Butch Carter: Raptors need to Trade Bargnani
Old 11-22-2012, 09:06 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Here's another trade Bargs thread

Hit the link for the video....


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Carter, who was a guest on Prime Time Sports on Sportsnet 590 The Fan Wednesday, said that if the team is going to improve, it will have to move the former No. 1 overall pick.

"I don't think (Raptors president and general manager Bryan Coalngelo) has a choice because your four and five have to be, on good teams, you know they are two key players that should communicate openly," Carter said.

"So my concern is that Bargnani is so quiet personality-wise that he is going to hurt Valanciunas. Normally the four and five are really key because they anchor the back of your defence and more teams play in a shooting four, if those two (Bargnani and Valanciunas) don't get on the same page you got a problem."

He also said that a trade shouldn't be held against Colangelo, who drafted Bargnani with the first pick in the 2006 NBA draft.

"It shouldn't be an indictment of Bryan Colangelo, it's the business. You’re in the business of basketball,” Carter said while explaining that his team was forced to move young, talented players in order to try and move to the next level.

"We moved Damon Stoudamire and we moved Marcus Camby and the franchise was better," he said. "They were not prepared at that point in their careers to be successful in Toronto. It was the best thing for the franchise. We didn't put it out there that someone had to take a hit for it ... it just didn't work."
Quote:
"You have to understand that in professional sports, your winning teams don't deal with a lot of injuries," Carter explained. "They have a window of two or three years where their top guys play 80 games … we haven't seen that here in a while."

He also believes Bargnani's injuries have hindered his improvement.

"The biggest issue for Andrea I believe, is he's been unhealthy," Carter said. "I have a bigger concern with him being unhealthy and not being available because if he's going to be an 18-point scorer a night, the team really needs him to be there to score those 18 points. He has missed a lot of games and I believe for any team to be successful your best players have to be healthy and he has been unhealthy.

"I don't think that they've clearly spent the time with him in the summer to develop his body so that it hardens so that he doesn't end up injured."

Carter believes the injuries are not a case of bad luck but because the team has not spent enough time in the summer with its players to avoid injury.

"I think it's something else, I think it can be avoided," he explained. “You have to get with the guys and go through flexibility."
Butch Carter: Raptors have to trade Bargnani - sportsnet.ca

Last edited by jeffb; 11-22-2012 at 09:10 PM.
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Old 11-22-2012, 09:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
Nasty, right? I cocked that joint back and banged on him!

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Half the board just wet their pants.
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Old 11-22-2012, 09:25 PM   #3 (permalink)
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His argument is flawed and his points inconsistent, but AB is one of many other untouchables on this team. JV is the keeper, the rest need to fit his game. As a result of missing on Nash and getting stuck with Fields, this team is even more desperate for help at the three. DMc might be a partial solution, gotta love his energy, length and toughness, but he's not enough.
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Old 11-22-2012, 09:44 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Raptors need to bring back Butch ...................................just playing,I like Casey
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Old 11-22-2012, 10:07 PM   #5 (permalink)
and that's the bottom line, cause JV said so!!!

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Was he a good coach?
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:13 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I'm in the camp that thinks it's probably a good idea to trade Bargnani, but I don't think they have to do it.

I thought Carter's arguments were mostly terrible.
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:16 PM   #7 (permalink)
Nasty, right? I cocked that joint back and banged on him!

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Colangelo must be livid at that interview. Literally.

And it may actually make him less inclined to deal Barganani in the short term.
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:17 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ligeia View Post
I'm in the camp that thinks it's probably a good idea to trade Bargnani, but I don't think they have to do it.

