D. Smith: Trading #8 a very real possibility if they get a later pick in return

jeffb · 06-19-2012, 09:53 AM

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Many balls in the air as the draft approaches

Well, it was certainly nice to catch up with Bryan and chat about the draft a little bit but after an hour or so of sitting around and asking questions and telling stories and mining for information, this much is clear:

Not much is clear.

Oh, there’s a guess and a narrowing of the field that’s gone on and that’s just natural but there are lots of balls still in the air with just over a week left until draft day.

If I had to guess from various conversations with people around the league and other work that I’ve done, I’d say Lillard, Rivers, Waiters and Lamb are the four favourites right now but I don’t know that there’s a definitive order and a lot of it will depend on who’s there on draft night.

I do get the sense from those conversations that a trade is a very real possibility as long as it yields another pick, not necessarily in the lottery but definitely in the first round. They want another young piece but would live with getting one later in the first if they could get some immediate help.

But, again, there’s an awful lot of time left between now and the draft for things to change and Thursday’s workouts – Sullinger, Perry Jones, Terrence Jones, perhaps John Henson and maybe Lamb if they can get him back in – is significant because a few of those guys are in the 13-18 range, perhaps, and would be someone taken with a later pick acquired in a trade.

It’s going to be an interesting week, I have a feeling; and some of the stuff you read might actually happen. Not much, but some.

http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

**halphbreedballer** · 06-19-2012, 09:59 AM

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Originally Posted by jeffb

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Doug Smith's Sports Blog

Again Jared Sullinger will fall to the bottom or our of the first round if indeed his back issues are real.

@BaileysBlitz · 06-19-2012, 10:38 AM

Like i suggested earlier in one of my threads,trading down wouldn't be a bad idea. Ideally,the Rockets would be a great trade mate in that situation if they could pry away Lowry or Lee and the 14th or 16th from Houston. (If you get Lee,draft a PG with the pick. If you get Lowry draft a SF/SG with the pick)

jeffb · 06-19-2012, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by @BaileysBlitz

Like i suggested earlier in one of my threads,trading down wouldn't be a bad idea. Ideally,the Rockets would be a great trade mate in that situation if they could pry away Lowry or Lee and the 14th or 16th from Houston. (If you get Lee,draft a PG with the pick. If you get Lowry draft a SF/SG with the pick)

Trade for Lowry, then sign either Batum or Gordon.

carp · 06-19-2012, 11:17 AM

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Originally Posted by jeffb

Trade for Lowry, then sign either Batum or Gordon.

We can do better than Lowry

jeffb · 06-19-2012, 11:41 AM

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Originally Posted by carp

We can do better than Lowry

On what planet?

carp · 06-19-2012, 12:20 PM

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Originally Posted by jeffb

On what planet?

lol... Lowry isn't as good as you're making him seem. He'sa solid player,but no star. He's alright, but if we end up with him, we've kind of had a mediocre offseason.

jeffb · 06-19-2012, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp

lol... Lowry isn't as good as you're making him seem. He'sa solid player,but no star. He's alright, but if we end up with him, we've kind of had a mediocre offseason.

First off, why does everyone keep talking as if we're going to make ONE move and call it a day? Secondly, who do we go out and get at PG that would be better. He's an obvious upgrade for us at that position (age, offensively, and defensively)and makes under 6Mil for the next two seasons. Obviously if we get him and him alone it's not a great summer, but let's just say we're in a position to also sign a Batum or Gordon, we'd have enough money to do so (w/amnesty). Still a mediocre summer?

Lowry + one of the rumored SF's is far from mediocre.

carp · 06-19-2012, 12:39 PM

I don't think he's an obvious upgrade. I don't think he's as good as you say. He's alright, but he's not going to make this team leaps and bounds better than what JC provides.

Yeah, you proposed Batum, whom I love, but extremely unlikely. I just think without a stud added, this team will still be lacking.... I don't think Lowry is that fancy fish.

Our wing is the biggest concern, not PG.

Don Vito · 06-19-2012, 12:40 PM

Lowry can't score the ball, but that might be a good thing because he won't be jacking up shots. With Lowry I'd expect DeRozan to be more vocal & demand the ball, Lowry's defense might rub off on DeRozan.

moremilk · 06-19-2012, 12:41 PM

I'm ok with this approach, if we can get a good youngish player and a mid-first rounder in return for jose and #8, I wouldn't complain too much.

Ultimately, what we really need to do is try to get another pick for jose, something like jose and a future #1 (top 8 protected) to the blazers for their #6 pick. Draft waiters and lillard and you're set for the future at 5 positions with quality young players. Keep the cap space and use it in 2013 when fewer teams will have money to spend, and we will have a ton of options to really improve the team.

