ESPN: Draft fits for the Raptors - Page 3
Old 04-20-2012, 03:02 PM   #41 (permalink)
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I'd take a gamble on Austin Rivers if he's available...I think he'd fit well with our youth. I view him as a Russell Westbrook type of point guard for our system who'll be a dynamic playmaker.

Also Kendall Marshall would be a considerable selection,depending on where they land our who's available.

Toronto obviously needs help at the 3 but I don't believe in Harrison Barnes (he'll be equivalent to Marvin Williams who has quite turnt out to be what you hope for from a #2 overall pick) and I think Perry Jones the 3rd is risky as well.

The Raptors messed up by not taking Brandon Knight,I don't think they should pass up on a young point guard talent again.
I disagree of your assesment of Barnes but it doesn't really matter cause if the Raps aren't in the top 3 (MKG range) then we are picking somewhere in the 8-11 spot and Barnes (and probably Beal for that matter) will be gone. However I do agree about Rivers. I kindof like his f.u. attitude, being a gym rat and his extremely high competitiveness - all attributes that mirror's his dad and something I think the Raps could use a little more of, especially from our floor general. The guy can flat out score and is lightening quick though he does need to work on his passing - so I totally get the Westbrook comparison. TBH his attitude totally turned me off to even looking further - but being bored waiting for the playoffs and the lottery, I had to read and watch. I'm a bit of the fan now I must admit.

Truely though, IMO, I still believe drafting MKG if the Raps get a pick in the 2-3 range. If in the 8-11 range (and depending on trades) I would certainly look at Rivers/Marshall

And IMO the Raps did not mess up taking JV over Knight - knowing what I know then and knowing what I know now, I would still take JV - 100%

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Old 04-20-2012, 03:45 PM   #42 (permalink)
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However I do agree about Rivers. I kindof like his f.u. attitude, being a gym rat and his extremely high competitiveness - all attributes that mirror's his dad and something I think the Raps could use a little more of, especially from our floor general.

And IMO the Raps did not mess up taking JV over Knight - knowing what I know then and knowing what I know now, I would still take JV - 100%
His own fan base doesn't like him and uses his absence as reason for hope for better chemistry for the upcoming season. How you can be excited about a guy like that is beyond me.
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Old 04-20-2012, 04:23 PM   #43 (permalink)
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His own fan base doesn't like him and uses his absence as reason for hope for better chemistry for the upcoming season. How you can be excited about a guy like that is beyond me.
Pretty easy - he's talented

Even the most arrogant players can mature and be humbled....see Green of New Jersey

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Old 04-20-2012, 05:32 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Pretty easy - he's talented

Even the most arrogant players can mature and be humbled....see Green of New Jersey
I prefer my draft picks to not require dropping out of the league before becoming marginal players on lottery teams, but to each their own. I will not argue he's talented, but he's not top 10 talented.
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Old 04-20-2012, 05:36 PM   #45 (permalink)
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I prefer my draft picks to not require dropping out of the league before becoming marginal players on lottery teams, but to each their own. I will not argue he's talented, but he's not top 10 talented.
Well there are many professional scouts and pundits that disagree with your assesment. Most have Rivers hovering around the 9 spot - where the Raps most likely will be picking.

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Old 04-20-2012, 05:55 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Well there are many professional scouts and pundits that disagree with your assessment. Most have Rivers hovering around the 9 spot - where the Raps most likely will be picking.
I can only find one publication that has him that high, but I'm sure you're right and there some others that have him there too. I've seen him more in the 14-18 range in most of my research, which is where I'd be more comfortable taking a chance on him.

