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-   -   Chisholm: Is this a precursor? (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/chisholm-precursor-22913.html)

Claudius 05-09-2012 10:27 PM

Chisholm: Is this a precursor?
 
Yeah, so I added the title, but he hints to why Nash makes sense for the Raptors

Quote:

Bringing Nash back to the program is widely seen as the first step in a two-step process (the other is reinstating Jay Triano as the team's head coach) for Team Canada as it looks to bounce back from a string of poor performances in international competition in recent years. The hope is that Nash will be able to seduce the next generation of Canadian stars (guys like Tristan Thompson, Myck Kabongo and Andrew Wiggins) to play for the team in a bid to bring the program at least to the level of second-tier international counterparts like Brazil, Puerto Rico or the Dominican Republic. While they are a long way from being mentioned in the same breath as Argentina, Spain or the USA, there is no reason that Canada, given its emerging pool of talent, cannot become a relevant player on the international stage over the next half-dozen years, and Nash has been tasked, in part, to help attract the talent to make that happen.

That said, Nash has yet to prove that his NBA star power will act as a magnet to Canada's best players, especially in light of the fact that many of these up-and-coming players are too young to remember Nash's Olympic push with the team. However, Team Canada needed to do something to demonstrate its commitment to tapping the best in its meager well of 'name' talent and going after the most famous Canadian basketball player in NBA history is a pretty good place to start. Now it's up to Nash to take his new position and do something meaningful with it.

Of course, Nash's return to Canada has opened up the door to questions about whether or not this is just the first announcement he'll be making in Toronto this summer. While Nash as a de facto ambassador for Team Canada is a nice side gig, Nash is still very much a relevant force at his day job; being an NBA point guard. Despite turning 38 this season, Nash still finished in the top-10 in PER amongst point guards in the league, was second in the league in assists per game and had an utterly pedestrian Phoenix Suns roster within sniffing distance of the playoffs in the ultra-competitive Western Conference. There is no doubt that the Raptors are going make like Canada Basketball and push to acquire Nash this summer as a free agent and they are probably better poised to make it happen than most fans currently realize.

First of all, it sounds increasingly like Nash and the Suns are ready to part ways. The Suns need to take a step back and accept a full-on rebuilding mode, and they are sitting on a mountain of cap space this summer which could help them accelerate the process - but only if they choose to let veterans like Nash and Grant Hill walk away this summer while they focus on youth and development.

Second of all, the expectation that Nash would only leave Phoenix to pursue a title is based on faulty logic. Most contending and pseudo-contending teams (San Antonio, Chicago, Boston, Oklahoma City, Denver, Philadelphia, Memphis, the L.A. Clippers) are set at point guard, while Miami needs post-play more than playmaking and the Lakers are in the weeds with their cap and seem content skew younger while they transition to an Andrew Bynum-centric future. Sure, up-and-comers like Indiana and Utah have the flexibility to make a push for him, but it's unclear how attractive either of those cities are to a metropolitan guy like Nash.

The hitch in the Raptors' bid to lure Nash to Toronto was always supposed to be New York. It's Nash's offseason home, it's as vibrant a market as there is in the NBA and they have a desperate need for a playmaker to orchestrate their broken-down offense. However, the problems with the Knicks are threefold. One, they let Nash's guy Mike D'Antoni go, and Nash is fiercely loyal to those who've helped him succeed (remember Nash turning his back on Team Canada when they arbitrarily fired Jay Triano?). Two, Carmelo Anthony does not want to play in a democratic offense; he wants to be fed a steady diet of isolation plays, which would significantly limit the need for Nash's greatest talent. Three, the Knicks have zero cap flexibility going forward, and so not only would Nash have to sign for below market value to play in New York, he'd have to accept that whatever the team has now is what they are going to have moving forward, and that is not going to put them anywhere near an NBA title.

Which brings us back around to Toronto.

Let's make this clear right now: Nash won't win a ring in Toronto. At 38, he simply doesn't have enough years left in his body to make that journey. However, he could take a young and intriguing roster from his home country and bring them back to prominence, rapidly accelerating the growth of several players in the process, while also earning a salary at the high-end of his market value. The Raptors are one of the few teams that are both in a position to offer Nash the 3-year/$30-million deal that figures to be his asking price while also being motivated to offer it. Heck, the dollars he'd bring back to the team in terms of ticket and merchandise sales alone would almost be enough to justify such a contract for Toronto given Nash's popularity in Canada, leaving his tremendous on-court benefits as a nice added bonus. There is also no doubt that the Raptors would be motivated to offer him a lifeline to a career in management after the NBA, too, as his ties to Bryan Colangelo and now Canada Basketball would make such a transition an obvious addendum to any offer with the Raptors.

