Best prospect DD, Val or ED? - Page 3

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View Poll Results: Who is the best prospect?
Demar Derozan 22 45.83%
Ed Davis 7 14.58%
Jonas Valanciunas 19 39.58%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-29-2011, 11:40 AM   #41 (permalink)
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How often has he played against them? How many Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, Kobe Bryant do you see in euroball? A big part of being a good C is providing good interior defense. Until you've played against the Lebrons Kobe's D wade's you haven't really proven anything.
That argument goes for any rookie
Fact is, there's no questioning that jv has a ton of talent. He won't come next year and average 20/10, but he has the potential to be that kind of player. He has a true C body, the intangibles and his ft shooting is elite, which not only is very rare for a C, but it forecasts a strong mid range game down the road

He'a clearly not very experienced, but I can't see any weakness in him at this point in his career.

That's not to say Davis is not a great prospect, or even derozan. But jv has a higher ceiling than both.
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:40 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Not only that, but another aspect is playing good defense without fouling. Essentially a must in the NBA. Davis has proven he can do this, Jonas not so much.
Yeah, between busier schedule, much better/bigger bigs and the fact that he already at times gets into foul trouble he may struggle his first season. That's not saying he won't be a good-very good player but i think he may come along slower than some expect. I still say he has the ability to be a very good NBA player. Can't wait to see him here.
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:44 AM   #43 (permalink)
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until he adds pounds and actually plays in the NBA


we probably shouldn't anoint him the best prospect.
We are merely doing what draftexpress and Chad Ford does very year. It's a slippery ground, and there are mistakes. But no reason not to discuss prospects because they haven't played in the NBA.
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:46 AM   #44 (permalink)
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That's not to say Davis is not a great prospect, or even derozan. But jv has a higher ceiling than both.
Mehhh, Davis needs a jumper and he'll be a 15-20ppg/10+rpg/1.5-2Blks IMO. As a starter this season he already averaged 11ppg/10rpg/1Blk. And he's undersized and didn't play a full rookie season. I will say one thing. Talking about this stuff gets me excited b/c i really like the prospect of all 3 of them on the Raptors + a high 2012 draft pick. We're looking to be in a good position in a couple years imo if our capspace is spent properly?
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:50 AM   #45 (permalink)
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How can you underestimate DeMar?
He averaged like 20ppg. after the all star break and he was a 21 year old sophomore. DD keeps improving his range and since he has 3 point range, he will be a goat.
There's more to it than how many points you score at 21. Ben Gordon was still 21 or maybe 22 in his rookie year, he was far more productive / efficient than DD. You can also look at Beasley, JJ Hickson, idk, a ton of guys I won't bother remembering.

You still got to look at bbIQ, defensive awareness and willingness, hustle, motor, other intangibles, and so on.
I think DeMar will have a better career than Gordon even if he's far worse skill wise than BG was at that point. There's more upside though. And probably better than Beasley - due to personality. Although other than weed and personality, I think Beasley is far more talented.
But I do not think DD is a future superstar.
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:54 AM   #46 (permalink)
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And probably better than Beasley - due to personality. Although other than weed and personality, I think Beasley is far more talented.
But I do not think DD is a future superstar.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:00 PM   #47 (permalink)
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What? After watching Beasley for 3 years, I think there are very few forwards who match his talent level. The only reason he isn't a star is that he's dumb.

He's Marbury of this generation. Except this generation of managers (bar David Khan) is far more wary of chemistry and personality issues so they'll never bet big on Beasley the way they did on Stephon.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:10 PM   #48 (permalink)
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What? After watching Beasley for 3 years, I think there are very few forwards who match his talent level. The only reason he isn't a star is that he's dumb.

He's Marbury of this generation. Except this generation of managers (bar David Khan) is far more wary of chemistry and personality issues so they'll never bet big on Beasley the way they did on Stephon.
Everyone in the NBA has talent. The only reason he isn't a star is because of his horrific defense and efficiency. If you want to see a more talented Michael Beasley, look at Chris Bosh. He himself isn't even a star.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:12 PM   #49 (permalink)
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look at Chris Bosh.He himself isn't even a star.
He isn't?
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:15 PM   #50 (permalink)
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He isn't?
superstar.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:16 PM   #51 (permalink)
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superstar.

