Should there be tolls in toronto? - Page 3

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View Poll Results: Should there be tolls when leaving and entering Toronto?
Yes 4 36.36%
No 7 63.64%
Voters: 11. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-15-2010, 12:51 PM   #41 (permalink)
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do you guys have a congestion charge like they do in London?
I'm assuming you been to london and seen their insane Transit system and you've been to TOronto and seen ours?

London has somewhat of a choice not to have a car in Toronto you have virtually no choice unless you prefectly place your dwelling with the transit and your work place.
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:54 PM   #42 (permalink)
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I'm assuming you been to london and seen their insane Transit system and you've been to TOronto and seen ours?

London has somewhat of a choice not to have a car in Toronto you have virtually no choice unless you prefectly place your dwelling with the transit and your work place.
In London you can get a bus or subway on every street so its not a problem and I haven't been to Toronto for years now so I don't know that state of their system

It's true that in London a car isn't needed, the one city where I never rent a car
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:57 PM   #43 (permalink)
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In London you can get a bus or subway on every street so its not a problem and I haven't been to Toronto for years now so I don't know that state of their system

It's true that in London a car isn't needed, the one city where I never rent a car
We problably need another thread on how the TTC is about 50 years behind its time but really it is. I"d love to take transit more. Less stress, I could listen to music and read the paper or a book but it just is way too slow and ineffiecient to have that dream.
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Old 01-15-2010, 01:00 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Utopian pipe dream, people will NEVER stop driving....its a harder war to win than the "war on terror".

Fact-905r's make up the majority of people working in the city.

Fact-Go trains are over crowded as is....I suggest you try to get on one in rush hour.

Fact- Can't get there by subway because our system sucks



Oh and I forgot to add "Tear down the gardiner" to my list of completely insane ideas of the war on cars.

f2.5 million people live in toronto. another 2.5 milllion in the GTA. unless every single 905'er works in toronto and a significant portion of people in toronto either don't work or work outside the city, it can't possibly be said that 905'ers are the majority of the toronto workforce.

no question our public transportation needs to get better. the rates are high, and the service area is small.

but transportation to the core is actually very good, and it is quite easy to drive to the edge of the city, park in one of the lots, and take the subway downtown from there. many of my coworkers do this every day. it's the periphery of the city that is underserviced by the ttc, not the core.

and how is it that we are to get better public transportation if the same people that oppose tolls also oppose any tax increases? The ttc is woefully underfunded. this is not to say that it couldn't be run more efficiently.

yes, our system needs to be better, with more service and better efficiency.
yes, money needs to be better spent at city hall.

but neither of these are good reasons to ignore that pressure that all of the 905 traffic puts on the city. they are great arguments for reform at city hall and increased efforts to expand public transportation, but you have to do a lot better to convince me that waste and inefficiency is a good reason to just forget about it and squeeze as many cars into the city as possible.
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Old 01-15-2010, 02:34 PM   #45 (permalink)
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f2.5 million people live in toronto. another 2.5 milllion in the GTA. unless every single 905'er works in toronto and a significant portion of people in toronto either don't work or work outside the city, it can't possibly be said that 905'ers are the majority of the toronto workforce.

no question our public transportation needs to get better. the rates are high, and the service area is small.

but transportation to the core is actually very good, and it is quite easy to drive to the edge of the city, park in one of the lots, and take the subway downtown from there. many of my coworkers do this every day. it's the periphery of the city that is underserviced by the ttc, not the core.

and how is it that we are to get better public transportation if the same people that oppose tolls also oppose any tax increases? The ttc is woefully underfunded. this is not to say that it couldn't be run more efficiently.

yes, our system needs to be better, with more service and better efficiency.
yes, money needs to be better spent at city hall.

but neither of these are good reasons to ignore that pressure that all of the 905 traffic puts on the city. they are great arguments for reform at city hall and increased efforts to expand public transportation, but you have to do a lot better to convince me that waste and inefficiency is a good reason to just forget about it and squeeze as many cars into the city as possible.
GTA does not account for Pickering, Ajax, Whitby, Oshawa, Aurora, Newmarket, Burlington, Oakville, etc...etc..need I go on?

The ttc is not underfunded, it is mismanaged primarily the fault of the union. we have been down this road.

