Summer vacation - Page 2
Old 09-30-2010, 09:36 AM   #21 (permalink)
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To add to the massive list simply crazy put up, a few reasons why I think it won't work are:

1) Students are overworked.

Yes I'm serious. Most adults go to work for let's say a 9 hour work day (8-5 or 9-6). Many don't hit more than 8.

Take a student:

Class from 9 until 4. Everyone gets lunch and I realize they get recess or breaks but everyone takes breaks for coffee or just to relax, so let's call it even. So there is a 7 hour day. Then they have homework.

I don't think it would be fair to ask them to do that much work all year round.

2) There are some things you cannot learn at school
- Skills from summer jobs
- Skills from summer camp (personally, I learned a LOT socially and spiritually)
- How to do bad stuff while no adults are around and then cover it up

3) Kids are fat as fuck. They need some exercise and hopefully the summer off gives them the chance.

Fat bastards.
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:17 AM   #22 (permalink)
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students are not overworked
I used to be done with school/homework by 5 and my parents worked till 8
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Old 09-30-2010, 11:08 AM   #23 (permalink)
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nah students are over worked trust me on this. if you see the amount of work we get in class and the amount of readings we do, it really is stressful.
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Old 09-30-2010, 11:25 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windex View Post
students are not overworked
I used to be done with school/homework by 5 and my parents worked till 8
Yeah but it's easier to work than it is to learn for the same duration of time.

If you want to retain things, gotta take breaks.
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Old 09-30-2010, 11:46 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Canada is consistently ranked in the top-5 in reading, maths and science in the world. Where do you get the idea that this country is falling behind? The quality is there. Want falling behind? Look South. The countries typically ranked ahead of us employ rote-learning curriculums, specifically the Asian countries, where kids go to school six days a week and don't have summer vacation.

Okay, so a Korean kid can pass a math test before any kid in the world can. But have they had the time to go out, interact with people, and develop even a semblance of interpersonal skills? There is a place for kids like that on the job market, and that's behind a cubicle on a computer creating macro programs on excel. Employers today are more worried about finding leaders who can not only deal with and manage people, but inspire them as well. Summer vacation, chilling with your buddies, meeting chicks, going to the bar, getting drunk and meeting randoms - that's how you learn how to deal with people. I had a Korean friend who knew calculus in grade 8. Dude is in third-year university now and has never kissed a girl. An extreme example maybe, but a telling one.

Summer vacation is necessary. Every kid needs to recharge. It's also the time where you develop soft skills that in my opinion are every bit as important as the school you went to or the grade point average you had.
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Old 09-30-2010, 02:03 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Summer, to me, is the time to broaden your horizons ... do some volunteering, pick up a sport, go to camp, make new friends. School, school, school all the time is just mind-draining. I loved school, but I also loved tennis camp in the summer and volunteering at the hospital. It was a different and very enriching experience.
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Old 09-30-2010, 03:37 PM   #27 (permalink)
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I'm currently working on my PhD. I had a 4.0 in undergrad and I always came first in my class from high school through to university.

I am your token nerd when it comes to school.

And I can tell you right now...Taking rest, seeing friends and enjoying life make me more refreshed and energized to work harder when I get back to work. Even when I am taking rest and doing nothing, I get bored and want to get back to work. It's all about balance. Kids need their summers off to explore, enjoy and experience aspects of life you can never get in school.


If that's how you feel, then we should eliminate holidays, weekends, etc and just always work.
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Old 09-30-2010, 04:12 PM   #28 (permalink)
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again with the argument of overworked, students are overworked because of the small amount of time to shove all this education into a 12 year span, see agruement with putting 5 years of high school and putting them in 4. Having the same amount of work and learning in the system but instead giving them more time gives students more breathing room and time to relax.

I never said to remove weekends and religious holidays.

As for summer being a "social" thing and removing it might frighten people that kids are going to be miami heat bandwagon trolls, well then what the hell is school? characteristics of a leader can be polished in schooling activities, i started talking to other kids when i had to do group assignments, however my agruement can also support thought's statement that I became much more closer to them during the summer. Being unsocial cannot always be blamed on school, we had a discussion a while back that technology is making us more and more stuck to the computer screen than interaction with other people.

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Old 09-30-2010, 04:45 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by simplycrazy View Post
Had to log in to reply to this.
as a 16 year old i have to say no.

