World Soccer Thread - Page 440
Old 09-02-2013, 05:10 PM   #8781 (permalink)
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an interesting debate i've seen played out in a few forums recently is about the correlation between squad strength (how good the players are,) and team "togetherness." and within that we could be talking tactically, does everyone understand their role, and also of course team spirit/chemistry. Are all the players happy, does everyone get on, how good is the manager at managing the egos. Also of course, we are talking about cohesion, a lot of new players can cause problems initially, or even in the medium to long-term.

great squads can definitely be badly hindered by lack of togetherness (man city last year,) and mediocre/quite good teams can definitely be raised up a great deal by good tactics and togetherness. But is there a limit teams like that can reach without any/many world-class players?

Which is more important? can you be successful only having one of them? or with one being a lot less than the other?

i mean, the battle for the premiership and the top 4 four is absolutely intriguing. Here's how i assess the top 6:

man utd: big worries over squad strength and team togetherness. However they do still have a lot of class players and although moyes might take a while to stamp his authority, they won't just instantly lose all of that togetherness and belief that fergie instilled.

man city: good transfers brought in, better mix of personalities as well, could address a lot of the ego issues they've had in the past. Also looking like new manager is better equipped at dealing with players. however, so far the cohesion is looking like a big issue, both in terms of new players and tactics.

chelsea: very strong squad and proven manager. However, i'm less and less impressed with mourinho's tactics in the past few seasons. He's so negative! Imo, they have the fewest issues tho, still have them as favourites for the prem. Mourinho will make them hard to beat. (Don't think they'll do well in europe tho.)

Arsenal: strong squad, but with some glaring issues. However, they have by far the best "togetherness" imo. The team spirit is strong, they all trust and believe in the manager, they understand the tactics and their roles.

spurs: extremely strong squad, however, temporarily at least, the worst togetherness issues.

liverpool: weakest squad (although not by much imo,) but after arsenal, the best togetherness imo. The squad have adapted to rodgers better/faster than spurs have to AVB imo.

the prem this season is almost impossible to estimate imo. The only things i'm fairly certain on are the LFC won't win the league (arsenal and spurs very unlikely,) and that none of utd, chelsea, city will finish 6th (unlikely any of them will finish 5th but certainly not impossible. esp utd, who at this point are looking vulnerable.)

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Old 09-02-2013, 07:11 PM   #8782 (permalink)
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Arsenal needed Ozil more than I think others believe.

One too many times last season, we would enter the attacking third and just struggle. We weren't sure what to do, and really a lot of that had to with losing both RVP and Song (Song in his final season assumed more of a play making role instead of defensive role). We tried Cazorla there last season, but he's more suited on the wing.

Really, right now, we've replaced what we've lost in Cesc so I'm thrilled and really we're replacing Podolski. I know we were looking to acquire a 9 (and yeah, I read the rumors of Benzema), and I know Giroud has been on form right now, but if we're looking at being a top tier team we could've used a bit of reinforcement there.

To my earlier point though, I'm not too worried about having a CDM. Monreal has somewhat assumed that role and he's done well and with Jenkinson's continued development I'm pretty pleased with this one signing. I still think we struggle to finish fourth, but it strengthens our side so I'm pleased.

As for the Spurs improving argument. You can sign quality parts, but Bale assumes attention. Take it from a the standpoint of a fan who seen highly rated players leave. The field shrinks and world-class players can really make above-average players look greater. Losing Bale is big.

Lastly, I only watch Real to watch Modric play, and he had a fantastic game - about time. I still think he's one the wrong team, I still think that Mourinho nearly ruined his career (as he's about to do to Mata's), I still think that he needs to be sold. But still, he's rated highly for a reason.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:34 PM   #8783 (permalink)
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Really, right now, we've replaced what we've lost in Cesc so I'm thrilled and really we're replacing Podolski. I know we were looking to acquire a 9 (and yeah, I read the rumors of Benzema), and I know Giroud has been on form right now, but if we're looking at being a top tier team we could've used a bit of reinforcement there.

As for the Spurs improving argument. You can sign quality parts, but Bale assumes attention. Take it from a the standpoint of a fan who seen highly rated players leave. The field shrinks and world-class players can really make above-average players look greater. Losing Bale is big.

Lastly, I only watch Real to watch Modric play, and he had a fantastic game - about time. I still think he's one the wrong team, I still think that Mourinho nearly ruined his career (as he's about to do to Mata's), I still think that he needs to be sold. But still, he's rated highly for a reason.
Always nice to see players play positions they're best at. Not just meh or ok at.

Arsenal aren't looking at being a top team. Arsenal are looking to gain that 4th spot as per usual.

Also, I love Ozil but Cesc - he's just a true beast. Being able to play practically anywhere in midfield and anywhere up front while having insane quality and producing trophy winning moments - it's truly phenomenal. I call him the magic man for Espana.