My opinion is based on no more than 5 games of his season, and I don't proclaim to be a professional scout; from a fan's point of view, I will be most displeased if our season of tankitude rewards us with Rivers.
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Old 04-20-2012, 06:26 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Rivers is decent but no way do the raps take him in the lottery. nbadraftexpress has him at 16. I do not like Perry Jones III, he is basically Anthony Randolph. If the raps draft 10-14, then Lamb, Lillard or Marshall will be their pick.
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Old 04-20-2012, 11:04 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Rivers is decent but no way do the raps take him in the lottery. nbadraftexpress has him at 16. I do not like Perry Jones III, he is basically Anthony Randolph. If the raps draft 10-14, then Lamb, Lillard or Marshall will be their pick.
Not Lamb or Lillard, awful picks - id rather the Raps trade it. Marshall maybe but I doubt he will be there at 9-11.
And from over the years draftexpress is usually wrong with their order. The closest mock I've seen over the same time is nbadraft.net - same one that hoopshype uses.
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Old 04-20-2012, 11:21 PM   #49 (permalink)
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yeah, nbadraft.net had Moultrie as a top 5 pick...
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Old 04-21-2012, 12:30 AM   #50 (permalink)
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I disagree of your assesment of Barnes but it doesn't really matter cause if the Raps aren't in the top 3 (MKG range) then we are picking somewhere in the 8-11 spot and Barnes (and probably Beal for that matter) will be gone. However I do agree about Rivers. I kindof like his f.u. attitude, being a gym rat and his extremely high competitiveness - all attributes that mirror's his dad and something I think the Raps could use a little more of, especially from our floor general. The guy can flat out score and is lightening quick though he does need to work on his passing - so I totally get the Westbrook comparison. TBH his attitude totally turned me off to even looking further - but being bored waiting for the playoffs and the lottery, I had to read and watch. I'm a bit of the fan now I must admit.

Truely though, IMO, I still believe drafting MKG if the Raps get a pick in the 2-3 range. If in the 8-11 range (and depending on trades) I would certainly look at Rivers/Marshall

And IMO the Raps did not mess up taking JV over Knight - knowing what I know then and knowing what I know now, I would still take JV - 100%
If we can draft Kidd-Gilchrist that would be great, Demar's getting better and he's young...I watch Raps games and Derozan's defense being bad is an exaggeration,along with the idea that MGK can't become a better shooter.

I still think Austin Rivers is a great high risk,high reward draft choice. Especially since Jose is heading into a contract year and Bayless being a RFA.

Maybe I may be wrong about Barnes,I rather have PJ3 out of those 2. Just felt like he doesn't try (based on the half dozen games I watched of him this year) but the pro's could be different
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:50 AM   #51 (permalink)
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If we can draft Kidd-Gilchrist that would be great, Demar's getting better and he's young...I watch Raps games and Derozan's defense being bad is an exaggeration,along with the idea that MGK can't become a better shooter.

I still think Austin Rivers is a great high risk,high reward draft choice. Especially since Jose is heading into a contract year and Bayless being a RFA.

Maybe I may be wrong about Barnes,I rather have PJ3 out of those 2. Just felt like he doesn't try (based on the half dozen games I watched of him this year) but the pro's could be different
I'd rather BC go out and throw money at dragic than gamble with Rivers.
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Old 04-21-2012, 10:58 AM   #52 (permalink)
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If we can draft Kidd-Gilchrist that would be great, Demar's getting better and he's young...I watch Raps games and Derozan's defense being bad is an exaggeration,along with the idea that MGK can't become a better shooter.

I still think Austin Rivers is a great high risk,high reward draft choice. Especially since Jose is heading into a contract year and Bayless being a RFA.

Maybe I may be wrong about Barnes,I rather have PJ3 out of those 2. Just felt like he doesn't try (based on the half dozen games I watched of him this year) but the pro's could be different
Same argument can be made about PJ3 as it does about Barnes - seems uninterested when playing, not a lot of heart (though I haven't seen a test yet that measures that). If drafting that low than I would gamble on Rivers and as RF4L stated above he would rather go after Goran - me I'd love that. Trade DD/pick for Tyreke (though I'd love Iggy) and field a line of Goran, Rivers, Tyreke, Bargs, JV.

Ideally if the Raps drafted 2 or 3 I would take MKG, trade for Mayo, go after Goran and field Goran, Mayo, MKG, Bargs, JV. Then I would look at either amnestying JC or trade for another asset in. 2012/13.
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Old 04-21-2012, 11:07 AM   #53 (permalink)
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Why would we ever consider amnestying a good player like Calderon? Not only is he a solid PG, but he's an expiring contract, we could get something good for him at the deadline if nothing else. I really hope we hold on to him, get a starting PG, and have him come in as a backup PG. He'd be awesome in that role.

And in terms of the draft, pick the best player available regardless of position. If Robinson or Drummond are the bpa at our spot, pick them, and then we can make a trade later on.
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Old 04-21-2012, 11:10 AM   #54 (permalink)
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By the way, Rivers is talented, but really, whats his ceiling? He's what, 6'3? He isnt explosive off the dribble, and clearly isnt anything close to resembling a PG, and he plays no defence. He's a very poor mans Monta Ellis or Jamal Crawford clone IMO. We dont need that. He'd be good for a good team where he could just come off the bench and be a creator. I dont ever see him becoming a starter in the NBA for even an average team. His skillset isnt one of a starter.
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Old 04-21-2012, 12:13 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Rivers is ok but will not be a PG at the next level. Rivers reminds me of Mayo. He's decent but doesn't possess the court vision, ball handling skills or playmaking to be a PG or even be like Monta or Crawford. Second, Tyreke is not a SF. SAK are just messing up his game. Honestly, he's a SG. He has great size at SG, and possessess good skills for that position.

