Is Bosh worth the max? (answers must be 8,367,295 words or more in this thread)

Go Back   Raptors Forum | Toronto Raptors Forums & Message Boards > NBA Discussion > Toronto Raptors

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-18-2010, 02:21 AM   #1 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default Is Bosh worth the max? (answers must be 8,367,295 words or more in this thread)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
Pau, Bynum, Artest/Ariza, Odom (and Phil Jackson) >>>>>>>>>>>> anything that's been on the Raps outside of Bosh.
Take off Kobe from this team = no Finals appearance.
Put Lebron with some combination of those players = Highly possible.
Put Wade with some combination of those players = Eh, still highly possible.
Put Bosh with some combination of those players = Nope.

Let's put Kobe on the Raptors = at least a playoff appearance. At most, the gold.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 10:20 AM   #2 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeDPlease View Post
Take off Kobe from this team = no Finals appearance.
Put Lebron with some combination of those players = Highly possible.
Put Wade with some combination of those players = Eh, still highly possible.
Put Bosh with some combination of those players = Nope.

Let's put Kobe on the Raptors = at least a playoff appearance. At most, the gold.
Lol.... no kidding. You can't take a star guard off of a team and replace him with a star big and expect the team to function the same way.

Have you ever seen what Bosh can do with a star wing player beside him? Nope.

Has he even played with another all-star? Nope.

Wade & Kobe have either missed the playoffs or been first round casualties when they've been the only star on their teams. People seem to forget that though.
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 01:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
Lol.... no kidding. You can't take a star guard off of a team and replace him with a star big and expect the team to function the same way.

Have you ever seen what Bosh can do with a star wing player beside him? Nope.

Has he even played with another all-star? Nope.

Wade & Kobe have either missed the playoffs or been first round casualties when they've been the only star on their teams. People seem to forget that though.
Hence why I said "some combination". Bosh with some combination of the current Lakers, or of two years ago = no Finals Appearance. Nope. Which is why you should stop comparing Bosh to Kobe, Lebron, and I guess you can add D-Wade in there. Bosh is a top 5 PF only, and not worth max, but he'll get it either way.

I'll say this right now, Bosh will only win a championship as a SECOND option. Period.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 01:26 PM   #4 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeDPlease View Post
Hence why I said "some combination". Bosh with some combination of the current Lakers, or of two years ago = no Finals Appearance. Nope. Which is why you should stop comparing Bosh to Kobe, Lebron, and I guess you can add D-Wade in there. Bosh is a top 5 PF only, and not worth max, but he'll get it either way.

I'll say this right now, Bosh will only win a championship as a SECOND option. Period.
Huh?

The Lakers have had ONE solid guard in the past 10 years.... and that's been Kobe Bryant. Who would you pair Bosh with there if not him? You're comparison doesn't make sense.

That's been my point all along.... you NEED to pair a big with a small if you want success.... and Bosh has never had that so how can you judge him?

Do you really think that Kobe won that game for the Lakers night? Lol.... if Bosh went 6-25 you'd be screaming your head off about how crappy he is. Pau Gasol and Ron Artest won that game.

This isn't hard to understand.... your team is going nowhere unless you pair 2 stars (one big and one perimeter, or 2 VERY good swingmen) together.

Period.

Unless you'd care to show me a time where Lebron/Wade/Kobe won a title on their own with no help?
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 02:08 PM   #5 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
Huh?

The Lakers have had ONE solid guard in the past 10 years.... and that's been Kobe Bryant. Who would you pair Bosh with there if not him? You're comparison doesn't make sense.

That's been my point all along.... you NEED to pair a big with a small if you want success.... and Bosh has never had that so how can you judge him?

Do you really think that Kobe won that game for the Lakers night? Lol.... if Bosh went 6-25 you'd be screaming your head off about how crappy he is. Pau Gasol and Ron Artest won that game.

This isn't hard to understand.... your team is going nowhere unless you pair 2 stars (one big and one perimeter, or 2 VERY good swingmen) together.

Period.

Unless you'd care to show me a time where Lebron/Wade/Kobe won a title on their own with no help?
You keep reading words that aren't there. I never said Bosh can win it alone. He needs a team to back him up. I never said Kobe can win it alone. That's evident from yesterday. I'm arguing that Bosh is not a max contract player. Period. Stop putting words in my mouth and lern2read.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 03:04 PM   #6 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeDPlease View Post
Take off Kobe from this team = no Finals appearance.
Put Lebron with some combination of those players = Highly possible.
Put Wade with some combination of those players = Eh, still highly possible.
Put Bosh with some combination of those players = Nope.