And not that this matters to Nash, but there is also the fact that while he would be welcomed in several other NBA markets, he would be adored in Toronto and Canada. While other teams would see him as a missing piece to put them over the top (coupled with all of the pressure that comes along with such a role), in Toronto he'd simply be revered for being exactly what he is: Canada's greatest basketball player suiting up for Canada's lone NBA franchise. Toronto can't offer him a path to a ring, but that doesn't mean they don't have anything to offer.

It also helps that his estimated asking price falls perfectly in line with what the Raptors could free-up if they amnestied Jose Calderon, their current starting point guard, so acquiring Nash would not demand a sacrifice in some other area of offseason roster improvement, like netting a starting-caliber small forward. If they nab Nash, they literally replace Calderon with him, if they don't they keep Calderon and the rest of their plans continue on unabated.
Chisholm: Canadian basketball's estranged son is back

moremilk 05-10-2012 01:13 AM

if I were a betting man, I'd say nash is coming to Toronto. He's not after a title, or else he would have left Phoenix. I don't think the Suns want him back at 10/yr because they're cheap. And beyond the obvious advantages of playing in Canada, he would be closer to this new day job and he would have carte blanche for the position of his choosing after he retires. Frankly, you can do a lot worse than having steve nash as casey's offensive coordinator on the bench :)

jeffb 05-10-2012 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moremilk (Post 642586)
if I were a betting man, I'd say nash is coming to Toronto. He's not after a title, or else he would have left Phoenix. I don't think the Suns want him back at 10/yr because they're cheap. And beyond the obvious advantages of playing in Canada, he would be closer to this new day job and he would have carte blanche for the position of his choosing after he retires. Frankly, you can do a lot worse than having steve nash as casey's offensive coordinator on the bench :)

If we somehow convince him to sign here, we better damn well have another big move up our sleeve, like getting one of Iggy, Gay, Batum, Gordon here anyway possible. Through a trade, possibly having to amnesty Jose in the process to free up extra cash.

DSWC 05-10-2012 02:34 AM

What I don't get, is why everybody is saying that if we get Nash, we should amnesty Jose.

Jose is now a good trade piece, after having had a good season under Casey, and being (finally) an expiring contract! Cap calculations aren't made until the beginning of the season, so if we signed Nash, (I think we'd still be under the cap?) and could take back more salary in a trade that sends Calderon out. It may take another prospect, but I'd rather use Jose -from an asset management point of view- than simply amnestying him.

Shifty.py 05-10-2012 04:29 AM

I have two words:
too old

Nash is great and held up nice, but man, he is two generations behind our players

rapsmannn 05-10-2012 05:48 AM

i know steve nash loves triano but haven't we all seen what he can do as a coach,

isn't there any new blood, any other canadian coaches we can go with,

DanH 05-10-2012 09:35 AM

As much as I'm pulling for a more youth-oriented set of moves this summer, I have to admit I would have a hard time feeling upset about Nash signing here. Screw the rebuild, get some solid guys in to play with Nash and our young talent, and let's enjoy the next few years. All I want to avoid is the middle ground - as Jeff said above, if you grab Nash, you'd better be adding another top talent - Iggy would be perfect actually.

Kirby 05-10-2012 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanH (Post 642624)
As much as I'm pulling for a more youth-oriented set of moves this summer, I have to admit I would have a hard time feeling upset about Nash signing here. Screw the rebuild, get some solid guys in to play with Nash and our young talent, and let's enjoy the next few years. All I want to avoid is the middle ground - as Jeff said above, if you grab Nash, you'd better be adding another top talent - Iggy would be perfect actually.

Iggy is effective as a playmaker so I'm not sure how he'll work with Nash, because he's not a big time scorer haha.

I agree with you, let's grab Nash and develop some of the younger guys.

carp 05-10-2012 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirby (Post 642633)
Iggy is effective as a playmaker so I'm not sure how he'll work with Nash, because he's not a big time scorer haha.

I agree with you, let's grab Nash and develop some of the younger guys.

Iggy would look as good as Marion did beside Nash.... it would be an incredible fit.

DanH 05-10-2012 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 642637)
Iggy would look as good as Marion did beside Nash.... it would be an incredible fit.