PS: In a lineup of Goran, Mayo/Rivers, Tyreke, Bargs, JonasV - Where is the rebounding going to come from? I am open to trading Bargs as he has only had what, one good 13-20 game stretch in 6 years. He still can't rebound and defend, he isn't the best athlete, can't handle the mins Casey will give him and you need a rebounding SF to make up for his lack thereof. Also, speaking of a good stretch of games, as much as we've all been enamoured with Goran, if Houston feels the same way about him and wants to resign him, we should trade for Lowry. He was basically Houston's all star, is pretty solid defensively, can dish and score. He can also rebound pretty well for a PG and would fit perfectly in Casey's system. Also, Lowry will make much much less $ than Goran will. Which is good as BC wants to preserve cap space.
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Old 04-21-2012, 12:22 PM   #56 (permalink)
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It looks like the Raps are going to get the 5th pick again... I'm down with taking Beal and having Derozan be the 6th man, but not moving him. If beal can indeed at 6'4 defend SF then all the better, monta ellis can do it and hes 6'3. James Johnson is the perfect defensive athletic SF we need, just get out of the dog house for next season.. then we got bayless/calderon-beal-johnson-bargnani-Valanciunas.. Derozan 6th.. Barnes is also a good pick and i wouldn't pass on gilchrist-kidd at 5 or 6
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Old 04-21-2012, 01:48 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Also, Lowry will make much much less $ than Goran will.
I agreed with much of your post until this. Why would you think this? In the 2 years Lowry has taken over the starting job, he's been very solid on both sides of the ball. He's proved hes a starting PG in the league for a longer amount of time than Goran, and honestly, Lowrys stretch of games earlier in the season destroys Dragics' over the past 20 games. Lowry was putting up around 20 10 and 6 on good percentages early in the season and playing great defence. Add on the fact of how much better he looked this year to last.

Honestly, if I had to choose between the 2, I'd probably choose Lowry. IMO he's a better leader, defensive player, and creator off the dribble for others. And I think he's tougher than Dragic(though it's close). Lowry is a fighter who gets better every year.

I wouldnt be mad at getting either to be honest, but I'd rather Lowry, I see more potential in him, and I think with how far he's come, I only expect him to get even better next year and be in discussion, as he was earlier in the season, of being a top 5-7 PG.
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Old 04-21-2012, 02:49 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Lowry makes less than 6 million next year on his contract. Also, There is an approximate 6 million Team option for the 2013-2014 season. Someone will give Dragic at least 8 million/year for 4-5 years. So, that's what I meant by Goran getting more $.
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Old 04-21-2012, 02:52 PM   #59 (permalink)
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I agreed with much of your post until this. Why would you think this? In the 2 years Lowry has taken over the starting job, he's been very solid on both sides of the ball. He's proved hes a starting PG in the league for a longer amount of time than Goran, and honestly, Lowrys stretch of games earlier in the season destroys Dragics' over the past 20 games. Lowry was putting up around 20 10 and 6 on good percentages early in the season and playing great defence. Add on the fact of how much better he looked this year to last.

Honestly, if I had to choose between the 2, I'd probably choose Lowry. IMO he's a better leader, defensive player, and creator off the dribble for others. And I think he's tougher than Dragic(though it's close). Lowry is a fighter who gets better every year.

I wouldnt be mad at getting either to be honest, but I'd rather Lowry, I see more potential in him, and I think with how far he's come, I only expect him to get even better next year and be in discussion, as he was earlier in the season, of being a top 5-7 PG.
Have to agree about Lowry. If I had a choice it would be Lowry however I doubt that would happen with the Rockets. Goran's contract has ended and will probably be in line to make what Lowry is at the moment - about 6mil a year. Goran is no slouch.
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Old 04-21-2012, 02:54 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Have to agree about Lowry. If I had a choice it would be Lowry however I doubt that would happen with the Rockets. Goran's contract has ended and will probably be in line to make what Lowry is at the moment - about 6mil a year. Goran is no slouch.
if he only gets 6mil i'd be surprised to say the least. i have to agree that 8mil is pobably more realistic.
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