Bargs ... a 4 or 5
Old 01-04-2010, 03:54 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Bargs ... a 4 or 5

There was a previous thread on whether Bargs should be a 4 or a 5 .... I clearly believe he has the best future being a 5.
It was clear in the previous thread and based on continuous comments that most people believe he's best suited as a 4.

Do you guys still believe this even after todays game with San Antonio?
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Old 01-04-2010, 05:47 AM   #2 (permalink)
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he's like a 3.5
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Old 01-04-2010, 06:08 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I dont think it matters whether he is C or PF. He just needs a front court partner that complements him and his playing style. AB is more of a foward in offense, playing outside and creating from dribble. But defensively he can guard C's. He is not a big rebounder or help defender. So we need a guy that can play inside in offense, guard fowards, grab rebounds and provide some help D. Bosh does most of those things well, so I think they actually complement each other pretty well. The help defense has been the issue so far.
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Old 01-04-2010, 06:34 AM   #4 (permalink)
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clearly he gained some weight to play the center, so he looks like a decent center now but if he had to play the four he would probably lose a few pounds and gain his natural speed back that he gave up to play the center with the added weight
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Old 01-04-2010, 10:12 AM   #5 (permalink)
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He's a 4/5. As is Bosh. It's how they both click together that matters the most. That's been happening lately. Does that have something to do with Hedo's absence? Maybe. Whatever the case may be, the two bigs need to keep working well together. Defensively that is made possible with some stronger perimeter defense.
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Old 01-04-2010, 10:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by JMoon33 View Post
he's like a 3.5
he's a 4.5
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Old 01-04-2010, 10:23 AM   #7 (permalink)
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He is what he is. If Bargs plays the 4 you still need a body at the 5 regardless. Now the ultimate would be to see a big ass lug who can score easy buckets and grab rebounds down low for bargs. Unfortunately those type of players don't appear very often in the NBA so Bargs has to find a way to play without that sort of presence there.

Can Bargs play down low? yes he is skilled and does have a soft touch around the bucket.

Does Bargs want to play the "dirty" game down low? Who really does its a low reward high risk business down there and unless your hung like a horse and mess around with Gilberts wife you really don't have the power to go down there.


I really think its the biggest knock on Bargs ... "he don't get dirty" ... "he don't get easy around the hoop buckets" ... "he plays at the 3 point line too much"

All true but after these past few years do you really think he is going to go close to the bucket? I don't think so unfortunately.

Its really too bad because if Bargs was committed to get a bruise or two the kid would be something special.
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Old 01-04-2010, 10:59 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Bargs plays the frontcourt...simple as that. He even said so in his sportscenter add a few years back.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:02 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Bargs has the mentality and skill set of a 3. There's o way he should be playing 5.

He is quick and long enough to guard other threes, but no where near tough enough to play 4 or 5.

I think BC envisioned

Caldy
Hedo
Bargs
Bosh
Evans

There are many match up problems everywhere and assuming Evans can defend, I like what he was thinking.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:06 AM   #10 (permalink)
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he needs to play with an iggy or gerald wallace
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:11 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Raptorman View Post
Bargs has the mentality and skill set of a 3. There's o way he should be playing 5.

He is quick and long enough to guard other threes, but no where near tough enough to play 4 or 5.

I think BC envisioned

Caldy
Hedo
Bargs
Bosh
Evans

There are many match up problems everywhere and assuming Evans can defend, I like what he was thinking.

Its true Bargs doesn't "play like a 5" but it can be argued what a 5 should play like.

As for Evans in the starting 5. I dunno the dude is nothing but a big lug yes it is good in theory but having a guy playing heavy minutes who has no scroing ability is very difficult. Also, I'd argue and say Evans is "past it" so to speak.

Bargs is paid like a big man and therefore should be forced to play like one. I know easier said that done and I also know you shouldn't label a player on how he is paid. However giving the money that was given to Bargs you can't really go and pay for another big man.

