Andirka Nowitzgnani - Compare if you dare - Page 2
Old 11-22-2010, 10:30 AM   #21 (permalink)
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LOL. Dirk scores 24 a game and his teammates are J. Terry, C. Butler, Marion, Chandler, Barea and the rest. You think Bargs would average 20 ppg in that team?
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:37 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Ex2K.

Don't worry too much about what you're reading here, most these guys mean well but aren't too hip to the scene.

You're right. When you break down the actual production vs. the cost, Bargnani isn't a bad guy to have around if you're comparing him to Dirk. Bargnani, while in his 5th year, is still a kid. He has a lot of time to develop into a better leader. He is not as good as Dirk yet. However, for half the salary, he is a deal.

What people can't seem to get past is this; nobody is saying Bargnani is as good as Nowitzki. All anyone is acknowledging is that Bargnani is almost as productive. To scoff at this, and to make negative statements means that you somehow believe the alternative is to have Dirk instead of Bargnani.

Well you can't.

So that's that. You have what you have.

Honestly, Bargnani is as frustrating as he is a delight to watch. He is a GM's nightmare.

You trade the guy, he spends a year or two figuring out some stuff, starts playing better help defence (as most post guys do with age) and starts to rebound (an unavoidable byproduct of learning to play defence) and you look like a chump.

Keep him. He makes no improvements. You look like a chump. Bargnani just did what Chris Bosh could never do. He stepped in and coldly dropped 30 on the Celtics. Got bashed hard by davis, Garnett and Shaq, and didn't blink. Thats not a small thing.

He also let Celtic player drive to the rim unchallenged.

Enigma.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:42 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Ex2K.

Don't worry too much about what you're reading here, most these guys mean well but aren't too hip to the scene.

You're right. When you break down the actual production vs. the cost, Bargnani isn't a bad guy to have around if you're comparing him to Dirk. Bargnani, while in his 5th year, is still a kid. He has a lot of time to develop into a better leader. He is not as good as Dirk yet. However, for half the salary, he is a deal.

What people can't seem to get past is this; nobody is saying Bargnani is as good as Nowitzki. All anyone is acknowledging is that Bargnani is almost as productive. To scoff at this, and to make negative statements means that you somehow believe the alternative is to have Dirk instead of Bargnani.

Well you can't.

So that's that. You have what you have.

Honestly, Bargnani is as frustrating as he is a delight to watch. He is a GM's nightmare.

You trade the guy, he spends a year or two figuring out some stuff, starts playing better help defence (as most post guys do with age) and starts to rebound (an unavoidable byproduct of learning to play defence) and you look like a chump.

Keep him. He makes no improvements. You look like a chump. Bargnani just did what Chris Bosh could never do. He stepped in and coldly dropped 30 on the Celtics. Got bashed hard by davis, Garnett and Shaq, and didn't blink. Thats not a small thing.

He also let Celtic player drive to the rim unchallenged.

Enigma.
*Ahem*

That's what I already said, just more succintly.

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Old 11-22-2010, 10:46 AM   #24 (permalink)
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LOL. Dirk scores 24 a game and his teammates are J. Terry, C. Butler, Marion, Chandler, Barea and the rest. You think Bargs would average 20 ppg in that team?
Yes...

Swap them.. He will still put up 20 a game in Dallas..
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:48 AM   #25 (permalink)
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The important thing is the identity of the team and how Bargnani fits into that scheme. Period. With the right team he can amount to what Sheed amounted to, which was a frustrating underachiever individually, but an extremely important part of a great squad. With a team designed around the tendency to put offense ahead of defense, any successes are likely to be outweighed by the failures.

The GM doesn't need to have nightmares - he just needs to have a good idea of how he wants to build a team.

And that's not a knock on what BC is or is not doing. I think all of that is still up in the air. And if he honestly feels that being a team filled with offensive juggernauts is the best route to go and pursues that whole-heartedly, then I don't have any major qualms. If he goes that route just to put bums in seats, then I would feel it's misguided and will probably lead to disaster. But honestly - this team at the moment feels more like the Pistons than the Mavs, so here's hoping that continues.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:04 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I agree LX. You know I love Colangelo, but he also created this situation.

It's tough operating in Toronto, I get that, but the Bargnani saga has been an interesting one to say the least.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:07 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Yes...

Swap them.. He will still put up 20 a game in Dallas..
I though you sarcastic, but as I can see, you not. Come on, sorry I am such an asshole but Raptors is the worst NBA team on paper. And look, even Weems scores 14 points per game here! Weems... Weems man!