That i agree with. But he's certainly a star in the NBA.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:17 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Everyone in the NBA has talent. The only reason he isn't a star is because of his horrific defense and efficiency. If you want to see a more talented Michael Beasley, look at Chris Bosh. He himself isn't even a star.
Yeah well besides the part where CB isn't a star (umm... ok...), we don't disagree.

Re Beasley: He's not efficient because he takes a ton of bad shots because he's dumb. He doesn't defend - or work hard in general - and rather spends time acting out and smoking weed - because he's dumb.

I mentioned Beasley only because a guy said that DD will be huge as he scores a ton of points at young age.
My point is - that's a terrible way to judge.
DD isn't even as efficient as Beasley yet. You've got to look a bit deeper.

Last edited by ValanciunasFanboy; 08-29-2011 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:22 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Yeah well besides the part where CB isn't a star (umm... ok...), we don't disagree.
He's not efficient because he takes a ton of bad shots because he's dumb. He doesn't defend - or work hard in general - and rather spends time acting out and smoking weed - because he's dumb.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:25 PM   #54 (permalink)
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TS% says otherwise. Once he gets a respectable 3 point jumper down his efficiency will be much much better than Beasley.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:27 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Man, I'm sorry but I don't really get your smilie language.
Which makes me think you don't get something I write. Which makes me simplify things to a teenage level.
If you don't understand something, tell me, I'd rather not oversimplify it.
Do you not agree that Beasley is talented or something?
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:31 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ValanciunasFanboy View Post
Man, I'm sorry but I don't really get your smilie language.
Which makes me think you don't get something I write. Which makes me simplify things to a teenage level.
If you don't understand something, tell me, I'd rather not oversimplify it.
Do you not agree that Beasley is talented or something?
He's been in he NBA for 4 years. There's a reason why he was traded for almost nothing by Pat Riley. What you see with him now is likely going to be the most of what you're gonna get from him.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:34 PM   #57 (permalink)
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He's been in he NBA for 4 years. There's a reason why he was traded for almost nothing by Pat Riley. What you see with him now is probably his peak.
It was a reply to the poster who keeps replying me only with smilies. Maybe I'm not good at cyber body language, that was confusing to me.

As for what you say, I agree. Again - my point is simple. I say that you can't judge talent by scored points. Look up the page and read the initial post. PS: Beasley was here for 3 years i believe.

Last edited by ValanciunasFanboy; 08-29-2011 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:35 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ValanciunasFanboy View Post
Man, I'm sorry but I don't really get your smilie language.
Which makes me think you don't get something I write. Which makes me simplify things to a teenage level.
If you don't understand something, tell me, I'd rather not oversimplify it.
Do you not agree that Beasley is talented or something?
Bosh isn't stupid and he's an NBA star. He's no superstar but he's a star in the NBA. Therefor i don't get what you're trying to say. Then again, i've heard worse on this board when it comes to Bosh.

Bosh is a career 20/10/1 player.

6 time NBA All-Star
All-NBA Second Team
NBA All-Rookie First Team

And was Miami's second best player in the finals last year, better than Lebron. Simply, i disagree that he's not an NBA star.
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:37 PM   #59 (permalink)
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TS% says otherwise. IF he gets a respectable 3 point jumper down his efficiency COULD be much much better than Beasley.
Fixed..... and you're welcome. At this point they are on the same level. Neither plays D, shoots threes, rebound consistently and both leave much to be desired on the offensive side of the court. Now, you're both welcome!
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Old 08-29-2011, 12:38 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Bosh isn't stupid and he's an NBA star. He's no superstar but he's a star in the NBA. Therefor i don't get what you're trying to say. Then again, i've heard worse on this board when it comes to Bosh.

Bosh is a career 20/10/1 player.

6 time NBA All-Star
All-NBA Second Team
NBA All-Rookie First Team

And was Miami's second best player in the finals last year, better than Lebron. Simply, i disagree that he's not an NBA star.
The post was about Beasley...
Edit: ahh, i see why it was confusing.
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