Lastly. with that lineup and Hedo and Bargs on the wings I'd pay good money for that floundering defense. However I dunno what exactly you were driving at there.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:12 AM   #12 (permalink)
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He can guard center's and that's all that really matters, imo.

Offensively he does not play like a traditional center, but that does not mean that he is a PF.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:17 AM   #13 (permalink)
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The Euro system is to teach all skills to all players and see what they are good at. Bargs has a great shot but minimal post up ability...and no attitude to be the last man back on defense.

The US system is if the guy is 6'11" or more, "force" him into being a center. Period.

Bargs is stuck between the two ideals.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:18 AM   #14 (permalink)
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He can guard center's and that's all that really matters, imo.

Offensively he does not play like a traditional center, but that does not mean that he is a PF.
I'm kinda buying that argument. However wouldn't you think if he can legitimately guard centres and "make them work" he really can get a little nastier down there?
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:19 AM   #15 (permalink)
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He can guard center's and that's all that really matters, imo.

Offensively he does not play like a traditional center, but that does not mean that he is a PF.
Exactly.

To me. you are who you can guard, so to speak. Already he is our best low-post defender, especially on heavier centres - so he is a centre.

As for someone mentioning that he gained weight and lost some footspeed - I'd have to disagree with that. In fact, his drives this season are much improved, if anything.

My only issue with him at the moment is the fact that he often rushes his shot.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:34 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Exactly.

To me. you are who you can guard, so to speak. Already he is our best low-post defender, especially on heavier centres - so he is a centre.

As for someone mentioning that he gained weight and lost some footspeed - I'd have to disagree with that. In fact, his drives this season are much improved, if anything.

My only issue with him at the moment is the fact that he often rushes his shot.
Watch some of his rookie mixes...He was noticeably thinner back then and slightly more acbrobatic, swifter. That being said, I prefer this thicker version of Bargs that is capable of defending bigs and playing closer to the basket on the offensive end.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:48 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Watch some of his rookie mixes...He was noticeably thinner back then and slightly more acbrobatic, swifter. That being said, I prefer this thicker version of Bargs that is capable of defending bigs and playing closer to the basket on the offensive end.
What I meant to say is that he has not become noticeably slower, at least not to me, but that added strength allows him to finish better around the hoop as well as become a better defender on the block.

All in all, noone is saying he is a bust any longer.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:49 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Can he guard Centers? No...Yesterday Duncan was not on his day,he missed a lot of shots.Bargs is not a center,more like PF like Nowitsky or Okur.He doesn't play in low post like a center.He's mostly outside the low post zone.That makes him so dangerous,he's a real good shooter for his size.But when he plays there's a lack on low post and rebounding.He needs a defensive and rebounder Center.And for his size he's really fast
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:51 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Can he guard Centers? No...Yesterday Duncan was not on his day,he missed a lot of shots.Bargs is not a center,more like PF like Nowitsky or Okur.He doesn't play in low post like a center.He's mostly outside the low post zone.That makes him so dangerous,he's a real good shooter for his size.But when he plays there's a lack on low post and rebounding.He needs a defensive and rebounder Center.And for his size he's really fast
Okur is a center.
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Old 01-04-2010, 11:55 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Can he guard Centers? No...Yesterday Duncan was not on his day,he missed a lot of shots.Bargs is not a center,more like PF like Nowitsky or Okur.He doesn't play in low post like a center.He's mostly outside the low post zone.That makes him so dangerous,he's a real good shooter for his size.But when he plays there's a lack on low post and rebounding.He needs a defensive and rebounder Center.And for his size he's really fast
I watched the whole game and Bargnani did a really good job guarding Duncan. Duncan didnt' just miss all those shots...he was contested at every turn. Bargani rebounded well and blocked 5 shots yesterday and you're staying he can't guard centers? You may not want it to be true, but that doesn't make it so.
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