Spurs got a consistent 20 goals/season (in league) CF in Soldado. Spurs got 2 players who are younger than Bale and have the potential to be better than him in Lamela and Eriksen (Eriksen is the buy of the summer by far). Spurs have deep wings + midfield. I predict Spurs to get anywhere from 3-5th. 5th being a giant disappointment. A lot of things would have to right (for Spurs) and a lot of things would have to go wrong (for other teams) for Spurs to get 2nd (even 3rd for that matter).

Well Luka is getting his shot now with Xabi out for awhile. He bossed the other day against a much improved Athletic. I don't know what Mou is doing with Mata. I'm shocked he's already showing his ego/pride in his first season there.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:46 PM   #8784 (permalink)
and a 1, and a 2, and a 1,2,3,4!

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1 game.

Lost Bale but improved the squad dramatically if you haven't noticed - Paulinho, Capoue, Soldado, Eriksen, Lamela, Chadli.

As great as Ozil is - he's not a CDM - nor is he a defender. Things which Arsenal really need to improve on. It's similar to like how Barca got Neymar - not really needed. A CB is needed first and foremost.
you're forgetting chiriches
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:52 PM   #8785 (permalink)
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you're forgetting chiriches
Does the loss of super loyal Bale hurt you or make you happy. You got so much money for him!
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:34 PM   #8786 (permalink)
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you're forgetting chiriches
Should've just kept Caulker.
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:36 PM   #8787 (permalink)
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Does the loss of super loyal Bale hurt you or make you happy. You got so much money for him!
I'd be bouncing off the f**king walls. Practically balanced out transfer money spent vs transfer money brought in. That money definitely helped getting 5+ starters.
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:12 AM   #8788 (permalink)
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Does the loss of super loyal Bale hurt you or make you happy. You got so much money for him!
we could have kept him and bought all these players. so no i'm pissed. but more so at madrid for once again tapping up players blatently and illegally, and for bale showing that he's a bitch. you want a transfer, ask for it. don't not play to move it along. pathetic. I lost all respect for him, and hope his career goes down in flames when the even bigger ego in ronaldo steam rolls over him, and madrid continue to be inferior to barcelona in laliga, and many other teams in champs league.


bitch ass club
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:13 AM   #8789 (permalink)
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Should've just kept Caulker.
i'd agree, but I have faith in AVB/baldini making that call. I think he just didn't fit the system
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Old 09-03-2013, 03:05 AM   #8790 (permalink)
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we could have kept him and bought all these players.
bitch ass club
Not sure if serious.

Can you stop blaming the club. Blame Perez who has too much power. Also - weren't you so excited at seeing Bale and CR7 play 2gether?
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Old 09-03-2013, 06:54 AM   #8791 (permalink)
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deadline day fallout:

http://www.theguardian.com/football/...llaini-everton (did people hear about this crazy "imposter business!?)

David Moyes does too little, too late for Manchester United's good | Football | The Guardian

Premier League: transfer window summer 2013 ? interactive | Football | theguardian.com

Sustainability limits are stretched by the global battle for the talent | Football | The Guardian (like the fact that morals were included in this debate as well practicality.)
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Old 09-03-2013, 06:55 AM   #8792 (permalink)
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deadline day fallout:

Marouane Fellaini transfer can't mask Manchester United's deadline-day farce | Football | The Guardian (did people hear about this crazy "imposter business!?)

David Moyes does too little, too late for Manchester United's good | Football | The Guardian

Premier League: transfer window summer 2013 ? interactive | Football | theguardian.com

Sustainability limits are stretched by the global battle for the talent | Football | The Guardian (like the fact that morals were included in this debate as well practicality.)

edit: wow, not sure how the duplicate post happened, sorry.

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Old 09-03-2013, 11:00 AM   #8793 (permalink)
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Well i'm glad that's over!
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Old 09-03-2013, 11:25 AM   #8794 (permalink)
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Bbc sport website is running a live page with reactions from deadline day. People sending in comments. One comment the mods decided to publish was that ericksen cost 31mill less than ozil but created 125 chances to only 85 by ozil, so he's obviously a better buy.

I sent in a reply (prob won't be published,) saying that ericksen played in an easier league, was his team's sole creator whereas ozil played with other class players and ericksen cost a lot less coz he only had 1yr left on his contract. Both great signings but ozil is the better player.

Don't wanna sound like a smart-arse, but come on man, this shit is obvious!
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:41 PM   #8795 (permalink)
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Bbc sport website is running a live page with reactions from deadline day. People sending in comments. One comment the mods decided to publish was that ericksen cost 31mill less than ozil but created 125 chances to only 85 by ozil, so he's obviously a better buy.

