Did SMITCH screw up Barg's development?
Old 02-12-2010, 02:31 PM   #1 (permalink)
is waiting for the season to start

Senior Member
 
Ex2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,223
Representing:
Did SMITCH screw up Barg's development?

Saw a interesting discussion elsewhere...

Wanted to see your guys opinions...

Do you think SMITCH screwed up / slowed down Bargnani's development as a no. 1 pick.

I mean he basically would pull Bargs from the floor every time he made a mistake and bench him it seemed. Once Triano took over within a few games of just letting Bargs play through his mistakes it seems like he turned his Game around!

Why is Bargs such a diff player under Triano then SMITCH?

BC basically brought in O'neal because Bargs wasent developing as quick as expected. If we did'nt trade for O'neal i think we could of gotten Gerald Wallace for TJ and kept our pick (Hibbert).

Where could this team/Bargs be if Triano was head coach when Bargs was drafted first overall?

Last edited by Ex2k; 02-12-2010 at 02:33 PM.
Ex2k is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:36 PM   #2 (permalink)
playing basketball

Member
 
andris213's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 283
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex2k View Post
Saw a interesting discussion elsewhere...

Wanted to see your guys opinions...

Do you think SMITCH screwed up / slowed down Bargnani's development as a no. 1 pick.

I mean he basically would pull Bargs from the floor every time he made a mistake and bench him it seemed. Once Triano took over within a few games of just letting Bargs play through his mistakes it seems like he turned his Game around!

Why is Bargs such a diff player under Triano then SMITCH?

BC basically brought in O'neal because Bargs wasent developing as quick as expected. If we did'nt trade for O'neal i think we could of gotten Gerald Wallace for TJ and kept our pick (Hibbert).

Where could this team/Bargs be if Triano was head coach when Bargs was drafted first overall?
truth be told i dont think bargani would have developed any different if triano was the coach he was an oversized sg he had to get used to playing center and with that hibbert pick we probably not picked hibbert thats just my toughts
andris213 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:39 PM   #3 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Captain Ding Dong
 
Aar_Canada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: St.Catharines
Posts: 4,924
Representing:
Default

Slowed, fo' sho'.

I gotta use my hands!!!
Aar_Canada is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:42 PM   #4 (permalink)
is.....

Tai-Pan
 
m5racer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,896
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex2k View Post

If we did'nt trade for O'neal i think we could of gotten Gerald Wallace for TJ and kept our pick (Hibbert).

?
He has already publicly stated that he does not, and would not come play in toronto
m5racer is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:48 PM   #5 (permalink)
adoring his baby girl.

Senior Member
 
Sick, Wicked and Nasty!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 3,288
Representing:
Default

I don't think so. Andrea didn't work very hard in his second year...you have to man up when you're a pro and he wanted to be coddled. I think he realized that after his second year and you saw it last year. You have to earn playing time in this league..it shouldn't be just given. I give Sam props for not just handing his players time...he played the guys that wanted it.
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:48 PM   #6 (permalink)
.

Senior Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 11,492
Representing:
Default

The issue is that some players need different mentoring.... Bargs and Graham for sure did not flourish under Mitchell. Smitch pulled those guys after every mistake, while Moon and Bosh could do little wrong. Bosh definitely benefited from having Smitch coach, but so did humphries... lol
________
Extreme Q Vaporizer

Last edited by carp; 03-27-2011 at 03:43 AM.
carp is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
.

Senior Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 11,492
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sick, Wicked and Nasty! View Post
I don't think so. Andrea didn't work very hard in his second year...you have to man up when you're a pro and he wanted to be coddled. I think he realized that after his second year and you saw it last year. You have to earn playing time in this league..it shouldn't be just given. I give Sam props for not just handing his players time...he played the guys that wanted it.
he wanted to be coddled? When was he ever heard saying that? I believe you have your own opinion... Guys do need time to develop....
________
New jersey Medical Marijuana Dispensaries

Last edited by carp; 03-27-2011 at 03:43 AM.
carp is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:50 PM   #8 (permalink)
is too lazy to respond, you win

Senior Member

 
GrannyFro's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,494
Representing:
Default

He play 25 minutes a game his rookie season which isn't bad and 23 the year after even with his reggression(may have been due to health problems)

Overall he may have slowed his developement a little but the team won more games because of it. Bargnani is no longer a burden but there were times when he was, he's still a work in progress .
GrannyFro is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:51 PM   #9 (permalink)
is too lazy to respond, you win

Senior Member

 
GrannyFro's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,494
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sick, Wicked and Nasty! View Post
I don't think so. Andrea didn't work very hard in his second year...you have to man up when you're a pro and he wanted to be coddled. I think he realized that after his second year and you saw it last year. You have to earn playing time in this league..it shouldn't be just given. I give Sam props for not just handing his players time...he played the guys that wanted it.
aye
GrannyFro is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:51 PM   #10 (permalink)
.

