Can Ukic be a lock down defender?

melodevin · 07-12-2009, 11:38 AM

I see you guys keep talking about how we need defense badly which I agree. But I am surprise that it seems no one has talked about Roko's defense. he is extremely quick and can blow by really athletic opposing player at ease. From I saw in last season's games. He has done really good job guarding Rose, Rondo, and Harris. These are among the quickest guards in the league. And there were a couple of times where Roko Blew by Rondo and if I remember correctly.

Thoughts?

Kirby · 07-12-2009, 11:40 AM

Sure.

Snooch · 07-12-2009, 11:43 AM

Roko has the tools.

Very solid lateral quicks, long arms, hustle, heart.

But he will continue to get abused by the stronger pg's out there(Kidd for example). They can still back him down over and over again.

Dark Knight · 07-12-2009, 11:44 AM

Probably, but I doubt he will get enough playing time to be considered "lockdown"

TOAO · 07-12-2009, 12:36 PM

He is quick and lengthy enough, but like Snooch said, he is too weak for the stronger PGs like Williams or Davis.

Gurk · 07-12-2009, 12:39 PM

Won't really matter that much now since Jack is going to come to TO. I still hope Ukic gets some PT. I don't want him to rot on the bench and not show his full potential and eventually leave

curryking1 · 07-12-2009, 12:43 PM

The thing with having three of Calderon, Jack, and Roko is that the latter two can easily play shooting guard with either of the other two on the floor. Adding Quincy Douby to that PG/SG lineup with Jack and Roko and you have a very sustainable PG lineup that can weather an injury or a few over the season.

In essence, the great thing about a Roko, Jack, or Douby is that none of them when on the floor have to play PG. They are, all three of them, PG/SG. Not starting lineup SGs of course, but definitely formidable playing against other benches or when you need a small defensive lineup against a small perimeter offense.

Triano just has mad flexibility once this goes down.

If he gives all the producing players, and we have a lot of players now with many talents if you include the three additional players about to come (one being Jack), consistent minutes our players won't be having to play hefty minutes during any game for 82 games and everyone can maintain health and pop over the course of the season.

**Claudius** · 07-12-2009, 01:34 PM

Yes.

Some on this board don't give him enough credit for his defense but he's fast enough to guard the quickest players in the league and he doesn't buy the head fakes that Calderon always bites for.

Right now, what I'm most impressed with, is if you look at his Summer League (2 games) he's shooting the ball well and has improved his stroke from the three (at least it seems like that).

jeffb · 07-12-2009, 01:43 PM

When i read the headline for this thread i thought it was a funny....but alas?

Anyway, Ukic has height and good reach and decent quicks and could be a decent defender at some point, but i'm guessing he won't get any opportunity here to show much improvement. He apparently complained last month about his lack of playing here and was contemplating going back to Europe? Well how is he going to feel with Jack/Delfino? coming into the mix. His ass is going to be glued to the bench unless we have massive injury problems. Thank god, because if he were our second option at PG this season we'd be fucked.

**Claudius** · 07-12-2009, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

When i read the headline for this thread i thought it was a funny....but alas?

Anyway, Ukic has height and good reach and decent quicks and could be a decent defender at some point, but i'm guessing he won't get any opportunity here to show much improvement. He apparently complained last month about his lack of playing here and was contemplating going back to Europe? Well how is he going to feel with Jack/Delfino? coming into the mix. His ass is going to be glued to the bench unless we have massive injury problems. Thank god, because if he were our second option at PG this season we'd be fucked.

Oddly enough, people were saying the same thing about Jose Calderon running the offence when we got TJ Ford.

Only in Toronto would we expect alot of things out of a rookie PG and be willing to throw him under the bus. If he was chosen in the first round or the lottery for instance (like Deron Williams was) we'd give him the benefit of the doubt. But Deron had a terrible rookie year. Terrible. He looked out of his league.

In his 2nd year, he actually demonstrated his talent. That's why I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. We didn't suck with Roko running the team. We sucked because we had no leadership from the bench. We sucked because our team in GENERAL sucked.

I'd be more than comfortable having him be the key back up this season because honestly, he's better than half the back ups in the league.

jeffb · 07-12-2009, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claudius

Oddly enough, people were saying the same thing about Jose Calderon running the offence when we got TJ Ford.

The comparison between Jose & Ukic was wearing thin 6 months ago and it's down right laughable at this point. I can easily say i saw something with Calderon in his first season and he was a pretty good shooter in Europe before coming here and showed alot more potential. Ukic has never been a good shooter and was a marginal PG in Europe.To think that Ukic can turn out to be a Jose like PG in the NBA is delusional. Won't matter because imo he'll be gone by this time next year if Jack and Delfino are brought in and it works well.