Why do we have to rush it, don't get why everybody is in such a hurry to make the playoffs next year.

0nekhmer · 06-19-2012, 12:51 PM

Draft is pretty deep and I can see a lot of guys dropping! Philly have stayed that their willing to trade iggy to get the 7th pick..

jeffb · 06-19-2012, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moremilk

Draft waiters and lillard and you're set for the future at 5 positions with quality young players.

Those two players and we'd be set? Really? So they're future starters in the NBA? Are you sure? People are always so sure that a player or two in a draft and they'd be set, when it's essentially a crap shoot.

Quote:

Why do we have to rush it, don't get why everybody is in such a hurry to make the playoffs next year

It's not a matter of necessarily being in a hurry to make the playoffs, although that's part of it. But it's also about not just relying on late lottery picks alone. That and with this being one of the youngest teams in the NBA why get even younger? I think it's time some of these young players start to learn alongside a couple players with some experience as they take another step forward. And let's face it, do you want players like Derozan (going into 4th season) and Davis (going into 3rd season) and others to once again continue to see this team go nowhere for yet another season? If you want to keep some of these young players you need to start showing a light at the end of the tunnel and give them incentive to want to stay here long term.

0nekhmer · 06-19-2012, 01:01 PM

http://www.thestar.com/sports/basket...-optionsQuote: MIAMI—You can sense the excitement and intrigue in Bryan Colangelo’s voice and his mannerisms as he sits in a ritzy downtown hotel here and discusses the NBA draft, and the myriad possibilities that lie before him.

Quote:

It’s just over a week before the Raptors may or may not make the eighth selection in the draft and the president and general manager is running down a multitude of options:

• He’s had conversations with teams that want the pick in a package for an existing player.

“A couple of players of interest that I would tell you would join our team and would have an immediate impact, which is intriguing,” he said.

• He’s had conversations with teams that want the pick, offering a later pick plus a player in return.

“The apprehension is you still want to retain a pick in the draft, so maybe moving back would be an option in some scenarios,” he admits.

• He’s had teams willing to part with a higher pick, but the cost would be significant.

“I have been offered a higher pick for a pretty significant asset, but I’m not prepared to part with that asset,” he said, refusing to name the asset but it’s not a stretch to think it’s 2011 first-rounder Jonas Valanciunas.

• He’s more than willing to make the No. 8 selection if all else fails, even if it turns out to be a player at a position filled on the current roster.

“Even if there’s a stacking principle, or duplication if you will, assets are important in this business in terms of improving your club,” he said. “Picking the best talent might yield something to be used down the road in a transaction.”

It is far from crystal clear

LX · 06-19-2012, 01:01 PM

Make the big move and use the pick if needed

TORaptor4Ever · 06-19-2012, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Vito

Lowry can't score the ball, but that might be a good thing because he won't be jacking up shots. With Lowry I'd expect DeRozan to be more vocal & demand the ball, Lowry's defense might rub off on DeRozan.

Huh? Take a look at his numbers up until March when he got hurt.... didn't seem to have a problem putting the ball in the basket.

carp · 06-19-2012, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0nekhmer

http://www.thestar.com/sports/basket...-optionsQuote: MIAMI—You can sense the excitement and intrigue in Bryan Colangelo’s voice and his mannerisms as he sits in a ritzy downtown hotel here and discusses the NBA draft, and the myriad possibilities that lie before him.

It's pretty clear that Ed Davis isn't being sought after.... too bad, he'd be easy to give up in order to move up.

moremilk · 06-19-2012, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

Those two players and we'd be set? Really? So they're future starters in the NBA? Are you sure? People are always so sure that a player or two in a draft and they'd be set, when it's essentially a crap shoot.

they project to be good starters, it may be a crap shoot to you or me, but it's a little bit more to people who watch these players closely. And Colangelo has a very good draft record, so chances are good what whoever we get will be a good player. We don't need all stars, we need good players (jrue holiday type of players).

And even if we struck out, worst case scenario we try again in the next lottery. Our young players are far from being developed, there's no time pressure here. Our only veteran player of notice, Bargnani, still has lots of years ahead and is in no danger of bolting.

Quote:

It's not a matter of necessarily being in a hurry to make the playoffs, although that's part of it. But it's also about not just relying on late lottery picks alone. That and with this being one of the youngest teams in the NBA why get even younger? I think it's time some of these young players start to learn alongside a couple players with some experience as they take another step forward. And let's face it, do you want players like Derozan (going into 4th season) and Davis (going into 3rd season) and others to once again continue to see this team go nowhere for yet another season? If you want to keep some of these young players you need to start showing a light at the end of the tunnel and give them incentive to want to stay here long term.

yeah, cause relying on lottery picks alone worked so bad for okc, chicago, memphis, clippers, indiana, portland and atlanta with minesotta not far behind.

