Casey: Bargnani won't be starting at Center next season - Page 2
Old 06-28-2011, 09:06 PM   #21 (permalink)
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This is what makes me optimistic towards Davis's playing time.
It's also a recognition of the mess he's in. Finding an above average five-man unit that is above average is pretty tough to imagine with the current personnel. I just get the feeling that this poor guy has to get through this season, somehow, before he's really going to get a chance to get things happening for real. He's going to have to be happy to get things pointed in the right direction. That alone could be a challenge without some changes.
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Old 06-28-2011, 09:15 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Triano started growing on me last year and I warmed up enough to him to think maybe he wasn't awful. But he was.

I think we'll see a notable improvement right away under Casey. In fact, I will make a very premature prediction in saying we will get off to a quick start and fade late, staying competitive the entire year fighting for a sub 500 playoff spot.
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Old 06-28-2011, 11:05 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Triano started growing on me last year and I warmed up enough to him to think maybe he wasn't awful. But he was.

I think we'll see a notable improvement right away under Casey. In fact, I will make a very premature prediction in saying we will get off to a quick start and fade late, staying competitive the entire year fighting for a sub 500 playoff spot.

See i think it'll take a bit of time.
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Old 06-28-2011, 11:35 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Amir is long and will be fine as a starting center. In my view, he`ll only have trouble against guys like Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum. And these guys can`t pass therefore Ed Davis will be able to come and help double team.

But against guys like Joakim Noah, Chandler, and Nene I think Amir could handle them defensively. He`ll definitely struggle on the offensive end and grabbing boards but I`d rather have him trying to rebound than Bargnani standing around.

Bargnani would be lucky to grab 5 rebounds against 2nd unit centers. Casey will bench Andrea, book it.
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Old 06-28-2011, 11:39 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Amir is long and will be fine as a starting center. In my view, he`ll only have trouble against guys like Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum. And these guys can`t pass therefore Ed Davis will be able to come and help double team.

But against guys like Joakim Noah, Chandler, and Nene I think Amir could handle them defensively. He`ll definitely struggle on the offensive end and grabbing boards but I`d rather have him trying to rebound than Bargnani standing around.

Bargnani would be lucky to grab 5 rebounds against 2nd unit centers. Casey will bench Andrea, book it.
Amir will break down physically in that scenario and you'll have a ruined asset within two years.
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Old 06-28-2011, 11:47 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Amir will break down physically in that scenario and you'll have a ruined asset within two years.
Why do you say that? It's not like he'll be playing against Dwight Howard every night. But guys like Krstic? Kwame Brown? Chris Kaman? Cake walk for Amir. Bargnani would make these guys look like Hakeem. Plus ruined asset in two years?! hello JV!
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Old 06-29-2011, 12:11 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Why do you say that? It's not like he'll be playing against Dwight Howard every night. But guys like Krstic? Kwame Brown? Chris Kaman? Cake walk for Amir. Bargnani would make these guys look like Hakeem. Plus ruined asset in two years?! hello JV!
I only say it because we watched him battle many minor injuries this year that lingered..... the NBA is a tough grind as a big man, and while there are only a few dominant bigs, there are many teams that throw many bigs at you and being asked to play a significant portion of their minutes against bruising bigs is going to wear down both Davis and Amir.

I get that you're being facetious regarding Bargnani, but it is always a grind to play against taller, longer, larger players when in the post.

Last edited by carp; 06-29-2011 at 12:13 AM.
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Old 06-29-2011, 12:57 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Amir as a starting center would last 18 minutes a game. He's not shy when it comes to fouling.
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Old 06-29-2011, 09:35 AM   #29 (permalink)
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See i think it'll take a bit of time.
It will take a 3-6 years to get to an elite level if we ever make it there.

But we'll be a different team at the start of the season and our young guys will come to camp amped up ready to compete.

We'll fade once the teams with a bit more experience play us the 3rd, 4th time around.

Bad teams often have their best basketball at the start of the year. Think of the Sacramento Kings of two years ago. That's what I expect.
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Old 06-29-2011, 03:21 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I know we all have a boner for Ed Davis' potential, but Bargnani is a better player right now.

We all see Davis as basically Josh Smith 2.0, but he's not quite there yet. I think Bargs and Davis can coexist perfectly, and here's why. This coming season, Bargs will get a shitload of minutes and Davis should get 20-30 mins to develop. The following year, JV comes over, and starts a battle to become our starting C, while Bargs and Davis duke it out as the starting PF.