The talent on this team is passing him by and will leave him in the dust.

Jakkal · 07-12-2009, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by curryking1

The thing with having three of Calderon, Jack, and Roko is that the latter two can easily play shooting guard with either of the other two on the floor. Adding Quincy Douby to that PG/SG lineup with Jack and Roko and you have a very sustainable PG lineup that can weather an injury or a few over the season.

In essence, the great thing about a Roko, Jack, or Douby is that none of them when on the floor have to play PG. They are, all three of them, PG/SG. Not starting lineup SGs of course, but definitely formidable playing against other benches or when you need a small defensive lineup against a small perimeter offense.

Triano just has mad flexibility once this goes down.

If he gives all the producing players, and we have a lot of players now with many talents if you include the three additional players about to come (one being Jack), consistent minutes our players won't be having to play hefty minutes during any game for 82 games and everyone can maintain health and pop over the course of the season.

Consistent minutes? How many 4??? lol

You have 4 PG's and 3 SG's sharing 48x2 minutes. No way it'll work. Jack already had problems last season sharing with Ford, now you think he'll be fine playing with 3 other PG's?

Douby's gone, probably one other too. If Delfino signs someone else will need to be gone. At least one of the backups will have to be cool with not even being on the bench unless their are injuries.

Superjudge · 07-12-2009, 03:29 PM

Ukic is terrible. He's ok on a bad team, but this team looks to be getting good, there's no room for him on it.

jeffb · 07-12-2009, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Superjudge

Ukic is terrible. He's ok on a bad team, but this team looks to be getting good, there's no room for him on it.

+1000

Admiral · 07-12-2009, 03:34 PM

on this team he can be a lockdown defender because all he has to do is show some signs of playing D and he will be called the defensive player of the team

jeffb · 07-12-2009, 03:57 PM

I hope Roko has a good tailor, because he's gonna need him.

finstock · 07-12-2009, 04:00 PM

I'm one of the few people on here that likes Roko, and I'd be cool him being the secondary PG, but I'm all for bringing in Jack. Unfortunately, that means we'll probably never get to see him flourish, but on the other hand we'll be better with Jack.

Roko's shot is looking pretty smooth in summer league(yes, it is possible for someone to improve guys)..and he has great length, superior quicks..it's standard protocol to struggle for a rookie PG..I hope he's a valuable asset off the bench because of his speed and ability to push the rock...

gdaytday · 07-12-2009, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Superjudge

Ukic is terrible. He's ok on a bad team, but this team looks to be getting good, there's no room for him on it.

He's ok on a bad team? What does that even mean.

Jakkal · 07-12-2009, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffb

+1000

Geeze, give the guy a chance to develop. A lot of PG's have bad 1st years. They have to learn a lot. Ukic had to learn even more, coming from Europe.

His shot wasn't the greatest but if we know anything about this teams coaching, we know they know how to break down and rebuild shots.

**zachus** · 07-12-2009, 04:07 PM

I said it in another thread, but Roko's beefed up a bit, and his shot looks a lot smoother than it did last year. He's got the tools, it's too bad it's not looking like he'll put it all together.

But right now he's third on the depth chart, probably will be for the rest of the year, and to be honest I'd be shocked if he decided to stay in the NBA after his contract is up. As far as I see it the only way he stays in the NBA is if Jose goes down for a significant number of games (which isn't a stretch) and Roko blows everyone out of the water.

07-12-2009, 11:38 AM	#1 (permalink)
melodevin is pounding the rock! Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 8 Representing:	Can Ukic be a lock down defender? I see you guys keep talking about how we need defense badly which I agree. But I am surprise that it seems no one has talked about Roko's defense. he is extremely quick and can blow by really athletic opposing player at ease. From I saw in last season's games. He has done really good job guarding Rose, Rondo, and Harris. These are among the quickest guards in the league. And there were a couple of times where Roko Blew by Rondo and if I remember correctly. Thoughts?

07-12-2009, 12:43 PM	#7 (permalink)
curryking1 a Raptors fan Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 97 Representing:	The thing with having three of Calderon, Jack, and Roko is that the latter two can easily play shooting guard with either of the other two on the floor. Adding Quincy Douby to that PG/SG lineup with Jack and Roko and you have a very sustainable PG lineup that can weather an injury or a few over the season. In essence, the great thing about a Roko, Jack, or Douby is that none of them when on the floor have to play PG. They are, all three of them, PG/SG. Not starting lineup SGs of course, but definitely formidable playing against other benches or when you need a small defensive lineup against a small perimeter offense. Triano just has mad flexibility once this goes down. If he gives all the producing players, and we have a lot of players now with many talents if you include the three additional players about to come (one being Jack), consistent minutes our players won't be having to play hefty minutes during any game for 82 games and everyone can maintain health and pop over the course of the season. Last edited by curryking1; 07-12-2009 at 12:47 PM.