Senior Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 11,492
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by m5racer View Post
He has already publicly stated that he does not, and would not come play in toronto
not to mention it wouldn't have been TJ for GW straight up.... a little bit of an oversight
________
Weed vaporizer

Last edited by carp; 03-27-2011 at 03:44 AM.
carp is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
is waiting for the season to start

Senior Member
 
Ex2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,223
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sick, Wicked and Nasty! View Post
I don't think so. Andrea didn't work very hard in his second year...you have to man up when you're a pro and he wanted to be coddled. I think he realized that after his second year and you saw it last year. You have to earn playing time in this league..it shouldn't be just given. I give Sam props for not just handing his players time...he played the guys that wanted it.
Then why is it that his stats and game seemed to have changed overnight?

Smitch was let go early dec... Didn't he have a carreer month in Jan of that season?
Ex2k is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 02:56 PM   #12 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,928
Representing:
Default

No!


25mpg in his rookie season

24mpg in his second season


The only issue i have is the Raptors playing him at the 3 spot which i think made matters worse in his second season. But ultimately that wasn't just Sam Mitchell.

I saw this also posted over at RealGm and i had to roll my eyes at it. A 20yr old Big takes time to progress, especially one from Europe who's undersized weight wise and barely speaks english. It was gonna take 3+ season for him to start making strides no matter who the coach was imo.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:17 PM   #13 (permalink)
LX
present minded

In the Paint


 
LX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 27,922
Representing:
Default

He found his inside game under Mitchell. That is what made him the player he is today. JO and fouls kept him from getting the minutes he needed.

I laugh at the idea that he got yanked after every mistake. That is just Bargnani fetishism speaking. If that was really the case his minutes should have dropped off the map in year 2. The guy finished games in his first season. I'm Demar could go for that. Does anyone think that Demar is going to become a stiff next season because his minutes get limited? Get real.
LX is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:22 PM   #14 (permalink)
is praying Ross makes us forget Drummomd so people stop whining

Senior Member
 
jeffb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: YO MAMMA
Posts: 73,928
Representing:
Default

Bargnani played 25mpg in his rookie season (20yrs old)

Derozan is averaging 21mpg in his rookie season (20yrs old)

Is Triano screwing up Derozan's development?

Last edited by jeffb; 02-12-2010 at 03:25 PM.
jeffb is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:25 PM   #15 (permalink)
gone

Senior Member
 
Beesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 986
Representing:
Default

wouldn't of made a big difference.
Bargs wasn't tough enough, and wasn't prepared in his first 2 years. Plus, we were building around Bosh, so Bargnani wasn't a critical piece. I think after 2008 summer he really got better. If you remember the year sam mitchell got fired, he is the one who tried to start all three big guys(o'neal, Bosh and bargs). I think by then Mitchell saw the development and thats why he put Bargs into starting lineup.
Beesh is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:27 PM   #16 (permalink)
adoring his baby girl.

Senior Member
 
Sick, Wicked and Nasty!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Canada eh?
Posts: 3,288
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex2k View Post
Then why is it that his stats and game seemed to have changed overnight?

Smitch was let go early dec... Didn't he have a carreer month in Jan of that season?
Because as I said he worked his butt off in the offseason, and when Jermaine O'Neal got hurt and he got to start he felt vilified and ran with the opportunity. His confidence finally solidified and he's really gone off since then?

I'm not saying Mitchell was perfect..he's not the ideal type of coach for Andrea's personality but I think Sam toughened him up and early on Andrea didn't really work for the minutes he felt he deserved. Credit him for realizing it and working hard in the offseason before last year though.
Sick, Wicked and Nasty! is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:37 PM   #17 (permalink)
landry fields forever

Administrator

 
Acie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Living in a van down by the river
Posts: 21,645
Representing:
Default

I think he had a pretty successful rookie campaign - even averaged 30mpg in the playoffs.

His second season he was besieged by lingering nagging injuries that affected his game and he subsequently lost his confidence.

His third season he started out pretty good, but once O'Neal was gone is when he really started to flourish.
Acie is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:41 PM   #18 (permalink)
ska
is pounding the rock!

Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 42
Representing:
Default

Just to make it clear :

Andrea didn't learn anything from Mitchell.
Mitchell wasn't the ideal coach only for Andrea but for everybody that need to learn.

Everybody can see how DD & Sonny are learning and becoming better game after game.
And everybody can see what Joey and Hump have learned so far from so many year with Mitchell.

Mitchell was never an Nba level coach, and I hope for him that he will learn how to and come back but the reality is, COY or not, that nobody pick him up after he left Toronto.
ska is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:43 PM   #19 (permalink)
is waiting for the season to start

Senior Member
 
Ex2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,223
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ska View Post
Just to make it clear :

Andrea didn't learn anything from Mitchell.
Mitchell wasn't the ideal coach only for Andrea but for everybody that need to learn.

Everybody can see how DD & Sonny are learning and becoming better game after game.
And everybody can see what Joey and Hump have learned so far from so many year with Mitchell.

Mitchell was never an Nba level coach, and I hope for him that he will learn how to and come back but the reality is, COY or not, that nobody pick him up after he left Toronto.
Good point

I wonder if SMITCH even recieved any offers from other teams to coach this year?

However he still is being paid by MLSE i believe?
Ex2k is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2010, 03:45 PM   #20 (permalink)
a fan of scratching his bare bum and smelling his fingers.

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 427
Representing:
Default

he made Bargs feel like shit
osamu is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24