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-   -   Andirka Nowitzgnani - Compare if you dare (http://www.raptorsforum.com/f/f5/andirka-nowitzgnani-compare-if-you-dare-18126.html)

TORaptor4Ever 11-22-2010 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 464887)
I like how AB"s points come in the flow of the offence..... Rarely has he forced his scoring. Unlike Bosh last year, who was somewhat efficient if you look at his numbers, Bargnani doesnt' disrupt ball flow and therefore an argument could be made that others are getting better looks and easier points.

People keep harping on this.... why I don't know.

Our offense was one of the best in the league last season WITH Bosh. That certainly wasn't a weakness.

This season our young kids have improved (Weems, DD, Amir) and we have more reliable weapons in support (Kleiza, Barbosa).

We're still force-feeding Bargs the same way that we force-fed Bosh many times last season.... because that's what you do when you have a favourable matchup that the other team can't stop.

Ex2k 11-22-2010 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Vito (Post 464897)
Dirk is clutch, Dirk is consistent, Dirk can be a leader.

Andrea isn't clutch, Andrea isn't consistent, Andrea isn't a leader.

Dirk has 8 freakinnnnnnnn more years experience then him...

My question is... at this time they are putting up almost close to the same stats...

For half the price...

Is Andrea heading into the same path career wise as Dirk... can Bargs be the 3 things you described above within the next few years instead of 7-8 more? (develop faster then Dirk)

eazy187 11-22-2010 05:43 PM

^

all of your logic means nothing if Bargs isn't averaging 7+ rebounds per game.

:police:

carp 11-22-2010 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eazy187 (Post 464906)
^

all of your logic means nothing if Bargs isn't averaging 7+ rebounds per game.

:police:

fail.

Superjudge 11-22-2010 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Vito (Post 464897)
Dirk is clutch, Dirk is consistent, Dirk can be a leader.

Andrea isn't clutch, Andrea isn't consistent, Andrea isn't a leader.

He's clutch.

As clutch as anyone else in the NBA.

jus sayin

TORaptor4Ever 11-22-2010 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ex2k (Post 464903)
Dirk has 8 freakinnnnnnnn more years experience then him...

My question is... at this time they are putting up almost close to the same stats...

For half the price...

Is Andrea heading into the same path career wise as Dirk... can Bargs be the 3 things you described above within the next few years instead of 7-8 more? (develop faster then Dirk)

He's not going to develop faster than Dirk.

He's already lost that battle.

In Dirk's 3rd season he was avging 22 + 9.

In his 4th and 5th he was flirting with 24 & 10.

carp 11-22-2010 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever (Post 464924)
He's not going to develop faster than Dirk.

He's already lost that battle.

In Dirk's 3rd season he was avging 22 + 9.

In his 4th and 5th he was flirting with 24 & 10.

He also won't be getting paid like Dirk either. Comparing him to Dirk is a copout to not being able to accept that AB can be a legitimate starter in this league for many years.

ha123 11-22-2010 08:01 PM

Andrea will never be an MVP.
He will never lead a team to a 60+ win season.
He will never take his team to the finals.
Bargs will probably never be an all star either.

I don't get some ppl here, they thought bosh's stats were inflated and now that bargs is getting 20ppg on a shit team, they think he is the next dirk. :facepalm:

And numbers don't mean anything, would u take monta ellis over kobe cuz he is averaging better stats than him this season?

Dirk is a future hall of famer, lets not disrespect him by comparing him to a bust.

carp 11-22-2010 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ha123 (Post 464949)
Andrea will never be an MVP.
He will never lead a team to a 60+ win season.
He will never take his team to the finals.
Bargs will probably never be an all star either.

I don't get some ppl here, they thought bosh's stats were inflated and now that bargs is getting 20ppg on a shit team, they think he is the next dirk. :facepalm:

And numbers don't mean anything, would u take monta ellis over kobe cuz he is averaging better stats than him this season?

Dirk is a future hall of famer, lets not disrespect him by comparing him to a bust.

It's foolish to call AB a bust, but judging how you put together an argument, I can see your logic is simply flawed.

Of course AB isn't as good as Dirk, but everything else you said is not factual.

ha123 11-22-2010 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 464953)
It's foolish to call AB a bust, but judging how you put together an argument, I can see your logic is simply flawed.

Of course AB isn't as good as Dirk, but everything else you said is not factual.

Bargnani is a good player but not even close to being good enough to be the #1 overall pick. Which is why he is considered a bust to me.

Comparing dirk with him and thinking that he produces the same amount on the court as him for less amount of money is just foolish.

carp 11-22-2010 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ha123 (Post 464955)
Bargnani is a good player but not even close to being good enough to be the #1 overall pick. Which is why he is considered a bust to me.

Comparing dirk with him and thinking that he produces the same amount on the court as him for less amount of money is just foolish.