Let's put Kobe on the Raptors = at least a playoff appearance. At most, the gold.
You wrote this didn't you?

So pardon me... you're implying that Kobe/Wade/Bron = Finals appearance while Bosh = no Finals appearance.

And Kobe on the Raptors = guaranteed playoff appearance (even though he missed the playoffs with a crap team a few years ago and was eliminated in the 1st round 2 other times) and at most GOLD? Meaning title??

That's rich.

Bosh has taken our shitty teams to the playoffs.

He would have done it again this season if he didn't go down with an injury in the last few games.

You really need to stop buying into the hype that the NBA feeds you.

One star (regardless of who it is) in destined to fail.

Multiple stars guarantees you a good team and a shot at a title.

Pretty simple really.
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 03:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
You wrote this didn't you?

So pardon me... you're implying that Kobe/Wade/Bron = Finals appearance while Bosh = no Finals appearance.

And Kobe on the Raptors = guaranteed playoff appearance (even though he missed the playoffs with a crap team a few years ago and was eliminated in the 1st round 2 other times) and at most GOLD? Meaning title??

That's rich.

Bosh has taken our shitty teams to the playoffs.

He would have done it again this season if he didn't go down with an injury in the last few games.

You really need to stop buying into the hype that the NBA feeds you.

One star (regardless of who it is) in destined to fail.

Multiple stars guarantees you a good team and a shot at a title.

Pretty simple really.
What? I'm arguing that Kobe, LeBron, and (I guess) Wade are in a completely different league than Bosh. I'm arguing that Bosh is not a max contract player. I never said one star could do it all. Kobe needed Shaq/Gasol, Wade needed Shaq, LeBron needs god knows who, BUT if there was a guard/big combo for Bosh that would compete for a title, he would be the second option, and in my opinion he is not worthy of a max contract. But I guess I'm just buying into the hype, right? That's rich.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 03:24 PM   #8 (permalink)
We going to the 'ship!

Senior Member

 
Ball Don't Lie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 11,185
Representing:
Default

You need star players and those star players need to be able to do multiple things even when struggling from the field. Compare:

Fisher/Rondo vs Jose. Fisher is one of the best team defenders in the NBA even when his shot isnt going down. Rondo can get 2nd shot opportunities and is a great floor leader even when his penetration game is off. When Joses shot is off hes completely useless.

Allen/Kobe vs Derozan. When Allens shot is off he still provides very solid defence even though his sucktitude really cost Boston the series. Derozan is obviously a rookie, but I think sooner rather than later he'll develop into one of those players I'm talking about thatll be able to do multiple things on the court to be effective. Wont even compare Kobe.

Pierce/Artest vs Hedo. Artest is still one of the best perimeter defenders and now team defenders in the NBA, and hes a load on the offensive boards when his shot isnt falling. Pierce has become a very good man and help defender and can get his teammates going when his shot isnt falling. Hedo used to be able to get his teammates going when shot wasnt falling, now like Jose, when his shot isnt falling hes completely useless.

No need to go into the PF comparison because they're both great all around players, besides Gasols softness/man D and KGs legs.

And last but maybe most importantly, Perkins/Bynum vs Bargs. Perkins/Bynum are a HUGE reason why their teams are even in the Finals even though their numbers may not indicate it. When Bynum was on the court the Celtics had a much harder time scoring in the paint and vice versa for Perk(and obviously with the rebounds as well). Having a bulky lengthy tall center who knows how to play and knows how to block up the middle is something that is 100% necessary if you're going to win a title. Now compare them to Bargs. Bargs' defence shows up 40% of the time and you cant rely on him to get tough rebounds or at least box out his man. Hes caught in no mans land on help d and rebounds way too often to be trusted. Look back at the previous champs. Bynum x2, Perkins, Duncan, Wallace(he obviously isnt tall but did the same things and more than what I described), Shaq/Mourning, Longley, Olajuwon, the list goes on and on.

So in short, the Lakers have 5 guys(+Odom) around Kobe that can impact winning by doing other things besides scoring. Bosh has MAYBE 1 if you count Amir who was consistant all year but hasnt done it for years. Wade has 1 in Haslem. Lebron has 3 or 4 depending on opinion. Boston has more than LA IMO.

Toronto needs to get a lot more 2 way players for next year. It's clear what we need and we'll clearly be able to see how we're doing this offseason based on this comparison and knowing whether or not the players we do get this offseason can consistantly help if they're not scoring.
Ball Don't Lie is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 03:30 PM   #9 (permalink)
We going to the 'ship!

