ESPN: Real +/- - Page 2
Old 04-08-2014, 12:50 AM   #21 (permalink)
payin Dwyane Wade

Senior Member
 
JoeyJoJo Shabbadu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 5,050
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by niggles View Post
Or like anyone else, you could just click on the link that starts jeff's post and read the chart.
It said earlier I needed to be an ESPN insider muttonhead. You think I would post it without trying? Good lord. But thanks for your sarcasm because it does work now on a different pc now though

Anyway... biggest shocker I see by position is Ricky Rubio. Not even sure how to beleive it.

Last edited by JoeyJoJo Shabbadu; 04-08-2014 at 12:54 AM.
JoeyJoJo Shabbadu is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 05:38 AM   #22 (permalink)
a nacho hound

Senior Member
 
Toby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: South of Portland, home of the Blazers
Posts: 5,344
Representing:
Default

frickin' ESPN Blazer haters get bored sometimes

they ranked Mike Dunleavy ahead of Damian Lillard.... that's just sad
Toby is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 10:22 AM   #23 (permalink)
Is The:

Chairman of the Boards
 
gdaytday's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,475
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby View Post
frickin' ESPN Blazer haters get bored sometimes

they ranked Mike Dunleavy ahead of Damian Lillard.... that's just sad
'Ranked'...by a computer.

Looking at the optimal lineup according to this metric:

Pg: Lowry
Sg: Fields
Sf: Novak
Pf: Patterson
C: Amir

I wouldn't mind seeing that rotation from time to time.
gdaytday is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 02:36 PM   #24 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 9,651
Representing:
Default

apparently, the formula correlates very well with 2p% and with steals, which would explain why derozan and vasquez rate so poorly, as they have low steal, low fg% from 2s.
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 04:07 PM   #25 (permalink)
sticking to his guns... is stuck to his guns...

Senior Member

 
DanH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 4,721
Representing:
Default

Yeah, there was a nice article on the value of steals (possession change, usually fast break opportunities) and how they are really valuable to a team, even more-so than a made basket. So I can understand why players who excel at creating steals would rate well in plus-minus. And more efficient scoring seems obvious - and with 2's making up 75% of all shots, you'd expect that to correlate the strongest.

Of course, there are also other factors - as evidenced by Fields rating fairly well, in spite of having a terrible FG% and below average steal rate (8th on the team for the full season).
DanH is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 10:12 PM   #26 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 9,651
Representing:
Default

the things about efficient scoring is that some people were pushing the argument that demar shooting those long 2s are actually beneficial for the team as a whole, because it opens up opportunities. This stat appears to contradict that theory, while shooting bigs appear to have that kind of effect, therefore they rank pretty well despite their lower percentages, the effect is not present when it comes to wings.

I'm a bit surprised about steals, because often, players who steal a lot, also gamble a lot, which tends to lead to easy scoring on your own end. I guess not all steals are created equal, some guys who steal a lot like jennings don't rank well at all.
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2014, 11:25 PM   #27 (permalink)
sticking to his guns... is stuck to his guns...

Senior Member

 
DanH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 4,721
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moremilk View Post
the things about efficient scoring is that some people were pushing the argument that demar shooting those long 2s are actually beneficial for the team as a whole, because it opens up opportunities. This stat appears to contradict that theory, while shooting bigs appear to have that kind of effect, therefore they rank pretty well despite their lower percentages, the effect is not present when it comes to wings.

I'm a bit surprised about steals, because often, players who steal a lot, also gamble a lot, which tends to lead to easy scoring on your own end. I guess not all steals are created equal, some guys who steal a lot like jennings don't rank well at all.
Yeah, for the steals, if you miss out a bunch and give up easy baskets, your plus minus will get dragged way down, much more than a few steals, as valuable as they are, can compensate for.

Good point about wing shooting.
DanH is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24