As far as fans, that was my question actually, why are fans so impatient to make the playoffs. Do you really look forward for the chance to be swept by Miami or Chicago? Is that really worth risking our future?

Even if we don't make the playoffs, a season with 3-4 exciting rookies will be very entertaining. We'll get a chance to watch these kids grow and get better and it's not out of the question that we can even make the playoffs with a young squad. We'll be losing calderon, but adding JV and a few other contributors to a team that wasn't that far off. And if we don't make it, at least there'll be plenty of reasons for optimism.

moremilk · 06-19-2012, 03:46 PM

and forgot about your derozan comment - don't worry about him, players getting their first contract virtually never leave. He'll be an RFA anyway, so we can match anything. If he's worth keeping, we'll keep him.

DocHoliday99 · 06-19-2012, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moremilk

they project to be good starters, it may be a crap shoot to you or me, but it's a little bit more to people who watch these players closely. And Colangelo has a very good draft record, so chances are good what whoever we get will be a good player. We don't need all stars, we need good players (jrue holiday type of players).

And even if we struck out, worst case scenario we try again in the next lottery. Our young players are far from being developed, there's no time pressure here. Our only veteran player of notice, Bargnani, still has lots of years ahead and is in no danger of bolting.

yeah, cause relying on lottery picks alone worked so bad for okc, chicago, memphis, clippers, indiana, portland and atlanta with minesotta not far behind.

As far as fans, that was my question actually, why are fans so impatient to make the playoffs. Do you really look forward for the chance to be swept by Miami or Chicago? Is that really worth risking our future?

Even if we don't make the playoffs, a season with 3-4 exciting rookies will be very entertaining. We'll get a chance to watch these kids grow and get better and it's not out of the question that we can even make the playoffs with a young squad. We'll be losing calderon, but adding JV and a few other contributors to a team that wasn't that far off. And if we don't make it, at least there'll be plenty of reasons for optimism.

You made good points...all of them and honestly I agree with most.

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06-19-2012, 10:38 AM	#3 (permalink)
@BaileysBlitz is pounding the rock! Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Toronto,Ontario Posts: 1,808 Representing:	Like i suggested earlier in one of my threads,trading down wouldn't be a bad idea. Ideally,the Rockets would be a great trade mate in that situation if they could pry away Lowry or Lee and the 14th or 16th from Houston. (If you get Lee,draft a PG with the pick. If you get Lowry draft a SF/SG with the pick)

06-19-2012, 12:39 PM	#9 (permalink)
carp is the rebirth of thick Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Toronto Posts: 10,706 Representing:	I don't think he's an obvious upgrade. I don't think he's as good as you say. He's alright, but he's not going to make this team leaps and bounds better than what JC provides. Yeah, you proposed Batum, whom I love, but extremely unlikely. I just think without a stud added, this team will still be lacking.... I don't think Lowry is that fancy fish. Our wing is the biggest concern, not PG.

06-19-2012, 12:40 PM	#10 (permalink)
Don Vito is raptor jesus Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 3,601 Representing:	Lowry can't score the ball, but that might be a good thing because he won't be jacking up shots. With Lowry I'd expect DeRozan to be more vocal & demand the ball, Lowry's defense might rub off on DeRozan.

06-19-2012, 12:41 PM	#11 (permalink)
moremilk is whatever Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: toronto Posts: 7,208 Representing:	I'm ok with this approach, if we can get a good youngish player and a mid-first rounder in return for jose and #8, I wouldn't complain too much. Ultimately, what we really need to do is try to get another pick for jose, something like jose and a future #1 (top 8 protected) to the blazers for their #6 pick. Draft waiters and lillard and you're set for the future at 5 positions with quality young players. Keep the cap space and use it in 2013 when fewer teams will have money to spend, and we will have a ton of options to really improve the team. Why do we have to rush it, don't get why everybody is in such a hurry to make the playoffs next year.

06-19-2012, 12:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
0nekhmer is excited for this season! Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 2,113 Representing:	Draft is pretty deep and I can see a lot of guys dropping! Philly have stayed that their willing to trade iggy to get the 7th pick..

06-19-2012, 01:01 PM	#15 (permalink)
LX is a belly putter in a world of crotch shots In the Paint Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 23,572 Representing:	Make the big move and use the pick if needed

06-19-2012, 03:46 PM	#19 (permalink)
moremilk is whatever Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: toronto Posts: 7,208 Representing:	and forgot about your derozan comment - don't worry about him, players getting their first contract virtually never leave. He'll be an RFA anyway, so we can match anything. If he's worth keeping, we'll keep him.