Absolutely - and with Nash probably limited to about 28 minutes a game or so, having Iggy as a solid playmaker on the floor with our backup PG (especially if they are a scoring or inexperienced PG like Bayless or Marshall) would be a real asset.

halphbreedballer 05-10-2012 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSWC (Post 642598)
What I don't get, is why everybody is saying that if we get Nash, we should amnesty Jose.

Jose is now a good trade piece, after having had a good season under Casey, and being (finally) an expiring contract! Cap calculations aren't made until the beginning of the season, so if we signed Nash, (I think we'd still be under the cap?) and could take back more salary in a trade that sends Calderon out. It may take another prospect, but I'd rather use Jose -from an asset management point of view- than simply amnestying him.

Agreed if indeed we are going to sign Nash BC should trade Jose he has value!

Amnasty!!!

MikeToronto 05-10-2012 12:35 PM

Signing Nash won't get us any closer to the goal of having a contender in Toronto. It'd be another example of instant gratification syndrome (best case scenario) or another epic disaster of Hakeem proportions if the age takes its toll when the warm weather and the best trainers in the league get replaces by... well... the opposites (a more realistic scenario, IMO). But regardless - it won't help us grow the next starter at the currently most important position on the floor. :sigh:

carp 05-10-2012 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeToronto (Post 642655)
Signing Nash won't get us any closer to the goal of having a contender in Toronto. It'd be another example of instant gratification syndrome (best case scenario) or another epic disaster of Hakeem proportions if the age takes its toll when the warm weather and the best trainers in the league get replaces by... well... the opposites (a more realistic scenario, IMO). But regardless - it won't help us grow the next starter at the currently most important position on the floor. :sigh:

Well we don't have the next starter and I'm not sure he's in this draft either.... so why not bring in a stud that brings credibility and is nothing like the state that Kakeem was in.... It's not a sure thing that we get a starting PG in FA or trade either.

Bill Haverchuck 05-10-2012 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 642637)
Iggy would look as good as Marion did beside Nash.... it would be an incredible fit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanH (Post 642639)
Absolutely - and with Nash probably limited to about 28 minutes a game or so, having Iggy as a solid playmaker on the floor with our backup PG (especially if they are a scoring or inexperienced PG like Bayless or Marshall) would be a real asset.

The other great thing is, Iggy really improved his 3-ball shooting this year. Guys who play with Nash usually get a lot of those open looks. In the past, due to the lack of outside shooting, it would have been terrible to play a wing pairing of Derozan/Iggy with Nash. Now, it could actually work.

Bill Haverchuck 05-10-2012 06:30 PM

At the risk of being a "Debbie Downer", I don't think Iggy is going to be available to us, anymore. He was being shopped hard at the beginning of the season, but I think his value has gone up and the 76ers will only bite on a really good offer (one we can't make).

Grizz 05-10-2012 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Haverchuck (Post 642717)
At the risk of being a "Debbie Downer", I don't think Iggy is going to be available to us, anymore. He was being shopped hard at the beginning of the season, but I think his value has gone up and the 76ers will only bite on a really good offer (one we can't make).

It's the off-season. This is the time for dreams and fantasies. How dare you bring reality in here like that.

Ball Don't Lie 05-10-2012 07:22 PM

If Philly doesnt trade Iguodala and let Turner take the reigns than they're being mismanaged. You cant go in to every regular season with essentially the exact same parts. Philly is turning into Atlanta.

Bill Haverchuck 05-10-2012 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thriller92 (Post 642727)
If Philly doesnt trade Iguodala and let Turner take the reigns than they're being mismanaged. You cant go in to every regular season with essentially the exact same parts. Philly is turning into Atlanta.

I don't know, man. I think management could look at their situation and conclude a couple of things:

1- the current group might not have reached its peak yet (it's a young squad)

2- Up grades could still be made to the PF/C position

So, they might not trade Iggy just for the sake of trading him. It would probably take a really good offer, since they might be able to go to the next level through the PF/C improvements.

I think that's one legitimate perspective.

pzabby 05-10-2012 08:14 PM

davis plus caldy for iggy? do the contracts match?

LET'S GO RAPTORS!!!!! 05-11-2012 02:46 AM

That is laughable. Anywho, Iggy can play both SG and SF quite well. It will be interesting to see what Philly does at PF and C, Hawes becomes a RFA I believe. I would offer anything besides JonasV for Iggy.


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