I like Bargnani but he's not even close to Dirk. Andrea is not a 20 ppg player yet. He scores a lot because Raptors roster looks more like Euroleague team squad. besides Bargs, who are the best scorers on this team? Probably Barbosa and Kleiza - and they both injured.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:24 AM   #28 (permalink)
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and this pointless debate rages on ....and on and on....

in 14 games AB is averaging 21.7 a game...FG% is .459 and his 3P% is .432
FT% is .836

that's 17th overall people...quite frankly, i don't give a fuck what Dirk is doing as long as AB continues to play like he has this year
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Old 11-22-2010, 01:21 PM   #29 (permalink)
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and this pointless debate rages on ....and on and on....

in 14 games AB is averaging 21.7 a game...FG% is .459 and his 3P% is .432
FT% is .836

that's 17th overall people...quite frankly, i don't give a fuck what Dirk is doing as long as AB continues to play like he has this year
Tnank youuuuuuu! Let dirk do him Bargs is dois thing nd I'm liking it so fear nd if yu don't think he knowd he can get better yur fooling yurself dirk is a great player Bargs can be a great player too forget stats.. Yesterday shows how competitive baargs is way more den Bosh imo nd he's just too skilled a big man plus speed nd d slickest jumper from anywhere on the floor.. Nd dirk always gets the ball becaause hiis team trusts him but Bargs isn't there yet
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Old 11-22-2010, 02:44 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Tnank youuuuuuu! Let dirk do him Bargs is dois thing nd I'm liking it so fear nd if yu don't think he knowd he can get better yur fooling yurself dirk is a great player Bargs can be a great player too forget stats.. Yesterday shows how competitive baargs is way more den Bosh imo nd he's just too skilled a big man plus speed nd d slickest jumper from anywhere on the floor.. Nd dirk always gets the ball becaause hiis team trusts him but Bargs isn't there yet
Huh?
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Old 11-22-2010, 02:46 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Allow me to translate.

Bargs > Jesus
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:18 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I though you sarcastic, but as I can see, you not. Come on, sorry I am such an asshole but Raptors is the worst NBA team on paper. And look, even Weems scores 14 points per game here! Weems... Weems man!

I like Bargnani but he's not even close to Dirk. Andrea is not a 20 ppg player yet. He scores a lot because Raptors roster looks more like Euroleague team squad. besides Bargs, who are the best scorers on this team? Probably Barbosa and Kleiza - and they both injured.
Toronto Started off with a new team.
They Won a game, then lost a bunch and were 2-9.

They are now 5-9 and have beat the top two team in the eastern conference.

Weems is a good player.

What is your point. Toronto is still an NBA team that you have to show up against, I'm getting a bit tired of this argument. Lets find the first option on every team tied with toronto or worse, then I want you to belittle that player and say he is only getting points because his team is shitty.

It makes no sense brother!!!!
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:47 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Toronto Started off with a new team.
They Won a game, then lost a bunch and were 2-9.

They are now 5-9 and have beat the top two team in the eastern conference.

Weems is a good player.

What is your point. Toronto is still an NBA team that you have to show up against, I'm getting a bit tired of this argument. Lets find the first option on every team tied with toronto or worse, then I want you to belittle that player and say he is only getting points because his team is shitty.

It makes no sense brother!!!!
Lol... I love this argument.

Since when is it EASIER to play with a shit team and have defenses key in on you all game long?
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:53 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Lol... I love this argument.

Since when is it EASIER to play with a shit team and have defenses key in on you all game long?
Are you serious? have you never heard of "best player on a bad team" syndrome?

I will give you another name from our past - Damon Stoudamire.
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:58 PM   #35 (permalink)
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9 Million reasons...

Mr Dirk has been a big FLOP leading his team anywhere you can argue...no?

NBA finals appearence? Only to be embarrased by Mr D wade and the Heat after being up 2-0 in the series start...

Also, a year later, apart of one of the biggest upsets in NBA history... with a league leading 67-15 win record losing to Golden State in the first round that year?

Many people here say Andrea is not a Franchise player, or to a extent not even a 2nd option on a good team...

Look at the numbers... Isn't Dirk a franchise guy? Will Andrea go down the same path? lol
You didn't watch those finals, did you? Dallas was royally screwed. I was cheering for Miami, and it was palpable. Miami, specifically Wade, benefited from too many phantom fouls for me to overlook.
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:58 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Are you serious? have you never heard of "best player on a bad team" syndrome?

I will give you another name from our past - Damon Stoudamire.
Who was also a very good player.

He just made a stupid move and went to a team that didn't need to maximize his talents.

Best player on a bad team syndrome applies to SOME players... not all.

Was KG "the best player on a bad team" when he was in Minny?

Was T-Mac in ORL?

Was Kobe for 2 years in LA when they barely won 40 games?

Was Wade for the past few years in MIA?
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:00 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Are you serious? have you never heard of "best player on a bad team" syndrome?

I will give you another name from our past - Damon Stoudamire.
That argument only works if the player is scoring a bunch inefficiently. Which is usually the case.

And Mighty Mouse was awesome. So there.
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:09 PM   #38 (permalink)
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That argument only works if the player is scoring a bunch inefficiently. Which is usually the case.

And Mighty Mouse was awesome. So there.
I like how AB"s points come in the flow of the offence..... Rarely has he forced his scoring. Unlike Bosh last year, who was somewhat efficient if you look at his numbers, Bargnani doesnt' disrupt ball flow and therefore an argument could be made that others are getting better looks and easier points.
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:26 PM   #39 (permalink)
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You didn't watch those finals, did you? Dallas was royally screwed. I was cheering for Miami, and it was palpable. Miami, specifically Wade, benefited from too many phantom fouls for me to overlook.
Dude

Now you sound like a Boston Celtic fan from Sunday.....

Blameing the refs? The heat won 4 in a fucking row!

With im assuming different ref's for each game!
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:33 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Dirk is clutch, Dirk is consistent, Dirk can be a leader.

Andrea isn't clutch, Andrea isn't consistent, Andrea isn't a leader.
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