I sent in a reply (prob won't be published,) saying that ericksen played in an easier league, was his team's sole creator whereas ozil played with other class players and ericksen cost a lot less coz he only had 1yr left on his contract. Both great signings but ozil is the better player.

Don't wanna sound like a smart-arse, but come on man, this shit is obvious!
Good points. However, Eriksen is 4 years younger than Ozil so in theory has more potential. However - right now - not even close. Interesting that Eriksen made a move to a bigger stage as an expiring like Ozil did in 2010.

Ramos: I'd have stopped Ozil joining Arsenal - Goal.com

Arbeloa: I thought Ozil was joking about leaving Madrid - Goal.com

Arbeloa - the only joke present is Florentino Perez.

Also, even though I am deeply saddened by what has happened - I'm really excited to see Isco thrive. 3 goals in 3 games from midfield. I think if he can maintain his starting place at Real (which he surely will now) - he may be a starter or supersub off the bench for Espana in Brazil. Carlo wants a CAM like Isco who's not as naturally up front (stays back a bit more) as Ozil and given Isco's similar play to Iniesta I can understand his preference. Carlo envisioned Ozil on the right as a RAM/RW/RM but he just can't perform well there. Ozil will like playing full matches but he's gone from competing for top honours to competing for the chance to play in the UCL. It could be worse though - Ozil could've stayed disgruntled as a sub not playing full (or the majority of) matches like what is happening at Chelsea with their 10 in Mata.
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:46 PM   #8796 (permalink)
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La Liga makes ?102m profit, Premier League loses ?487m: Europe?s top five league summer spending in numbers - Goal.com
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:54 PM   #8797 (permalink)
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El Bara tiene derecho preferente sobre Sal y Manquillo

I knew it. No way would Villa go for that amount only to Atletico - had to be more to the deal than that. Barca has first option/right to buy Saul and Manquillo from Atletico. Very sly move.
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:58 PM   #8798 (permalink)
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Good points. However, Eriksen is 4 years younger than Ozil so in theory has more potential. However - right now - not even close. Interesting that Eriksen made a move to a bigger stage as an expiring like Ozil did in 2010.

Ramos: I'd have stopped Ozil joining Arsenal - Goal.com

Arbeloa: I thought Ozil was joking about leaving Madrid - Goal.com

Arbeloa - the only joke present is Florentino Perez.

Also, even though I am deeply saddened by what has happened - I'm really excited to see Isco thrive. 3 goals in 3 games from midfield. I think if he can maintain his starting place at Real (which he surely will now) - he may be a starter or supersub off the bench for Espana in Brazil. Carlo wants a CAM like Isco who's not as naturally up front (stays back a bit more) as Ozil and given Isco's similar play to Iniesta I can understand his preference. Carlo envisioned Ozil on the right as a RAM/RW/RM but he just can't perform well there. Ozil will like playing full matches but he's gone from competing for top honours to competing for the chance to play in the UCL. It could be worse though - Ozil could've stayed disgruntled as a sub not playing full (or the majority of) matches like what is happening at Chelsea with their 10 in Mata.
i need to watch some real games. I don't really like them but i do wanna see isco play, he sounds very exciting. Good points about ozil's position, it's a shame he couldn't perform as well on the left of the attacking 3.

all arsenal need is a GK and a DM and they are contenders for honours imo. Maybe a center-back and a striker too, but no team is perfect in ever area and when you let someone like giroud play through their problems, you never know they may start banging the goals in! Also, i think ozil will love playing for them.

wilshire, ramsey, arteta, cazorla, ozil, walcott, chamberlain, podolski, giroud. Not many teams have got better than that for attacking options.
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:59 PM   #8799 (permalink)
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El Bara tiene derecho preferente sobre Sal y Manquillo

I knew it. No way would Villa go for that amount only to Atletico - had to be more to the deal than that. Barca has first option/right to buy Saul and Manquillo from Atletico. Very sly move.
interesting.
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Old 09-03-2013, 08:24 PM   #8800 (permalink)
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i need to watch some real games. I don't really like them but i do wanna see isco play, he sounds very exciting. Good points about ozil's position, it's a shame he couldn't perform as well on the left of the attacking 3.

all arsenal need is a GK and a DM and they are contenders for honours imo. Maybe a center-back and a striker too, but no team is perfect in ever area and when you let someone like giroud play through their problems, you never know they may start banging the goals in! Also, i think ozil will love playing for them.

wilshire, ramsey, arteta, cazorla, ozil, walcott, chamberlain, podolski, giroud. Not many teams have got better than that for attacking options.
You really need to catch some games. Linkup play between the players is too awesome. Yeah it is a shame unfortunately - also - Ozil was being played on the right of the attacking 3.

But they didn't address those things. He probably will seeing as how it's all offense, he'll play full matches and he'll be the best player on the squad.

Again, pretty good attack but if the d and or CDM is faulty then it's not all that impressive.
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