Senior Member

 
Ball Don't Lie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 11,185
Representing:
Default

Quote:
What? I'm arguing that Kobe, LeBron, and (I guess) Wade are in a completely different league than Bosh. I'm arguing that Bosh is not a max contract player. I never said one star could do it all. Kobe needed Shaq/Gasol, Wade needed Shaq, LeBron needs god knows who, BUT if there was a guard/big combo for Bosh that would compete for a title, he would be the second option, and in my opinion he is not worthy of a max contract. But I guess I'm just buying into the hype, right? That's rich.
In a perfect league with a perfect salary structure where players get paid based on their play only, then yeah, Bosh wouldnt be a franchise guy. But in todays league where hes arguably in the 2nd level of elite players, he is a franchise guy because of his capabilities and potential.

But like you said, I do agree he isnt in the top level of players(Kobe/Lebron/Wade, then the 2nd tier of Paul/Durant/Melo/Dirk/Williams/Dwight(no order) is where he is about, even though I'd take all of those guys over him, hes arguably better than a few according to some though I disagree at this moment in time. Bosh is a top 15 player right now who is fully capable of CEMENTING himself in the top 10 next year based on playoff performance, and obviously not tiring out in the 2nd half again, but thatll be based on the level of talent he plays with too.
Ball Don't Lie is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 03:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
the gat'll killya quicker, when I'm drunk off the liquor

The Mara sisters are hot!
 
Bill Haverchuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,231
Representing:
Default

Edit - Oh, fuck it. I'm not talking about this shit anymore.

Last edited by Bill Haverchuck; 06-18-2010 at 03:54 PM.
Bill Haverchuck is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 04:17 PM   #11 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

ACGM... if this infuriates you so much there's a very simple answer.... just skip over the post.

Problem solved.

But I'm not going to sit by and listen to bullshit about how "Player A could have taken us to the playoffs while Bosh couldn't get it done"... because it's just that. Bullshit.

This roster is flawed and has been flawed for YEARS now. That's no fault of Bosh's. He's given it his all each and every year and struggled to improve his game constantly.

Why does Kobe get a bunch of excuses for missing the playoffs, while Bosh gets none? The fact that he was injured for 10 games means nothing? How about the fact that $30M of the team's salary was spent on players who either don't or CAN'T play defense to save their lives?

The issue has NEVER been about who's better... Bosh, Wade or Kobe (or Bron).

It's been about what you need to win games and win a title.

And although we have a great young star here in Toronto (or HAD anyway) we've had precious little else.... and without a well-built team from top to bottom it DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER what star is on your roster... you're going to lose. Period.

I've cited dozens of examples... Wilt... Oscar... Jordan in his first 6-7 years in the league.... but people continue to gloss over them and somehow think that if by God's grace Lebron decided to come here we'd be instant title contenders lol.

The last 2 times that Bosh & the Raps were eliminated from the playoffs it was at the hands of 2 EXCELLENT teams. N.J. and ORL. Teams with multiple stars and great defense who weren't just solid against the East... they were solid against the entire league.

Kobe found out what that was like when he had to face PHX in the 1st round and was eliminated by them twice in as many years.

You're free to take Wade over Bosh if you like... heck if I could go back I'd have taken him instead of Bosh in a heartbeat... but you play the hand that you're dealt without whining about it like a little girl. "Boo-hoo! Our team sucks! It's the fault of our star! I wish that we had someone else!"

It's pathetic.

If Bosh had had a solid core of good defensive players around him AND a star wing player to take some of the pressure off and he failed THEN I could understand the criticism... but now? Jesus.. he might as well be playing with high schoolers.

If you guys can't see that then I don't know what to tell you.
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 04:35 PM   #12 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thriller92 View Post
In a perfect league with a perfect salary structure where players get paid based on their play only, then yeah, Bosh wouldnt be a franchise guy. But in todays league where hes arguably in the 2nd level of elite players, he is a franchise guy because of his capabilities and potential.

But like you said, I do agree he isnt in the top level of players(Kobe/Lebron/Wade, then the 2nd tier of Paul/Durant/Melo/Dirk/Williams/Dwight(no order) is where he is about, even though I'd take all of those guys over him, hes arguably better than a few according to some though I disagree at this moment in time. Bosh is a top 15 player right now who is fully capable of CEMENTING himself in the top 10 next year based on playoff performance, and obviously not tiring out in the 2nd half again, but thatll be based on the level of talent he plays with too.
Very good points.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 04:43 PM   #13 (permalink)
I believe in Masai!

giant steps

 
'trane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,686
Representing:
Default

bosh sucks.
'trane is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 05:02 PM   #14 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

'trane > bargs
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 05:44 PM   #15 (permalink)
streets ahead.