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07-12-2009, 11:40 AM	#2 (permalink)
Kirby Masai Ujiri Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 6,811 Representing:	Sure.

07-12-2009, 11:43 AM	#3 (permalink)
Snooch is back baby Large and in charge Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: All up in there Posts: 8,160 Representing:	Roko has the tools. Very solid lateral quicks, long arms, hustle, heart. But he will continue to get abused by the stronger pg's out there(Kidd for example). They can still back him down over and over again.

07-12-2009, 11:44 AM	#4 (permalink)
Dark Knight Captain of the Jamario Moon fan club. Born Unready Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Electric Avenue Posts: 15,587 Representing:	Probably, but I doubt he will get enough playing time to be considered "lockdown"

07-12-2009, 12:36 PM	#5 (permalink)
TOAO . Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Markham Posts: 370 Representing:	He is quick and lengthy enough, but like Snooch said, he is too weak for the stronger PGs like Williams or Davis.

07-12-2009, 12:39 PM	#6 (permalink)
Gurk is dead inside you ain't bout that life Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 21,987 Representing:	Won't really matter that much now since Jack is going to come to TO. I still hope Ukic gets some PT. I don't want him to rot on the bench and not show his full potential and eventually leave

07-12-2009, 01:34 PM	#8 (permalink)
Claudius contemplating The Killing Joke Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Burkina Faso, Disputed Zone Posts: 10,044 Representing:	Yes. Some on this board don't give him enough credit for his defense but he's fast enough to guard the quickest players in the league and he doesn't buy the head fakes that Calderon always bites for. Right now, what I'm most impressed with, is if you look at his Summer League (2 games) he's shooting the ball well and has improved his stroke from the three (at least it seems like that).

07-12-2009, 01:43 PM	#9 (permalink)
jeffb is the baby faced assassin Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: YO MAMMA Posts: 78,843 Representing:	When i read the headline for this thread i thought it was a funny....but alas? Anyway, Ukic has height and good reach and decent quicks and could be a decent defender at some point, but i'm guessing he won't get any opportunity here to show much improvement. He apparently complained last month about his lack of playing here and was contemplating going back to Europe? Well how is he going to feel with Jack/Delfino? coming into the mix. His ass is going to be glued to the bench unless we have massive injury problems. Thank god, because if he were our second option at PG this season we'd be fucked.

07-12-2009, 03:29 PM	#13 (permalink)
Superjudge is pounding the rock! Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 17,592 Representing:	Ukic is terrible. He's ok on a bad team, but this team looks to be getting good, there's no room for him on it.

07-12-2009, 03:34 PM	#15 (permalink)
Admiral Sick, Wicked, and Nasty! Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 3,223 Representing:	on this team he can be a lockdown defender because all he has to do is show some signs of playing D and he will be called the defensive player of the team

07-12-2009, 03:57 PM	#16 (permalink)
jeffb is the baby faced assassin Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: YO MAMMA Posts: 78,843 Representing:	I hope Roko has a good tailor, because he's gonna need him.

07-12-2009, 04:00 PM	#17 (permalink)
finstock baking the cookies of discontent. Corner 3 Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Vancouver Posts: 3,140 Representing:	I'm one of the few people on here that likes Roko, and I'd be cool him being the secondary PG, but I'm all for bringing in Jack. Unfortunately, that means we'll probably never get to see him flourish, but on the other hand we'll be better with Jack. Roko's shot is looking pretty smooth in summer league(yes, it is possible for someone to improve guys)..and he has great length, superior quicks..it's standard protocol to struggle for a rookie PG..I hope he's a valuable asset off the bench because of his speed and ability to push the rock...

07-12-2009, 04:07 PM	#20 (permalink)
zachus a Raptors fan Free DeMar DeRozan Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,833 Representing:	I said it in another thread, but Roko's beefed up a bit, and his shot looks a lot smoother than it did last year. He's got the tools, it's too bad it's not looking like he'll put it all together. But right now he's third on the depth chart, probably will be for the rest of the year, and to be honest I'd be shocked if he decided to stay in the NBA after his contract is up. As far as I see it the only way he stays in the NBA is if Jose goes down for a significant number of games (which isn't a stretch) and Roko blows everyone out of the water.