Amir = Starting 4 of the future?
Old 02-12-2013, 10:53 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Amir = Starting 4 of the future?

I know everyone already loves this guy, but I think he deserves some serious consideration to have the starting 4 position on lock this year and next.

I know it's a small sample size, but in his games as a starter (14 games):

14.8 points
10.4 rebounds
2.1 assists
1.7 blocks
1.4 steals
57% FG
70% FT

These are pretty destructive statistics, especially considering that next to none of our game plan revolves around him. He provides serious heart and grit on top of all of these stats too. Can be said that he is the identity of this team.

Do you guys still think he should be a bench player or has he done enough to have a legitimate long term shot and being our starting 4 for the rest of this year and next.
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Old 02-12-2013, 10:59 AM   #2 (permalink)
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i like him as a spot starter. I think he's one of those guys that can pretty much play in any given situation as the 4 or the 5 - even when up against bigger dudes, his heart and will make up for a couple inches. Can't say i've given much thought about if he should be a starter, but i know he will continue to see a ton of playing time.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:00 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10gizzle View Post
I know everyone already loves this guy, but I think he deserves some serious consideration to have the starting 4 position on lock this year and next.

I know it's a small sample size, but in his games as a starter (14 games):

14.8 points
10.4 rebounds
2.1 assists
1.7 blocks
1.4 steals
57% FG
70% FT

These are pretty destructive statistics, especially considering that next to none of our game plan revolves around him. He provides serious heart and grit on top of all of these stats too. Can be said that he is the identity of this team.

Do you guys still think he should be a bench player or has he done enough to have a legitimate long term shot and being our starting 4 for the rest of this year and next.

If we're ever going to be legit he'd be a bench player playing 25+min IMO. That would be when we know we have real depth.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:00 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I think he's earned it until we get a legitimate upgrade talent wise at the four. Like a Millsap or Josh Smith talent. People don't know how many injuries he's probably fighting and he still suits up. You can tell when you look at him when the whistle blows, he's always grimacing or limping. He doesn't get enough praise IMO
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:01 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jeffb View Post
If we're ever going to be legit he'd be a bench player playing 25+min IMO. That would be when we know we have real depth.
But what would we want the starter (whoever it'll be) to do in addition to what Amir already does is my question...

I mean, if it's a 20-10 caliber player or legit all star, I understand.

But both statistically and effort/character wise Amir gives you almost everything.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:04 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Why not? If you have a dynamic scorer like Bargnani off the bench at the 4, why can't Amir be enough as the starter.... provided that JV is all that we need him to be going forward. I'd think we need a C to bridge the gap more than a PF right now cause Amir and AB can hold the fort if they're surrounded by a good cast, including two-way players like Gay and Lowry... and eventually Ross... and maybe DD if he can become a two-way player consistently.

So sure, why not?
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:09 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 10gizzle View Post
But what would we want the starter (whoever it'll be) to do in addition to what Amir already does is my question...

I mean, if it's a 20-10 caliber player or legit all star, I understand.

But both statistically and effort/character wise Amir gives you almost everything.
Whatever happened to wanting depth? If we ever want to go deep in a playoff run Amir is a backup and we have a Milsap type of player starting.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:17 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10gizzle View Post
But what would we want the starter (whoever it'll be) to do in addition to what Amir already does is my question...

I mean, if it's a 20-10 caliber player or legit all star, I understand.

But both statistically and effort/character wise Amir gives you almost everything.
The thing is Amir is always a bit under the radar, because opponents don't really prep against him much. He isn't exactly the kind of guy that you will give the ball to play 1on1 against his defender. However Amir makes a living of keeping plays alive and scoring buckets in putbacks.
As things stand i would not mind Amir being our starter, as long as he keeps the same role( energy guy who hustles on every play)... Amir Slightly reminds me Rodman when i watch him, not as good defensively but same motor and heart.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:19 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Take a look at Amir's per 36 numbers, and they line up very well with what he's been doing as a starter.

BR Link

While you're there, take a look at his advanced stats and see how they compare to guys like Josh Smith and Millsap and see if that "upgrade" is really worth 6-10 million a season.

I'm a big Amir supporter - as far as I'm concerned he's earned the starting spot, and I expect him to keep it.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:22 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Whatever happened to wanting depth? If we ever want to go deep in a playoff run Amir is a backup and we have a Milsap type of player starting.
depth is ok, but you can get by with solid players at certain positions.... and having great talents around them. Amir is a guy you don't have to worry about if you've got Gay at the three. It's amazing how much more flexible we can be with Gay instead of Landry at the three. Can't believe some still thought it was a bad deal.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:32 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I choo choose Amir Johnson over Smith and Millsap any given day, because we need hard workers, not 5 iso players in starting five. He completes us
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:41 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I choo choose Amir Johnson over Smith and Millsap any given day, because we need hard workers, not 5 iso players in starting five. He completes us
I agree with this.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:45 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by carp View Post
depth is ok, but you can get by with solid players at certain positions.... and having great talents around them. Amir is a guy you don't have to worry about if you've got Gay at the three. It's amazing how much more flexible we can be with Gay instead of Landry at the three. Can't believe some still thought it was a bad deal.
Oh well, getting by...sure.
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Old 02-12-2013, 11:47 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Amir has been a quality player for at least 2-3 years now; he's just had to manage his fouls better so that he could play more often. His per 36 minutes over his career are pretty good. Unfortunately, he still leads the league in fouls.
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:12 PM   #15 (permalink)
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is there a way to see how many fouls he commits when starting and coming off the bench?
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:17 PM   #16 (permalink)
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is there a way to see how many fouls he commits when starting and coming off the bench?
BR Amir Johnson splits

52 fouls in 14 starts this season - that's almost 2.2 fouls per game.

So, yeah, as a starter he doesn't foul as much, which makes sense because most bigs off the bench are supposed to foul a lot.
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:17 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10gizzle View Post
But what would we want the starter (whoever it'll be) to do in addition to what Amir already does is my question...

I mean, if it's a 20-10 caliber player or legit all star, I understand.

But both statistically and effort/character wise Amir gives you almost everything.
Love Amir. Great passer, has a good jumpshot now, good scorer. But truly the answer is defend better and foul less.

He deserves to start over Bargs if that's part of the question.

PS he fouls less at the 4 if he starts than the 5... obviously.

Last edited by JoeyJoJo Shabbadu; 02-12-2013 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:19 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Zalgiris View Post
I choo choose Amir Johnson over Smith and Millsap any given day, because we need hard workers, not 5 iso players in starting five. He completes us
This is your best post ever I think. You're so right. 5 iso guys just doesn't work. You need role guys that do the dirty work, set the screens, battle for loose balls, rebound, pass up open looks early in the clock,.... you can't have five scorers on at once. There needs to be guys getting others involved and not just guys trying to get themselves going, which we've only had since the Vince days.
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:21 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by box1992 View Post
is there a way to see how many fouls he commits when starting and coming off the bench?
Starting:
36.4 MPG
14.8 PPG
10.4 RPG
3.7 FPG

Bench:
20.6 MPG
6.8 PPG
5.4 RPG
3.8 FPG
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:21 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EggsToTheBBQ View Post
BR Amir Johnson splits

52 fouls in 14 starts this season - that's almost 2.2 fouls per game.

So, yeah, as a starter he doesn't foul as much, which makes sense because most bigs off the bench are supposed to foul a lot.
Ye that is what I thought I heard. someone pointed it out, if we have a scoring big off the bench aka bargs, this could work out well
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