Your first point is wrong.... look at that draft and tell me who is worth the number one pick. IF we had taken Roy, we'd be complaining about his knees. Aldridge is no #1 by your standards. It's like you assume every draft year has equal talent levels.

Your second point is correct. There is no point in comparing him to Dirk.

ha123 11-22-2010 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 464956)
Your first point is wrong.... look at that draft and tell me who is worth the number one pick. IF we had taken Roy, we'd be complaining about his knees. Aldridge is no #1 by your standards. It's like you assume every draft year has equal talent levels.

Your second point is correct. There is no point in comparing him to Dirk.

I'll take Rudy Gay and a no knee brandon roy over bargnani any day.

10 11-22-2010 09:11 PM

Dirk also overcame a lot of knocks like Andrea has, but mind you Nellie's system definitely made it easier for him to develop.

Rebounding, toughness, aggresiveness on D, leadership...things that people have critisised him for over the last decade.

At this point, he's as tough as he's ever been in his career and most of those things I think he's improved on tremendously. 10 straight years of 50+ wins is a feat that a lot of people don't give enough credit to. They'll likely get 11 after this year. That's as consistent as you can get. Unfortunately they've never had that ball dominating guard to take them to the next level in the playoffs.

At the pace he's going, Dirk can probably play into his early 40's and still not lose much. The guys conditioning has always been great. His offseason training regimen is unlike any other players, and most importantly the guy hasn't lost an ounce of passion for the game. His team will likely beat the Lakers record of 12 straight 50+ win seasons soon (Spurs can tie it this year) and that kind of consistency I find is underrated by most when talking about Dirk.

Bargnani ain't him. Bargnani doesn't have that ferocious drive. Dirk was lackadaisical too in the beginning, but he trained hard every summer. That's why nobody can move like him. Nobody has his midrange game. And almost nobody is as clutch as he is. (Since 2006, Dirk has the most game winning shots with under 5 seconds left in the game.)

I was praying Andrea would at least develop some of Dirks habits, but it's too late.

We're comparing a 5 rebound a game center to a 1st ballot HOF'er and the greatest European basketball player in NBA (possibly all time) history.

Close the books on this one.

TORaptor4Ever 11-22-2010 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carp (Post 464928)
He also won't be getting paid like Dirk either. Comparing him to Dirk is a copout to not being able to accept that AB can be a legitimate starter in this league for many years.

How much do you think he'll be making if he's avging 22 + 6 in a couple years' time? Certainly more than $10M/yr.

And I never said anything at all about Bargs not being able to start in this league. Never.

That being said, the comparisons to Dirk are silly and premature at best.

EDIT: Pretty much +1 to what gizz said too.

carp 11-22-2010 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever (Post 464973)
How much do you think he'll be making if he's avging 22 + 6 in a couple years' time? Certainly more than $10M/yr.

And I never said anything at all about Bargs not being able to start in this league. Never.

That being said, the comparisons to Dirk are silly and premature at best.

EDIT: Pretty much +1 to what gizz said too.

I never did say you said that.

In a couple of years? AB will be on this contract for the next 5 years. That is the value right there.

I agree, he's not Dirk and will never be.... but he's no bust as some would suggest and he's showing more and more consistently that he can be a very good player.

carp 11-22-2010 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ha123 (Post 464969)
I'll take Rudy Gay and a no knee brandon roy over bargnani any day.

Now you would... yes. Sidenote, Gay looks amazing this year.

Gay was no lock to be a star though, and he was also passed over by 7 teams I think.... Even Gay as a #1 overall would be sort of a letdown for some. It really does show that the draft year was pretty brutal.

Ex2k 11-22-2010 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TORaptor4Ever (Post 464973)
How much do you think he'll be making if he's avging 22 + 6 in a couple years' time? Certainly more than $10M/yr.

couple of years?


Do you realize we have him for another 4 years at 10 mill a season??????????

When his contract is done he'll be in the NBA for 9 years!

Putting up the same stats as Dirk NOW

Ex2k 11-22-2010 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ha123 (Post 464949)
Andrea will never be an MVP.
He will never lead a team to a 60+ win season.
He will never take his team to the finals.
Bargs will probably never be an all star either.

Dude, put him on Dallas that year with how he's playing in his 5th year now and your telling me he cant put up those numbers and get to 60+ with THAT team?

You guys are making out Dirk to be a Kobe or Lebron!

He's 5 fucking years in guys playing on this rebuilding RAPTORS team...:facepalm:

Beesh 11-22-2010 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Someguy again (Post 464691)
sup

not much how u doing.
y are they comparing u to Andarehya Baarrny-yarrr-ny? when ur a former mvp+multiple playoff appearances+finals appearance?

(i was joking about the response, i know ur not the real dirk....or are uuuu?):suspicious:

Acie 11-22-2010 10:07 PM

I prefer Dirdrea Bargwitzki


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