Bargnani: "i don't want to be a specialist in the NBA" - Page 2
Old 09-08-2008, 05:16 PM   #21 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

If he does bad this year its just as well for them to pick up his option and hope that he plays well the following season which will then determine if he's traded.

To deal him this offseason if he fails doesn't makes sense because they won't get close to full value. The talent is there, its a question of who can bring it out and how long will it take. I don't think Sam Mitchell is best suited for bringing him along. Bargnani and Bosh's personalities are far different. He was good with Bosh but he's been reluctant at times to even play Bargnani and I definitely think the in your face approach doesn't work with him. Phil Jackson is an all time great because he handles different people in different ways, he manages personalities. Sam need to develop this skill.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 05:32 PM   #22 (permalink)
is dead inside

you ain't bout that life
 
Gurk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,239
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gurkang View Post
Plain and simple
Bargs does bad this year=trade
THis same thing also applies to Smitch except he will get fired not traded
Gurk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 06:09 PM   #23 (permalink)
censored

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,772
Representing:
Default

my concern is whether specialist is referring to him coming off the bench more-so then whatever other reasons there could be to it. it doesn't add up, everyone is expecting superstardom from this kid and he's talking about specialist?
dfunkie1 is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 06:30 PM   #24 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

He has never shown true superstar take over the game glimpses of anything, im sick of toronto fans blowing smoke up this bums ass everytime he scores 15 points or more, omg he is the next "who knows, no one in the history of basketball has that skillset".... lol what a joke, no one in the history of the game has the potential he has? Crack kills!!

Anyways, to the statement, what do you want him to say? I wanna be a 1st overall pick that is only a 3 point specialist? I mean people get excited over the most generic crap interviews these days.
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 06:32 PM   #25 (permalink)
a paranoid android

My name is IŮigo Montoya

 
Belsius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Madrid, Spain
Posts: 10,547
Representing:
Default

In europe many people think the talent of many NBA players is wasted cause they are used for specific purposes only. An example of this is Navarro, in the NBA basically all what he did was stand in 3 point line and shoot, no plays done for him, because the offense was to concentrated on rudy gay.

Im sure thats what the journalist was talking about.
Belsius is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 08:28 PM   #26 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 9,399
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
He has never shown true superstar take over the game glimpses of anything, im sick of toronto fans blowing smoke up this bums ass everytime he scores 15 points or more, omg he is the next "who knows, no one in the history of basketball has that skillset".... lol what a joke, no one in the history of the game has the potential he has? Crack kills!!

Anyways, to the statement, what do you want him to say? I wanna be a 1st overall pick that is only a 3 point specialist? I mean people get excited over the most generic crap interviews these days.
you obviously choose to ignore anything good about him - it's not like you hear about his exceptional skillset on this forum only ... Just look at the facts and try to put your feelings aside, you have a 7 foooter with exceptional shooting from everywhere on the floor, who can move extremely well for his size, excelent paser and who could, in theory be strong enough to play against a monster like howard (he's not there yet, but he's shown glimpses that he can be a very effective defender against good post players). How is that not exceptional, do you know any other player who can claim that???

Sure, you can concentrate on the negatives, that he didn't shoot all that well last season, that his defense is still lacking, that he doesn't have any post moves that he can reliable use over and over. And you would be right - if not for these, we wouldn't be talking about his "potential".

Clearly the guy has huge talent, he's (apparently) extremely smart, has the desire to put the extra hours, not to mention good character. So yes - he could be an unique player in the league, just like he could be a total failure (anything but superstardom would be major failure in my opinion).

You have absolutely no right to write him off after his first two season - it's up to you if you want to continue to do it (just so you can brag later that you were right). But if I were you, I would think twice about going against most people in the business who still have faith in him. Did it ever occur to you that you might be wrong?
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2008, 10:11 PM   #27 (permalink)
a Triano's fan

The friendly neighbor
 
insight_tor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,076
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
He has never shown true superstar take over the game glimpses of anything, im sick of toronto fans blowing smoke up this bums ass everytime he scores 15 points or more, omg he is the next "who knows, no one in the history of basketball has that skillset".... lol what a joke, no one in the history of the game has the potential he has? Crack kills!!

Anyways, to the statement, what do you want him to say? I wanna be a 1st overall pick that is only a 3 point specialist? I mean people get excited over the most generic crap interviews these days.
We are Toronto fans, do you wanna us root for Kobe?
insight_tor is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2008, 09:50 AM   #28 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 4,312
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moremilk View Post
you obviously choose to ignore anything good about him - it's not like you hear about his exceptional skillset on this forum only ... Just look at the facts and try to put your feelings aside, you have a 7 foooter with exceptional shooting from everywhere on the floor, who can move extremely well for his size, excelent paser and who could, in theory be strong enough to play against a monster like howard (he's not there yet, but he's shown glimpses that he can be a very effective defender against good post players). How is that not exceptional, do you know any other player who can claim that???