I thought Carter's arguments were mostly terrible.
Agreed. I think it's likely that everything he said was with an eye on the remote possibility of being hired on here again. I'm sure he'd take a head coaching job, GM job, or both.
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Old 11-22-2012, 11:18 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Well there goes my thread. Completely agree butch is still in Toronto shows that he loves the city and he knows more about basketball then BC and DC combined. Just an opinion though. Butch for everything and anything!!!!
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:25 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Well if there is a trade out there that makes us better, I don't think BC would think twice. Bargnani should stay here until we get a clear cut offer that makes us better and in the mean time he can still be productive on some nights. I think that could be the problem right now though.
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:53 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Bargnani is no longer untouchable. The untouchables for me are Val and Lowry. There's some interest out there for him, but I wouldn't trade him unless we get some good piece(s) in return. He will bounce back from his shooting woes and I can see him avging 19 and 5 at some point with better offensive efficiency. Wait for the right deal....IMO it's better to sell high.
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:41 AM   #12 (permalink)
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hmm. would anyone take his contract though?
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Old 11-23-2012, 02:55 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raptors1995 View Post
Bargnani is no longer untouchable. The untouchables for me are Val and Lowry. There's some interest out there for him, but I wouldn't trade him unless we get some good piece(s) in return. He will bounce back from his shooting woes and I can see him avging 19 and 5 at some point with better offensive efficiency. Wait for the right deal....IMO it's better to sell high.
That is a big part of the problem though, in my opinion. If Bargnani starts producing the expected numbers for him then Colangelo won't be willing to trade him,seeing it as optimism that he'll become the player he envisioned he would in the long run when he drafted him. My thing is even if he's scoring 20 *nd grabbing 5,what impact does/will it have on the teams W/L record? If its not an effective 19/20 + 5,I'd still trade him. Bargnani is better suited on another tean where his role and responsibilites are minimal. In Toronto,too much is expected of him(rightfully so or not) because he came in as the #1 overall pick.
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Old 11-23-2012, 03:26 AM   #14 (permalink)
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bargnani is never going to fullfil what he was suppose to be, but atleast he's not a kwame. seems like he cant take on responsibility in clutch situations
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Old 11-23-2012, 07:09 AM   #15 (permalink)
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every time butch Carter speaks everyone seems to listen don't know why, sam mitchell had more success as a raptor coach

but he is right Raptors need to move our players in a package deal that can net us a allstar caliber player

1st trade package

jose calderon
andrea bargnani

2nd trade package

terrence ross
amir johnson
jose calderon

3rd trade package

ross
davis
calderon


either way we need to move a big, a pg and forward/guard player to get what we need

cleary the only tradeable player before the season started was jonas, now demar is one of they guys
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:09 AM   #16 (permalink)
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hmm. would anyone take his contract though?
He's got a good contract.
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:48 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by carp View Post
His argument is flawed and his points inconsistent, but AB is one of many other untouchables on this team. JV is the keeper, the rest need to fit his game. As a result of missing on Nash and getting stuck with Fields, this team is even more desperate for help at the three. DMc might be a partial solution, gotta love his energy, length and toughness, but he's not enough.
Untouchable? What has he done to be untouchable? He hasn't even done enough to be a starter.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:24 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Untouchable? What has he done to be untouchable? He hasn't even done enough to be a starter.
OOOPS, I meant he's not untouchable.... lol... even though the refs seem to think they need to help defenders slow him down.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:30 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Everyone is blaming Bargnani for his playstyle and bad defense, but if Raptors would find the cure for their losses, if everyone around him would be better and Raptors start winning a lot, then Bargnani would be a superstar and everyone would praise him.

I think he's a very good player, he has golden hands, but the situation most likely will never be in his favor to become a superstar.

as for trading him - only if Raptors get a nice deal, which they will not. So it's best to keep him and try to change the team.
We have really good material for a playoff team - Lowry, Derozan, Bargnani, Valančiūnas. But nothing changes.. Something's missing.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:57 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seeker View Post
Everyone is blaming Bargnani for his playstyle and bad defense, but if Raptors would find the cure for their losses, if everyone around him would be better and Raptors start winning a lot, then Bargnani would be a superstar and everyone would praise him.

I think he's a very good player, he has golden hands, but the situation most likely will never be in his favor to become a superstar.

as for trading him - only if Raptors get a nice deal, which they will not. So it's best to keep him and try to change the team.
We have really good material for a playoff team - Lowry, Derozan, Bargnani, Valančiūnas. But nothing changes.. Something's missing.
NO, he isnt a very good player.. he is just a very good shooter as 7 footer.. thats all.
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