faster than Kapono's.

Moral of the story: shot consistency comes for the legs. You'll see even the best of shooters decline in FG% when they log huge minutes and its because their legs get tired.

One might pose the question why are you hating on him after only ONE bad season...
good post.

As for your question, his rookie season wasnt exactly mindblowing, he was decent, i wasnt like, wow, this guy is gonna be a superstar one day, like many people here seem to think. But last year, it was worse then i thought possible. He seems so one dimensional for a guy everyone touts as multi talented, he gets like no assists, so few boards, and for a guy as quick as everyone is claiming, he sure sucks at help D, and finishing around the rim (for a 7footer to not finish with dunks is inexcusable).
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2008, 10:16 PM   #69 (permalink)
is dead inside

you ain't bout that life
 
Gurk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,017
Representing:
Default

Yea thts right a 7 footer should finish around the rim with ease
Gurk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2008, 01:11 AM   #70 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post


good post.

As for your question, his rookie season wasnt exactly mindblowing, he was decent, i wasnt like, wow, this guy is gonna be a superstar one day, like many people here seem to think. But last year, it was worse then i thought possible. He seems so one dimensional for a guy everyone touts as multi talented, he gets like no assists, so few boards, and for a guy as quick as everyone is claiming, he sure sucks at help D, and finishing around the rim (for a 7footer to not finish with dunks is inexcusable).
His rookie season was solid on offense. He was one of the top rookies that year. He played tremendous ball in the second half of that season until he had to go under the knife. Then in the off-season he played an insane amount of competitive ball, never allowed himself to rest and then recondition himself for the upcoming season. His poor play for Italy, as a result of this, was a foreshadowing of things to come. This off-season he's recovered 100%. He's rested himself adequately and he's been training with a lot of great people. He's been focusing on big man skills and lifting weights; his biggest weaknesses. I believe his shot will be there this season because he's healthy and judging by his off-season game plan I would assume he feels the same... And I agree, he needs to flush home more of garbage but he wasn't exactly the only one struggling with that. He needs to go up strong more often and at least draw contact.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2008, 01:47 AM   #71 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollo View Post
His rookie season was solid on offense. He was one of the top rookies that year. He played tremendous ball in the second half of that season until he had to go under the knife. Then in the off-season he played an insane amount of competitive ball, never allowed himself to rest and then recondition himself for the upcoming season. His poor play for Italy, as a result of this, was a foreshadowing of things to come. This off-season he's recovered 100%. He's rested himself adequately and he's been training with a lot of great people. He's been focusing on big man skills and lifting weights; his biggest weaknesses. I believe his shot will be there this season because he's healthy and judging by his off-season game plan I would assume he feels the same... And I agree, he needs to flush home more of garbage but he wasn't exactly the only one struggling with that. He needs to go up strong more often and at least draw contact.
Also, lose some baby fat? How many years as a pro til you get in top shape? How many number 1 picks after 2 years look so flabby?
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2008, 08:32 AM   #72 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Superjudge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,593
Representing:
Default

You have no clue Kid.

Honestly.
Superjudge is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2008, 01:01 PM   #73 (permalink)
Scrub City

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 744
Representing:
Default

On the topic of barg's shot, does anyone else notice that whenever he is having trouble with it in games the arch is very flat? I can tell right away whether or not his 3's are going to drain right on release. They are so flat its almost impossible for them to go in.
t-bag is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2008, 01:44 PM   #74 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

You're right and from what I can tell those times are when he doesn't have his legs into it. The further from the basket, the more important the legs become.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2008, 01:57 PM   #75 (permalink)
landry fields forever

Administrator

 
Acie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Living in a van down by the river
Posts: 21,593
Representing:
Default

When both your legs ache it's hard to put much into your shot.
Acie is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2008, 02:49 PM   #76 (permalink)
is dead inside

you ain't bout that life
 
Gurk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,017
Representing:
Default

Yea that is so true when he has trouble with his shot he never has arch
Gurk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Biggest surprise so far? jeffb Toronto Raptors 42 01-21-2010 07:43 PM
Who will get the biggest extension (per year) moremilk Toronto Raptors 14 07-07-2009 09:11 AM
Lebron, the biggest loser Ball Don't Lie NBA Talk 53 06-01-2009 11:48 PM
I may be the biggest moron ever, but... Ugo Ferst Toronto Raptors 33 08-15-2008 01:54 PM
Raptors biggest downfall? Thug Toronto Raptors 2 03-15-2008 10:59 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24