Butch Carter: Raps look better without Bargnani - Page 3

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View Poll Results: Are the Raptors better off without Bargnani?
Yes 56 80.00%
No 14 20.00%
Voters: 70. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-19-2012, 07:08 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Does it matter which it is? Either way he's hurting the squad more than he's helping it when he's out there.
he wasn't the only one playing poorly. Let's stop the witchhunt for one guy.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:08 PM   #42 (permalink)
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He just has an awareness pretty much akin to a rookie. He doesn't read or react well, nor work well within a team framework. Unless he manages to go beyond his regular disposition, but even then, he doesn't work with the team. Even when he's hot, he ends up needing to let the rest of the team play while he just watches.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:10 PM   #43 (permalink)
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he wasn't the only one playing poorly. Let's stop the witchhunt for one guy.
Here's the problem. He makes other players worse, rather than better. He wasn't the only one playing poorly, but the good efforts were wasted, and as a team they all pulled different ropes while trying to incorporate their hub.

How about accountability without claims of witch hunts?
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:14 PM   #44 (permalink)
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he wasn't the only one playing poorly. Let's stop the witchhunt for one guy.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:16 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Get that post count up
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:22 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Here's the problem. He makes other players worse, rather than better. He wasn't the only one playing poorly, but the good efforts were wasted, and as a team they all pulled different ropes while trying to incorporate their hub.

How about accountability without claims of witch hunts?
Accountability for all? Now we're seeing it. So what's the problem?
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:27 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Accountability for all? Now we're seeing it. So what's the problem?
There is no problem. With enough effort these guys have some room for error and can actually move forward. No they won't beat all the best teams in the league. I guess maybe another 7 years of Bargnaniball will eventually get them there though.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:32 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Here's the problem. He makes other players worse, rather than better. He wasn't the only one playing poorly, but the good efforts were wasted, and as a team they all pulled different ropes while trying to incorporate their hub.

How about accountability without claims of witch hunts?
Do you honestly believe that he makes players worse? You guys are blaming him for all the problems.

Look, People who are defending Andrea are willing to admit he has flaws, because he does, and so do a lot of players. But to say that he makes players around him worse is not a fair statement. You guys have to stop knocking on him and look at some facts based on the team. You know, a team, where 5 players are on the court at all times...a team, where everyone is accountable, a team which Andrea has helped more than he's hurt.

I do not like when people neglect the good about players, and only focus on the bad, and construe what is true about the players to make them look worse. For example, saying Andrea is a bad passer, while on comparing him to guards.


People can think what they want, but until like I said, the team goes onto beat some top teams in the league without Andrea in the lineup, I will not sit here and watch this absurdity.
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:33 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Do you honestly believe that he makes players worse? You guys are blaming him for all the problems.
Look around there's plenty of blame going around.
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Old 12-19-2012, 08:17 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by DuCa00795 View Post
Do you honestly believe that he makes players worse? You guys are blaming him for all the problems.

Look, People who are defending Andrea are willing to admit he has flaws, because he does, and so do a lot of players. But to say that he makes players around him worse is not a fair statement. You guys have to stop knocking on him and look at some facts based on the team. You know, a team, where 5 players are on the court at all times...a team, where everyone is accountable, a team which Andrea has helped more than he's hurt.

I do not like when people neglect the good about players, and only focus on the bad, and construe what is true about the players to make them look worse. For example, saying Andrea is a bad passer, while on comparing him to guards.


People can think what they want, but until like I said, the team goes onto beat some top teams in the league without Andrea in the lineup, I will not sit here and watch this absurdity.
When 94 3-point attempts in 21 games is referred to as the occasional 3, I feel like I have a good sense of the absurd.

I have watched the bottom teams beat this team for years now, with Andrea in the lineup, and yet he is one of the most talented big men in the league. Something is off there.

I've repeatedly said that there are big problems with the overall balance of the team. It isn't entirely on one guy. But there is one guy that has consistently thrown the balance out of whack. Instead of having a team where 5 guys work well together in all aspects, we get one or two that always need to make up for multiple areas that are neglected with Andrea's presence. We've had a mish mash of roles here as long as Andrea has been here.

Last edited by LX; 12-19-2012 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 12-19-2012, 08:40 PM   #51 (permalink)
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I just don't see Bargnani fitting in this team anymore ( never did really). He could be much more useful elsewhere.
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Old 12-19-2012, 08:45 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Right now Davis is playing better, so really is a question of whether you move him at C or you bring him off the bench. In my opinion, he should be moved to C. jV is rebounding poorly, so you don't lose all that much, and Bargnani is a much better post rebounder.

The biggest mistake would be to play him at PF just to raise his trade value ... Right now, our best angle is to present Andrea as a miscasted player, someone who may flourish in a different system. Taking minutes from Davis would be quite damaging on multiple levels.
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Old 12-19-2012, 09:38 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Andrea is not a center, but had been forced to play it his whole career.
He's not playing Center this year ....
Didn't play Center last year ...
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Old 12-19-2012, 09:52 PM   #54 (permalink)
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hurt.

I do not like when people neglect the good about players, and only focus on the bad, and construe what is true about the players to make them look worse. For example, saying Andrea is a bad passer, while on comparing him to guards.
I listed (and compared him to) a bunch of big men who ARE great passers.... never once expected any of them to be Nash out there.
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Old 12-19-2012, 09:53 PM   #55 (permalink)
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I'll vote 50 yes'
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Old 12-19-2012, 09:54 PM   #56 (permalink)
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I just don't see Bargnani fitting in this team anymore ( never did really). He could be much more useful elsewhere.
Yep. Exactly this. I do believe that he still has value... just not here. Not with this team.

Maybe with a veteran-laden one where he's not asked to do too much.
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Old 12-19-2012, 10:04 PM   #57 (permalink)
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We often hear of undersized two guards,Bargnani is unique however. What we have in him is the league's first ever oversized shooting guard. That's how he plays but is too slow to guard that position. He's not an effective C or PF and can't play SF,he's a curious and puzzling case.
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Old 12-19-2012, 10:21 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Quote:
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We often hear of undersized two guards,Bargnani is unique however. What we have in him is the league's first ever oversized shooting guard. That's how he plays but is too slow to guard that position. He's not an effective C or PF and can't play SF,he's a curious and puzzling case.
The curious case of Andrea Bargnani
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:07 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Bargnani fans will be Bargnani fans; that's why they're Bargnani fans.

Barney has a hard time losing himself in the game. He plays like he's worried about his performance.

Primo Donna

Make him earn it Casey!!!
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:10 PM   #60 (permalink)
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For the record - I would love to see Barney come in and earn some PT from his teammates.
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