espn eastern conference rankings - Page 2
Old 07-25-2013, 03:29 PM   #21 (permalink)
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#1 - Bargnani missed most of the season
#2 - the horrid start was because the schedule was horrible - we would have lost most of the games we lost anyway, at best there were 2 or 3 winnable games that we didn't win in that stretch.
#3 - if by teams ahead of the Raptors you mean boston, than sure. everybody else improved or stayed about the same. And some of teams behind us have improved massively.
re: #2

In my opinion, it was a combination of Bargnani and a horrid schedule.

And there were most certainly more than 2 or 3 winnable games during that stretch. Off the top of my head, Pacers on opening night, Utah in triple overtime, Charlotte on the road, San Antonio in double overtime, Nuggets on the road, and a couple of other games that were closer than the score indicated, like the Brooklyn games. I remember those Nets games being particular frustrating because we appeared to match up well, but a lack of effort killed us at critical junctures in the game.

We lost some heartbreakers that probably never would have happened if you had a combo of Hansborough, Amir, or JV out there instead of Bargnani.
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:38 PM   #22 (permalink)
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You could say that about probably 5-7 teams in the east.

And Atlanta is not overrated. They're getting back probably their 3rd best player in Lou, and replaced Josh Smith will Millsap who are probably equal in terms of production. The rest of the roster is basically the same. Detroit might be a tad overrated but I think if you can hope JV can put up 14/8 next year, 12/10 might be fair for Drummond.
Detroit has big problems in their backcourt. It has nothing to do with any JV/Drummond comparisons.
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:44 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Detroit has big problems in their backcourt. It has nothing to do with any JV/Drummond comparisons.
Agreed - I don't see Detroit making the playoffs. I could be wrong, but they've got no guards. Smith is really more of a PF too, so they are very shallow on the wings. They'll probably challenge on frontcourt talent alone though.

To me, Atlanta is destined to make it again, and Washington looked pretty good with Wall last year. That leaves one spot up for grabs between Toronto, Milwaukee (I see them falling off with the Jennings disaster), Detroit, and Cleveland. Cleveland is the biggest threat, if their signings go well. So to me it is a three team race (TO, CLE, WAS) for 7 and 8. With a good year we could leapfrog the Hawks into 6th, but that seems like best case scenario to me.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:08 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Agreed - I don't see Detroit making the playoffs. I could be wrong, but they've got no guards. Smith is really more of a PF too, so they are very shallow on the wings. They'll probably challenge on frontcourt talent alone though.

To me, Atlanta is destined to make it again, and Washington looked pretty good with Wall last year. That leaves one spot up for grabs between Toronto, Milwaukee (I see them falling off with the Jennings disaster), Detroit, and Cleveland. Cleveland is the biggest threat, if their signings go well. So to me it is a three team race (TO, CLE, WAS) for 7 and 8. With a good year we could leapfrog the Hawks into 6th, but that seems like best case scenario to me.
My bones are telling me that one of the Nets or Knicks is going to struggle a lot. Cleveland should be OK as long as Bynum and Varejao aren't injured at the same time. Milsap in ATL might actually struggle.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:23 PM   #25 (permalink)
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11th is certainly possible. Also - the playoffs are no guarantee. One injury to any of the starting 5 could cripple the team's chances cuz the bench although improved, faith shouldn't be put into any of those players to play consistent 30+ mpg. Also, forgot to mention - other teams have improved too - Raps don't live in the NBA where they're the only ones making moves or getting healthier.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:25 PM   #26 (permalink)
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11th is certainly possible. Also - the playoffs are no guarantee. One injury to any of the starting 5 could cripple the team's chances cuz the bench although improved, faith shouldn't be put into any of those players to play consistent 30+ mpg. Also, forgot to mention - other teams have improved too - Raps don't live in the NBA where they're the only ones making moves or getting healthier.
An injury to DD or Amir could be dealt with but injuries to Gay, Lowry, JV would really blow.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:34 PM   #27 (permalink)
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An injury to DD or Amir could be dealt with but injuries to Gay, Lowry, JV would really blow.
DD probably but Amir - nope. Amir is such an important cog to the teams' d it's not even funny.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:36 PM   #28 (permalink)
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DD probably but Amir - nope. Amir is such an important cog to the teams' d it's not even funny.
We have TH, Acy there that can play minutes.
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Old 07-25-2013, 04:49 PM   #29 (permalink)
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We have TH, Acy there that can play minutes.
While that is true - Platooning is never good. Always nice to have someone who can play starters' minutes. I'm just trying to point out how essential and vital Amir is to the team - especially defensively.
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:48 PM   #30 (permalink)
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An injury to DD or Amir could be dealt with but injuries to Gay, Lowry, JV would really blow.
Yeah and it just so happens Lowry is extremely injury prone.
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:51 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Bucks, Magic, Pistons, Wiz, Hawks, Bobcats an Boston aint better than us
That leaves, Mia, Indy, Nets, Chi, NY an Cavs.. Raps battleling Cavs for 6th

Nomore premo, fresh start with Gay, an improved Jonas, DD.. An a fit Lowry, I see a way better season this year for us