Senior Member
 
SomeDPlease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,780
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
I've cited dozens of examples... Wilt... Oscar... Jordan in his first 6-7 years in the league.... but people continue to gloss over them and somehow think that if by God's grace Lebron decided to come here we'd be instant title contenders lol.

You're free to take Wade over Bosh if you like... heck if I could go back I'd have taken him instead of Bosh in a heartbeat... but you play the hand that you're dealt without whining about it like a little girl. "Boo-hoo! Our team sucks! It's the fault of our star! I wish that we had someone else!"

It's pathetic.
Who's said this? No one. You seem to be clinging on to the words of a troll said approximately 2 months ago, which I remember clearly. Stop clinging, or else what's the difference between you and a troll? Nothing. Everyone here knows that basketball is a team sport, no need to continually sarcastically say "Player A suckss!! He can't beat a team all on his own, he doesn't deserve a max contract!!" Using that as an argument to why Bosh deserves a max contract is foolish. Cause then, people would have "valid" arguments as to why Amar'e and other 2nd-3rd tier players deserve max contracts.
SomeDPlease is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 07:21 PM   #16 (permalink)
the gat'll killya quicker, when I'm drunk off the liquor

The Mara sisters are hot!
 
Bill Haverchuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,231
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
but you play the hand that you're dealt without whining about it like a little girl. "Boo-hoo! Our team sucks! It's the fault of our star! I wish that we had someone else!"

It's pathetic.

If Bosh had had a solid core of good defensive players around him AND a star wing player to take some of the pressure off and he failed THEN I could understand the criticism... but now? Jesus.. he might as well be playing with high schoolers.

If you guys can't see that then I don't know what to tell you.
Holy crap. Are you for real? Part of the reason I was so annoyed by reading your conversation with "SomeDplease" is because you've REPEATEDLY been beating a dead horse about this one star issue. You've been going on for months. And that's not an exageration; it's now been months. Your strawmen about people whining is far more prevalent than any actual posts about Bosh being to blame for the Raps missing the playoffs. And, aside from that, you're a cool guy, which makes this non-sense more annoying. I mean, come on, there's like 2 or 3 people around here who think Bosh is a problem. As I've stated more than once, others just talk about trade options because they figure he's going to leave, or that MLSE is not going to spend more than $70 million, which makes a $20+ million contract a bit scary. It doesn't mean people automatically want him gone or blame him for the team's problems. That's a huge leap in logic.

Other than Snooch, can you name 2 or 3 other forum members who regularly visit the site and hold Bosh responsible for the Raptors not making the playoffs? Who are these people? Maybe I'm blind but I don't see these posts.
Bill Haverchuck is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 07:26 PM   #17 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeDPlease View Post
Who's said this? No one. You seem to be clinging on to the words of a troll said approximately 2 months ago, which I remember clearly. Stop clinging, or else what's the difference between you and a troll? Nothing. Everyone here knows that basketball is a team sport, no need to continually sarcastically say "Player A suckss!! He can't beat a team all on his own, he doesn't deserve a max contract!!" Using that as an argument to why Bosh deserves a max contract is foolish. Cause then, people would have "valid" arguments as to why Amar'e and other 2nd-3rd tier players deserve max contracts.
In reality no one deserves a max contract..... because no one can do it alone. That's the point that I've been trying to make and it's the point that you continually miss.

No one deserves $20M/yr..... but there are players who will secure those contracts because not EVERY team in the NBA can snag a Lebron or Wade or Kobe.

That being said, Bosh avgd 24 & 11 this past year, was top 5 in FTAs and was an incredibly effecient offensive player... not to mention the fact that he's only 25 years old.

There's really very little downside to him when you stop and think about it.

And criticism that I DO hear about this kid is in relation to the TEAM's success or lack thereof which is, in a word, unfair.

If you're a team who believes in building around a big man why WOULDN'T you give Bosh the max?

That's actually the better question.
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 07:32 PM   #18 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmChairGM View Post
Holy crap. Are you for real? Part of the reason I was so annoyed by reading your conversation with "SomeDplease" is because you've REPEATEDLY been beating a dead horse about this one star issue. You've been going on for months. And that's not an exageration; it's now been months. Your strawmen about people whining is far more prevalent than any actual posts about Bosh being to blame for the Raps missing the playoffs. And, aside from that, you're a cool guy, which makes this non-sense more annoying. I mean, come on, there's like 2 or 3 people around here who think Bosh is a problem. As I've stated more than once, others just talk about trade options because they figure he's going to leave, or that MLSE is not going to spend more than $70 million, which makes a $20+ million contract a bit scary. It doesn't mean people automatically want him gone or blame him for the team's problems. That's a huge leap in logic.