1st: the heat and humidity of the summer would make it hell to be in an underfunded school (such as mine, it was bad in may, it would be horrible in july/ August) Learning/stdying is extremely difficult in such heat, studying for my exams in june with 40 degree weather was not easy.
Alright so in countries in hot climates they just don't take exams with the same type of weather as well? People always find a way to study because they have the drive to learn no matter the situtation, and I applaud you for learning in such a hard and tough enviroment.

Quote:
2nd: takes out possibility of summer school. Summer school is used for failed courses, or to promote to an even higher course, or to simply get an extra credit out of the way. Students rely on this so they do not need to take a 5th year, so they can get extra credits, or so they can take courses they like, as well as get the required courses for university programs. Teachers do summer school for extra money if neccesary.
Again, with all the overworked students in the system, of course summer school is popular because not everyone can shove all that learning in a small time.

Quote:
3rd: summer programs. Schools offer a whole lot of summer programs that are very good. For example my school offers students the possibility to travel to africa for 3-4 weeks in the summer and do some type of charity work. there are many other programs, that are just as meaningful as these. THey are life changing programs, that you do not get to experience sitting behind a text book.
That could be an option, instead of a classroom setting during the summer. Don't think my idea of a year long education is all about sitting behind a textbook. They're great programs out there that are like introduction to co-op which in turn can help make a studen choose what they want in the future and give them a taste of what it's like. That's why with an extended school year they can explore that option a lot more.

Quote:
4th: summer job. Personally, no way in hell that my parents will be able to pay for university alone.
My father died when I was 5 and my mother had to take care of me, and during those hard times I had to be dropped off at a summer school camp that takes care of kids like me while my mom worked hard to get the education that i needed, during my high school years I was overworked and had to take summer school plus a 5th year to catch up not because I had so much assignments because I had all these assignments in such a short time just because I was a slow learning in school plus I had an autistic brother to support and had a part time job. What I'm trying to say is that when school is extended throughout the year the load is light and comes in at a slower pace unlike now where it all comes hard, fast and all at once.

Quote:
5th: teacher - ciriculum aspect. My high school is relitivly small, about 800 students. during the summer, the new student - schedual creating process - mailing - schedual changing process takes well over a month. If there would be no summer vacation (or a shorter one) then come school time the course scheduals would be so messed up it would be chaos. With only 800 students, and an entire 2 months to plan the scheduals, it was still chaos.

Not only that, but the amount of time it takes usually to plan the teaching curriculum, order new materials, if neccesary, which it usually is in some cases (most of the time the science departments), schools wouldnt even be ready to in such a short period of time. especially in under-funded schools like mine.
I will be honest I cannot answer that, that is a very good point.

Quote:
6th: students. the amount some students hate school. skipping classes has is a normal now, and even of you go to classes, many students dont do anything in them. if you extend the amount of school more students will get fed up, and there will be less effort put through. I know this because usually around march students get tired of school and start to not do there school work.

So essentially, your gonna take a whole summer full of nothing, and convert that to a bunch of nothing in school while the teacher is getting paid.
Again with point #3, summer classes can be an introduction to a workplace or something they are interested in the possibility of finishing school earlier, getting a high school diploma at the age of 17 and going to college right away. I talk to my friends alot about something like that and it seems like a good idea in their opinion, plus the economy now needs that boost of workers right away with all the workers retiring soon from the baby boom era.

Quote:
personally, i will never give up my summer, if the change does happen in my schooling life time. Ive discussed this with my parents, and we have agreed that if this does take place, while im in school (we have heard discussion about this in many different places) then i will move to Europe and live with my Aunt, and go to school there.

summer vacation should stay, the only people i ever notice, who do "Nothing" during summer, are people who are too dumb to find fun/ something useful to do by themselves.

i think its a horrible idea to take summer vacation away, or even to shorten it by a large margin.

i hope i dont have to write any more of these giant posts. :/
Calling people dumb because they have nothing to do during the summer is not really fair, what about people who have to take care of siblings who are too young while their parents are at work? Kids in a dangerous neighbourhood that have protective parents that want them to stay inside.

Last edited by Someguy again; 09-30-2010 at 05:09 PM.
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Old 09-30-2010, 05:03 PM   #30 (permalink)
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The Case Against Summer Vacation - TIME

good read, and the comments below are also great pieces for both sides
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Old 09-30-2010, 06:14 PM   #31 (permalink)
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1) ill give you that point.