Last edited by creative1mm; 07-25-2013 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:55 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Yeah and it just so happens Lowry is extremely injury prone.
riiiiiight
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:58 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Bucks, Magic, Pistons, Wiz, Hawks, Bobcats an Boston aint better than us
That leaves, Mia, Indy, Nets, Chi, NY an Cavs.. Raps battleling Cavs for 6th

Nomore premo, fresh start with Gay, an improved Jonas, DD.. An a fit Lowry, I see a way better season this year for us
Wiz, Hawks and Cavs are better than us. We're on the same level as Detroit and Milwaukee imo.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:01 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Same level as Milwaukee.. Ouch
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:05 PM   #35 (permalink)
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riiiiiight
The last three years are the only ones where he really got PT. He's missed 40 games over that time span and was playing hurting in quite a few others. If that's not injury prone, I don't know what is. It almost seems like a safe bet he'll be hurt for at least 5 games next year...are we going to be starting DJ Augustin?
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:18 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Bucks, Magic, Pistons, Wiz, Hawks, Bobcats an Boston aint better than us
That leaves, Mia, Indy, Nets, Chi, NY an Cavs.. Raps battleling Cavs for 6th

Nomore premo, fresh start with Gay, an improved Jonas, DD.. An a fit Lowry, I see a way better season this year for us
Absolute Objectivity and no bias whatsoever
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:20 PM   #37 (permalink)
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re: #2

In my opinion, it was a combination of Bargnani and a horrid schedule.

And there were most certainly more than 2 or 3 winnable games during that stretch. Off the top of my head, Pacers on opening night, Utah in triple overtime, Charlotte on the road, San Antonio in double overtime, Nuggets on the road, and a couple of other games that were closer than the score indicated, like the Brooklyn games. I remember those Nets games being particular frustrating because we appeared to match up well, but a lack of effort killed us at critical junctures in the game.

We lost some heartbreakers that probably never would have happened if you had a combo of Hansborough, Amir, or JV out there instead of Bargnani.
I wouldn't call a game against SAS winnable Of course, any game is *winnable*, but you don't look in the schedule and circle games against the spurs as banked wins. Same with games against Indiana or Nuggets (at home they lost only 3 times last season I think). With or without bargnani, we're still going to lose against those teams more likely than not.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:24 PM   #38 (permalink)
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One thing I really don't understand why so many people think so low of Brooklyn.
You have this team who wins 50 games, then goes on to add KG, Pierce, Kirilenko and Terry and you expect them to do worse???

I mean, if I could start a roster from scratch with KG, Pierce, AK and Terry and just add random free agents from what's left this summer on the market, I bet a decent coach would still make the playoffs.

The nets have 5 all stars in their starting 5 (4 active), 2 sure thing hall of famers and possibly one more depending on how deron does in the future, and a very strong bench (terry, blatche, AK, Evans etc).

I think they may fall short of 60 wins because they will rest their older guys if they're smart, that's why I have them #3 behind Chicago (Thibodeau will play his guys 50 minutes a game). But in the playoffs, I have them favourites to go all the way if they're healthy when the playoff starts.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:52 PM   #39 (permalink)
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One thing I really don't understand why so many people think so low of Brooklyn.
You have this team who wins 50 games, then goes on to add KG, Pierce, Kirilenko and Terry and you expect them to do worse???

I mean, if I could start a roster from scratch with KG, Pierce, AK and Terry and just add random free agents from what's left this summer on the market, I bet a decent coach would still make the playoffs.

The nets have 5 all stars in their starting 5 (4 active), 2 sure thing hall of famers and possibly one more depending on how deron does in the future, and a very strong bench (terry, blatche, AK, Evans etc).

I think they may fall short of 60 wins because they will rest their older guys if they're smart, that's why I have them #3 behind Chicago (Thibodeau will play his guys 50 minutes a game). But in the playoffs, I have them favourites to go all the way if they're healthy when the playoff starts.

Age, ego's, age, ego's, age, ego's, age, ego's. D Will isn't a HOF'r.
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:31 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I wouldn't call a game against SAS winnable Of course, any game is *winnable*, but you don't look in the schedule and circle games against the spurs as banked wins. Same with games against Indiana or Nuggets (at home they lost only 3 times last season I think). With or without bargnani, we're still going to lose against those teams more likely than not.
Stop being such a silly goose. You're completely missing the point. Yes, the Raps should lose games to good teams. That's not the point. The point is the EXTENT of the losing during that horrid stretch. If you're a decent team, which the Raps are without Bargnani, they should also win some games against good teams, especially at home. The San Antonio game is actually a perfect example of what I'm talking about, and why you're being a silly goose who probably doesn't even watch the actual games.

Your criteria is dumb. We outplayed the Spurs that game. Did you even watch it? We were in a position to win, then we subbed Bargnani back in the game and he shot like 1 for 20 or something, including a bunch of misses in the 4th and overtime. Hardcore fans rememebr that game because JV played amazing against Duncan and after the game Duncan was really complimentary about Jonas's game and fututre in the league.

P.S.
I'm not even kidding. Bargnani literally went 1-20 or something close to it. Unfucking-believeable that he was allowed to touch the ball that much during that game. It was the epitome of winnable. We just pissed it away by playing him. Another organization would have sat him, since he did nothing else of value.
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