Other than Snooch, can you name 2 or 3 other forum members who regularly visit the site and hold Bosh responsible for the Raptors not making the playoffs? Who are these people? Maybe I'm blind but I don't see these posts.
ACGM I have no idea why you've taken my posts personally because I cant recall ever going out of my way to flame you.

There are absolutely more than a few people who have expressed disdain for Bosh. Without a doubt. And it's THEM that I've often responded to. And if I make a sarcastic post why would think that it's directed at you? You should feel free to simply ignore it.

You've made it fairly clear though in most of your arguments in the past though that you seem to share most of these people's views (This team would have been better with Kobe/Wade/Bron etc). Maybe I'm wrong there.

I don't have a problem at all with people not wanting to pay ANY player $20M/yr.... that's a valid POV.

Saying that "Bosh sucks because he hasn't lead this team anywhere" however, is not IMO (or at least it isn't an educated one).
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 07:38 PM   #19 (permalink)
the gat'll killya quicker, when I'm drunk off the liquor

The Mara sisters are hot!
 
Bill Haverchuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,231
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever View Post
ACGM I have no idea why you've taken my posts personally because I cant recall ever going out of my way to flame you.

There are absolutely more than a few people who have expressed disdain for Bosh. Without a doubt. And it's THEM that I've often responded to. And if I make a sarcastic post why would think that it's directed at you? You should feel free to simply ignore it.

You've made it fairly clear though in most of your arguments in the past though that you seem to share most of these people's views (This team would have been better with Kobe/Wade/Bron etc). Maybe I'm wrong there.

I don't have a problem at all with people not wanting to pay ANY player $20M/yr.... that's a valid POV.

Saying that "Bosh sucks because he hasn't lead this team anywhere" however, is not IMO (or at least it isn't an educated one).

In my opinion, the Raptors WOULD be better with Kobe, Wade or Lebron. It is ridiculous to think otherwise, in my opinion. And the ONLY reason I throw "my opinion" in the sentence is because I cannot %100 prove it until they were here. But you hit the nail on the head: that's what prompted me to post again. We already had a discussion about Bosh and Kobe in which you implied Kobe could do no better than Bosh. It's ridiculous. Kobe got beat in the 1st round by teams that went on to the Western finals. And he had shitty ass teamates and still took Phoenix to 7 games. Of course he'd do better than Bosh. This is just...ugh.
Bill Haverchuck is online now   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2010, 07:47 PM   #20 (permalink)
"Fake All-Star"

Senior Member
 
TORaptor4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,432
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmChairGM View Post
In my opinion, the Raptors WOULD be better with Kobe, Wade or Lebron. It is ridiculous to think otherwise, in my opinion. And the ONLY reason I throw "my opinion" in the sentence is because I cannot %100 prove it until they were here. But you hit the nail on the head: that's what prompted me to post again. We already had a discussion about Bosh and Kobe in which you implied Kobe could do no better than Bosh. It's ridiculous. Kobe got beat in the 1st round by teams that went on to the Western finals. And he had shitty ass teamates and still took Phoenix to 7 games. Of course he'd do better than Bosh. This is just...ugh.
You do realize that without the Laker bigs PHX would have sent Kobe packing yet again right? In fact, he probably wouldn't have even got out of the 1st round against OKC.

Game 7 against the Celts for Kobe was a prime example of what Bosh has had to face every time he's been in the playoffs.... the defense just loaded up on him and forced other players to try to beat them.

Difference is... Kobe's teammates are damn good right now... while Bosh's flat out suck.

What exactly do you think Kobe would be able to do here in Toronto that Bosh couldn't? Opposing defenses would just constantly trap him, force him to give it up and let guys like Bargs, Hedo and Jose beat them.

How confident are you that THAT would happen on a consistent basis? And then on the other end of the floor while Kobe's busting his ass on D.... would he magically make Hedo and Jose into great defenders? Would he bring Bargs' bball IQ up about 50 pts?

It's very, very easy to fault a star for a team's failures... mainly because they're always in the spotlight.... but I think that we both know that the root of the problem lies in the GM's office and with ownership.... don't we?
TORaptor4Ever is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24