I would hardly call our subway and streetcar system effective when navigating the core...we have 2 subway lines...2 ..
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Old 01-15-2010, 02:38 PM   #46 (permalink)
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GTA does not account for Pickering, Ajax, Whitby, Oshawa, Aurora, Newmarket, Burlington, Oakville, etc...etc..need I go on?
yes it does

File:Greater toronto area map.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 01-15-2010, 02:40 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Right so it that case the GTA is made up of about 7 million people.
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Old 01-15-2010, 02:41 PM   #48 (permalink)
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was hoping you would miss that
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Old 01-15-2010, 04:32 PM   #49 (permalink)
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In my own utopia, I do not drive every day, and I love it. When I do need to drive - that's where the dystopia begins.

Remember the SF earthquake and how one of their main expressways, designed much like the Gardiner, pancaked from one end to the other? Did they rebuild it just the way it was? Was it a pipedream to think they could cope without it? No. It worked out very well without it, and made the city more attractive to boot. It meant coming up with new ways of doing things than the old sit in your car and crawl along in traffic routine, because they finally reached a tipping point where the car was just not so sexy.
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Old 01-15-2010, 04:40 PM   #50 (permalink)
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In my own utopia, I do not drive every day, and I love it. When I do need to drive - that's where the dystopia begins.

Remember the SF earthquake and how one of their main expressways, designed much like the Gardiner, pancaked from one end to the other? Did they rebuild it just the way it was? Was it a pipedream to think they could cope without it? No. It worked out very well without it, and made the city more attractive to boot. It meant coming up with new ways of doing things than the old sit in your car and crawl along in traffic routine, because they finally reached a tipping point where the car was just not so sexy.
Great so when a plan is in place, the new artery is built....feel free to tear down the Gardiner. I don't have any factual knowledge of this, but I am assuming SF has more than 2 ways to get into downtown via a major highway.
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Old 01-15-2010, 04:57 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Great so when a plan is in place, the new artery is built....feel free to tear down the Gardiner. I don't have any factual knowledge of this, but I am assuming SF has more than 2 ways to get into downtown via a major highway.
From what I remember, they felt completely fucked precisely because there was no other way into the core. And it was the length of time it took to just clean up the lower tier that allowed behaviors to change, and people found they liked the changes by the time it was all cleaned up.
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:26 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Great so when a plan is in place, the new artery is built....feel free to tear down the Gardiner. I don't have any factual knowledge of this, but I am assuming SF has more than 2 ways to get into downtown via a major highway.

Allen expressway was suppose to go straight into china town but the city stopped that for one really selfish reason.
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Old 01-15-2010, 05:47 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Allen expressway was suppose to go straight into china town but the city stopped that for one really selfish reason.
I hate the Allen expressway, then again i detest the DVP probably even more.
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:19 PM   #54 (permalink)
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What was the one really selfish reason?
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Old 01-15-2010, 06:22 PM   #55 (permalink)
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after tearing apart the lawrence community to make the street work the eglinton community just stopped construction dead in its tracks. I guess its the NIMBY theory although it has hurt traffic flow to this day
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Old 01-15-2010, 10:10 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Yeah that's pretty selfish. Why on earth couldn't they just lay down and let their government destroy their neighborhoods, like the Chinese do for instance?

Nailed you again DVS? We should be keeping score.
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Old 01-16-2010, 06:42 AM   #57 (permalink)
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I think the government should give Toronto a break, the people are already uptight and rude enough, need some positive energy for a change. Doesn't need to become more of a cancer than it is.
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Old 01-16-2010, 01:26 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Yeah that's pretty selfish. Why on earth couldn't they just lay down and let their government destroy their neighborhoods, like the Chinese do for instance?

Nailed you again DVS? We should be keeping score.
So your saying it was ok to destroy one neighbourhood who really agreed to do it for the good fo the city. However; when the other neighbourhood comes around it should be stopped?

That sounds like giving rules for different people.
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Old 01-16-2010, 05:10 PM   #59 (permalink)
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It's a myth that building more highways would improve traffic. If it worked like that, Los Angeles wouldn't have the worst traffic on the continent.
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Old 01-16-2010, 05:14 PM   #60 (permalink)
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The ttc is not underfunded, it is mismanaged primarily the fault of the union. we have been down this road.
Care to name a single transit agency that carries more people for less funding? Compared to other cities, the TTC is amazingly efficient.
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