I envision Bargs, barring a miracle transformation by Dwayne Casey, to become our 6th man in the next year or two - essentially playing the role of a 7' Jason Terry at either the 4 or 5 position off the bench. Bargs can get 30-35 minutes a night, but JV and a hopefully much improved and bulkier Ed will start and set the tone defensively in 2013 and 2014. This would coincide perfectly with a 10-30% salary clawback - Bargs' slightly high $10M salary would drop to between $6.7 Million and $9 million a year. Pretty reasonable for a strong 6th man.
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Old 06-29-2011, 03:25 PM   #31 (permalink)
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I know we all have a boner for Ed Davis' potential, but Bargnani is a better player right now.

Good Bargnani should fetch us a decent package then.


Besides, outside of scoring i would say that Ed Davis is better. His compete level is higher, his rebounding and shot blocking skills are better and his defensive postioning is better and he's a better help defender.
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Old 06-29-2011, 08:07 PM   #32 (permalink)
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What will happen is this:
Bargnani will continue to strive at excelling in more complicated things than D and rebounding. His minutes will diminish to zero. So will his value. He'll get disgrunted and his agent will push for a move, which by that point will not even land us a solid rotation piece.
I don't believe BC should hope to get a starter C in return now either, but I would even take a project (who's not hopeless) and be satisfied.
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Old 06-29-2011, 10:08 PM   #33 (permalink)
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I know we all have a boner for Ed Davis' potential, but Bargnani is a better player right now.

We all see Davis as basically Josh Smith 2.0, but he's not quite there yet. I think Bargs and Davis can coexist perfectly, and here's why. This coming season, Bargs will get a shitload of minutes and Davis should get 20-30 mins to develop. The following year, JV comes over, and starts a battle to become our starting C, while Bargs and Davis duke it out as the starting PF.

I envision Bargs, barring a miracle transformation by Dwayne Casey, to become our 6th man in the next year or two - essentially playing the role of a 7' Jason Terry at either the 4 or 5 position off the bench. Bargs can get 30-35 minutes a night, but JV and a hopefully much improved and bulkier Ed will start and set the tone defensively in 2013 and 2014. This would coincide perfectly with a 10-30% salary clawback - Bargs' slightly high $10M salary would drop to between $6.7 Million and $9 million a year. Pretty reasonable for a strong 6th man.
what about amir??
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Old 06-29-2011, 10:13 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Its amazing how undervalued Bargs is here, for the small price tag and what he brings. I look forward to seeing what he can do with a true center and a coach that knows how to teach defense. Bargs made strides when Rasho was here and definitely when JO was here. Would like to see something full time.
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Old 06-30-2011, 08:44 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Its amazing how undervalued Bargs is here, for the small price tag and what he brings. I look forward to seeing what he can do with a true center and a coach that knows how to teach defense. Bargs made strides when Rasho was here and definitely when JO was here. Would like to see something full time.

agreed mate. huge question marks over whether he can be what we want him to be. but i'm really confident we'll see a noticable improvement in most aspects of his game.
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:26 PM   #36 (permalink)
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If a starting C isn't brought in, I hope Evans is back (I honestly hope he's back regardless). If Bargs isn't going to play at the 5, put Evans in the mix there with the other bigs. If Ben Wallace can play the 5 while undersized, Evans can play some minutes there so the team can benefit from his rebounding and Amir and Davis can continue to learn from him. I'd like to see Evans help bring out the beast in the young PFs.
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:37 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Its amazing how undervalued Bargs is here, for the small price tag and what he brings. I look forward to seeing what he can do with a true center and a coach that knows how to teach defense. Bargs made strides when Rasho was here and definitely when JO was here. Would like to see something full time.
Get it right. In Bargnani second season (with Rasho), he struggled big time. Not only in defense, but his points remained the same but he shot below 40% for the whole season. Also, Bargnani continued with his struggle in his third season until JO was traded, got more minutes, and finished strong with Marion playing the small forward position.
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Old 07-04-2011, 05:03 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Get it right. In Bargnani second season (with Rasho), he struggled big time. Not only in defense, but his points remained the same but he shot below 40% for the whole season. Also, Bargnani continued with his struggle in his third season until JO was traded, got more minutes, and finished strong with Marion playing the small forward position.
that's not totally accurate nor complete either.
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Old 07-04-2011, 05:19 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Didnt Eds father say something along the lines of "Im putting a matress in the gym and locking Ed in all summer"? With 5-10 pounds of muscle put on, Ed could be a beast at C
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Old 07-04-2011, 05:24 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Didnt Eds father say something along the lines of "Im putting a matress in the gym and locking Ed in all summer"? With 5-10 pounds of muscle put on, Ed could be a beast at C
Al Horford complains the position is too physically demanding.... I'm not sure 10 pounds will save Ed all that much. He'll be able to play spot minutes there, but the NBA is a meat grinder for young bigs especially at the C spot.
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