2) ill cover that point later

3) CO-OP

This is already taking place for a good amount of time, i believe students do CO-OP for maybe 4-5 months in the school year, which is plenty of time to understand there possible work environment, whether they hate it or love it. You then continued this argument after my 6th argument, talknig about job "workshops", where students go to school to learn a certain job/ trade. this seems like extra work, which is something that you are implying that shouldnt happen, or it makes it seem like these summer skill/job workshops will be seperate from the school curriculum taking place only in the summer months. either way, both are implying more work, either during the extended time, or just added in during the summer months.

also, im sure you have heard of an apprenticeship, where students coming out of high school can be taught a trade by while being in the workforce. This is becoming increasingly popular and is a great way to start replacing the baby boomers.

5) ill incorporate a few answers in one, including your statement against my 2nd argument.

Now, your childhood seems like it was quite tough growing up, and if you managed to make a success out of yourself after all that, then i applaud your efforts.


however, i think that towards this whole case, your main argument is that it is too difficult for students as there is so much coming at them at once. You stated that you had a "small intellectual disability", now i dont know your meaning of small, or exactly what disability you would have, however based on what i have seen before, im going to assume you had a learning disability, where it takes longer for you to grasp new concepts, which could be the reason you are supporting this. Perhaps school was a bit more difficult for you compared to other students because of that.

My thoughts on your "overworking" idea:

first of all, i have to say my first point may not be the best, as it is from my personal experience. I have completed 2 years of high school without a single final mark under 70%, i have taken taken both academic (also known as university prep courses) and advance-placement courses. For me personally, even though school can get a bit difficult and stressful sometimes, i dont usually have big troubles with it. now, i dont like to say it, but i may be a bit "smarter" than the average student, which would make my school time easier, however, from what i have noticed, it seems like, in the general population of my school, those who are able and willing, pass there courses. Those who dont put the effort in, do not pass.

Because my point of view could be flawed since it is only from my experience, ill give you my fathers point of view.

He grew up in Europe, and every other week tells me how much more difficult his schooling was. He would tell me how he would would have to do 4-5 hours of homework a night (many of my European friends have said the same). so, it seems like my education is far simpler than that of other places and i should be doing more.


and finally, i apologize for calling people who cant find something to do with there summer vacation dumb. However i also had to babysit, and live in a semi-bad neighborhood (parents trust me to go out though) i still managed to have fun everyday in the summer.


im sorry if i missed anything, i wrote to much again, and i think im losing track of what i wanna say, so ill end it here.

and sorry for not using quotes, im still new to responding on this site and wanted to get my point across rather than get my point across and have it look pretty.
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Old 09-30-2010, 06:38 PM   #32 (permalink)
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welcome to rf dude

I will think about what you said before I post again.

this is a good discussion I like it.
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Old 09-30-2010, 07:11 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Well it would be good for anyone wanting to get INTO the teaching profession lol.... because 60% of the current teachers out there would retire or quit.... and all that's assuming that their unions would allow something like that to pass.
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Old 09-30-2010, 07:19 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Well it would be good for anyone wanting to get INTO the teaching profession lol.... because 60% of the current teachers out there would retire or quit.... and all that's assuming that their unions would allow something like that to pass.
I forgot to mention those wonderful unions
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Old 09-30-2010, 09:51 PM   #35 (permalink)
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At the high school I go to, I wake up at 5:30 to go and get home at 2:30. I work reasonably hard, and get a GPA over 4. If I need summer for anything, it is some R & R.
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:39 PM   #36 (permalink)
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At the high school I go to, I wake up at 5:30 to go and get home at 2:30. I work reasonably hard, and get a GPA over 4. If I need summer for anything, it is some R & R.
Yup, sounds like my high school experience ... plus all of the extra activities that I'm sure you did after school also. So tired by the end of the year.
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:53 PM   #37 (permalink)
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5:30? does that time even exist?
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Old 10-01-2010, 12:01 AM   #38 (permalink)
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5:30? does that time even exist?
It does when it's time to watch Aussie Open tennis action ...
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Old 10-01-2010, 01:05 AM   #39 (permalink)
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It does when it's time to watch Aussie Open tennis action ...
pretty soon 5:30 will be all too real for you taz. and 4:30. and 3:30. and 2:30...
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Old 10-01-2010, 06:33 AM   #40 (permalink)
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pretty soon 5:30 will be all too real for you taz. and 4:30. and 3:30. and 2:30...
She has started with the kicking and waking me up at un-Godly hours already ... day off, gosh darn it!
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