Sure, you can concentrate on the negatives, that he didn't shoot all that well last season, that his defense is still lacking, that he doesn't have any post moves that he can reliable use over and over. And you would be right - if not for these, we wouldn't be talking about his "potential".

Clearly the guy has huge talent, he's (apparently) extremely smart, has the desire to put the extra hours, not to mention good character. So yes - he could be an unique player in the league, just like he could be a total failure (anything but superstardom would be major failure in my opinion).

You have absolutely no right to write him off after his first two season - it's up to you if you want to continue to do it (just so you can brag later that you were right). But if I were you, I would think twice about going against most people in the business who still have faith in him. Did it ever occur to you that you might be wrong?
I hope im wrong, but what evidence do you really have that im not? He had a decent playoffs vs NJ, nothing spectatular, on a whole his 1st season was decent, again, nothing spectatular, even his shooting % wasnt great. To say he can be a superstar worthy of number 1 pick by what he has shown so far, well to me, thats insane. He has shown he could be a decent role player in the future, but if your depending on him to carry a team, that will NEVER happen.

Doesnt your arguement work both ways, perhaps you are saying he will be great on the off chance he is you will hail yourself and BC as genius'??

"Most people in the business"?? Who are these people? Most people i know in the business dont even talk about Bargs? Why? Because he isnt worth talking about, maybe you mean most Raptors fans? Most Raptors writers? Because if you are talking SI, ESPN, TNT or whatever they arent expecting or talking anything about him, because alot of people see him as an overrated bust, not just me.

Sure you can look on his best days and say he is a good defender, usually he is far from that, even further from a good rebounder and to say he is intelligent and works hard, well i havent seen any signs of either, he still looks like the chubby awkward kid from 2 years ago, after this year i wont say that im right, you will!!

Oh btw, for all the talk of his exceptional speed, he rarely finishes around the rim or beats anyone off the dribble. He can shoot anywhere from the floor when he is wide open, with a hand in the face he was horrible last year, disgraceful for a 7 footer, his shooting % is among the lowest in the league for a guy who started that many games and for all the talk his fans give to his passing game, he averages less then 1 dime a game, wow, stellar.

If i have no right to write him off (but as a fan i think i do, just as much as you do to say he is special), then you have no right after last year to keep tooting his horn and making excuses for him, even among hardcore Bargs fans, its not like his 1st year left you thinking he was going to be a superstar, did it? If so, guess thats good for you, i never have got the feeling from him, he doesnt have that drive and determination, nevermind the talent.

Last edited by Ugo Ferst; 09-09-2008 at 09:54 AM.
Ugo Ferst is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2008, 11:57 AM   #29 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TuggleBled View Post
my concern is whether specialist is referring to him coming off the bench more-so then whatever other reasons there could be to it. it doesn't add up, everyone is expecting superstardom from this kid and he's talking about specialist?
It does add up. When Sam has to use him he usually throws him out on the perimeter. Sounds like he wants to do more than that and he's been taking the initiative to work to reaching that goal.
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2008, 01:08 PM   #30 (permalink)
whatever

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: toronto
Posts: 9,399
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
I hope im wrong, but what evidence do you really have that im not? He had a decent playoffs vs NJ, nothing spectatular, on a whole his 1st season was decent, again, nothing spectatular, even his shooting % wasnt great. To say he can be a superstar worthy of number 1 pick by what he has shown so far, well to me, thats insane. He has shown he could be a decent role player in the future, but if your depending on him to carry a team, that will NEVER happen.
nobody is saying he's worthy of the #1 pick, at least not yet. the argument is whether his future holds that potential or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
Doesnt your arguement work both ways, perhaps you are saying he will be great on the off chance he is you will hail yourself and BC as genius'??
you have a point here - although I don't really care, it's hard for me to prove it ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
"Most people in the business"?? Who are these people? Most people i know in the business dont even talk about Bargs? Why? Because he isnt worth talking about, maybe you mean most Raptors fans? Most Raptors writers? Because if you are talking SI, ESPN, TNT or whatever they arent expecting or talking anything about him, because alot of people see him as an overrated bust, not just me.
when they're talking, I've yet to see anybody saying that he's a bust. His name pops up from time to time in espn chats and various previews etc. If he was playing in another market, he might have had more coverage, that's for sure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
Sure you can look on his best days and say he is a good defender, usually he is far from that, even further from a good rebounder and to say he is intelligent and works hard, well i havent seen any signs of either, he still looks like the chubby awkward kid from 2 years ago, after this year i wont say that im right, you will!!
I find it hard to believe that you didn't see signs of a good defender in Bargnani - you would be the only one on this forum in that position ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
Oh btw, for all the talk of his exceptional speed, he rarely finishes around the rim or beats anyone off the dribble.
those are different matters - he lacks strength and especially conditioning, but spees is what allows him to play as a 3 in this league, something that howard or bynum will never be able to do, despite their much superior strength.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
He can shoot anywhere from the floor when he is wide open, with a hand in the face he was horrible last year, disgraceful for a 7 footer, his shooting % is among the lowest in the league for a guy who started that many games and for all the talk his fans give to his passing game, he averages less then 1 dime a game, wow, stellar.
that's just not true, he did shoot very very well from 3pt range in his first season, with or without a hand in his face. His fg% is very low because he almost never scores easy baskets, are you ready to argue that moon is a better shooter than Bargnani? Hopefully last season's problems were due to his injuries, he was missing open and contested shots equally, so "adjustments" from our opposition can't be a factor. Whether it was due to injuries, lack of confidence or whatever, it's something that can be fixed. His mechanics were great in his first season, he has a very quick release and he's taller than almost everybody on the floor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugo Ferst View Post
If i have no right to write him off (but as a fan i think i do, just as much as you do to say he is special), then you have no right after last year to keep tooting his horn and making excuses for him, even among hardcore Bargs fans, its not like his 1st year left you thinking he was going to be a superstar, did it? If so, guess thats good for you, i never have got the feeling from him, he doesnt have that drive and determination, nevermind the talent.
If there's one area that concerns me is his determination. I think it's unquestionable that he has talent, despite your claims. I've yet to see anybody else questioning Bargnani's talent to be honest, so it's weird that I even have to argue this point.
However, sometimes I wonder if he's really driven to be a great player. I know he wants it, and he's saying all the right things. But I think it's not enough. He seems to me like a very bright guy who has a lot of side interests, and it's a lot harder to stay focused on just one thing - not impossible, but harder. I very much doubt that what he wants the most is to be the best player in the world. Hopefully I'm wrong, but that's my biggest fear.
moremilk is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2008, 05:37 PM   #31 (permalink)
Scrub City

Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 744
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollo View Post
Thats a very positive outlook. I'm on the fence with that. I want to see him do so many things well before I pencil him in for it. He might have Joey Graham syndrome... That can be fatal without a lobotomy.
I didn't word that properly. I meant he should start doing things well if he wants to be known for it. At this point he hasn't done anything to justify being treated as a starter or an all-star.

If last year is an indication of his future then it looks like he'll be going back to Europe.
t-bag is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2008, 07:34 PM   #32 (permalink)
a dick

Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,151
Representing:
Default

That's an over statement. You don't think he's good enough to be in the league?
Apollo is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 11:51 AM   #33 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Superjudge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,592
Representing:
Default

All of you need to stop referring to him as the #1 pick. Get over it, the draft is what it is, there are very few "busts" and alot of bad decisions. Its called a lottery for a reason, these kids are all capable of being both good and bad. Roy is exactly what was expected, and guess what, his knee is too.

Bargnani may or may not be a star one day, but who cares, the goal at this point is to look ahead to developing him as well as you can, and to put him in positions to succeed.

thats it.

past = gone.

future = right around the corner.

it's redundant and counter productive to look back at his draft placement.
Superjudge is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 12:10 PM   #34 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Superjudge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,592
Representing:
Default

ps. he looked in better shape already in that video, thats a good thing.
Superjudge is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 12:44 PM   #35 (permalink)
is back baby

Large and in charge
 
Snooch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All up in there
Posts: 8,160
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superjudge View Post
ps. he looked in better shape already in that video, thats a good thing.
I want Bargs lean and mean.
Snooch is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 12:45 PM   #36 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Superjudge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,592
Representing:
Default

well you can finally see muscles. Kid was built like a bag of milk last year
Superjudge is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 12:46 PM   #37 (permalink)
is back baby

Large and in charge
 
Snooch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All up in there
Posts: 8,160
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superjudge View Post
well you can finally see muscles. Kid was built like a bag of milk last year
Thats mean, He looked more like a loaf of bread.....
Snooch is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 12:50 PM   #38 (permalink)
is pounding the rock!

Senior Member
 
Superjudge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 17,592
Representing:
Default

milk, bread, he was still getting the Honey.... he's Italian.
Superjudge is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2008, 01:05 PM   #39 (permalink)
is back baby

Large and in charge
 
Snooch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: All up in there
Posts: 8,160
Representing:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Superjudge View Post
milk, bread, he was still getting the Honey.... he's Italian.
I wonder if Bargs has ever driven an Iroc?
Snooch is offline   Boss Key Wife Key Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ulmer: "OíNealís fate is tied to Bargnaniís" Dr. J. Naismith Toronto Raptors 25 01-15-2009 08:33 PM
Bargnani si giudica come numero "3" [audio] praja RF in Italian 12 12-05-2008 05:03 AM
Bargnani: "Non tutti hanno un maestro come Jermaine" [audio] praja RF in Italian 3 11-17-2008 04:07 AM
Jawai, un aborigeno in NBA: "Io e Bargnani, che coppia" praja RF in Italian 0 10-08-2008 10:56 AM
Grange: "Is it too early to give up on Bargnani?" Dr. J. Naismith Toronto Raptors 14 03-28-2008 01:47 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:04 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright RaptorsForum.com 2005-2011

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24