Routine infant male circumcision - Page 5

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View Poll Results: Should routine infant male circumcision be legal?
Yes 11 44.00%
No 14 56.00%
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Old 02-06-2010, 04:54 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Yes but not having foreskin isnt gonna affect someone's daily life. Not having a finger is obviously different. A kid without a finger will see every other human being for the rest of his life with 5 fingers on each hand. He won't see a buncha dudes dicks, well I hope not at least.
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Old 02-06-2010, 04:55 PM   #82 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ligeia View Post
Well here are the reasons you said removing the foreskin was right:

1. It's the parent's decision,
2. The kid won't miss something they never had anyways.

Doesn't a finger fit those reasons just as well as a foreskin?
I didnt say it was right or wrong, everyone has their own opinion. I just said it should be legal.
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Old 02-06-2010, 04:55 PM   #83 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonezz View Post
Yes but not having foreskin isnt gonna affect someone's daily life. Not having a finger is obviously different. A kid without a finger will see every other human being for the rest of his life with 5 fingers on each hand. He won't see a buncha dudes dicks, well I hope not at least.
What if lots of people had a finger removed? Would that make it better?
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Old 02-06-2010, 04:57 PM   #84 (permalink)
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What if lots of people had a finger removed? Would that make it better?
Lol seriously stop comparing a finger to foreskin.
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Old 02-06-2010, 04:58 PM   #85 (permalink)
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Lol seriously stop comparing a finger to foreskin.
But it is remarkably similar. Removing your pinky finger doesn't eliminate the functionality of your hand; it just reduces it. The same is true of a foreskin: it reduces the functionality of your penis. And apparently parent's can do whatever they want with their children, so I don't see how you can object based on the reasons you gave.
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Old 02-06-2010, 05:09 PM   #86 (permalink)
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I never said parents can do WHATEVER they want to children. N no I don't see the similarity. Foreskin is skin, a pinky is a damn finger with bones etc. in it. Yeah you reduce sexual pleasure by being cut. But the reduction in functionality in your hand by losing a pinky is much greater imo. Btw I'm going to eat my chow mein right now so i cant post in this thread for awhile 'cause I dont like talking about dicks when I eat lol.
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Old 02-06-2010, 05:23 PM   #87 (permalink)
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OK Ok... what if it was just the top part of the pinkie? The tip of the finger.
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Old 02-06-2010, 05:34 PM   #88 (permalink)
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Why can't some people just accept the things that god has given them?
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Old 02-06-2010, 05:35 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stonezz View Post
I never said parents can do WHATEVER they want to children. N no I don't see the similarity. Foreskin is skin, a pinky is a damn finger with bones etc. in it. Yeah you reduce sexual pleasure by being cut. But the reduction in functionality in your hand by losing a pinky is much greater imo. Btw I'm going to eat my chow mein right now so i cant post in this thread for awhile 'cause I dont like talking about dicks when I eat lol.
Well here is my case for the pinky being similar.

First of all, it is similar in respect to the arguments you have given in support of circumcision. I think what we've drawn out at this stage is that those aren't actually the complete reasons for why you support it.

Second, I would argue that the relative difference in functionality between a penis with and without foreskin, and a hand with and without a pinky, is very similar.

My overall point is that a parent doesn't have the right to bring harm to their child just because it is their child if the harm is unnecessary.

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Originally Posted by Stonezz View Post
I didnt say it was right or wrong, everyone has their own opinion. I just said it should be legal.
This could take us way off course, but now we're raising the question of in what circumstances an act should be made illegal. Sure, everyone has their own opinion, but we can evaluate how valid those opinions are by assessing the reasoning supporting them.

Last edited by Ligeia; 02-06-2010 at 05:38 PM.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:00 PM   #90 (permalink)
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I just think yall are wild comparing cutting a piece of skin to a finger.
N what you talkin' bout bro everyones opinion is valid you don't gotta support it with proof if that's how you feel.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:07 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Yeah, I find the finger - foreskin comparison to be a bit off.

And the fact that you think that people who are circumcised have "reduced functionality" is just ridiculous.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:10 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Quote:
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I just think yall are wild comparing cutting a piece of skin to a finger.
I think it only seems weird to you because you're used to hearing people cut their foreskin. I think if it had never happened before and I came up to you tomorrow offering to cut off your son's foreskin, you would think I was insane.

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N what you talkin' bout bro everyones opinion is valid you don't gotta support it with proof if that's how you feel.
Everyone's opinion is not valid just because it's their opinion. The classic example: is a Nazi's opinion on Jews valid, or should they have to provide evidence (not proof; that doesn't really exist outside of mathematics) or reasonable argument to support their opinion?
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:11 PM   #93 (permalink)
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Yeah, I find the finger - foreskin comparison to be a bit off.

And the fact that you think that people who are circumcised have "reduced functionality" is just ridiculous.
Please explain why it is off. Remember that the primary purpose of that argument was to suggest that the two reasons he had provided in support of circumcision worked just as well for a pinky finger, and yet he considers removing a pinky finger to be ridiculous.

What would you call removing hundreds of nerve endings that compliment the function of the penis? Reduced functionality seems like a perfectly accurate description to me.

Last edited by Ligeia; 02-06-2010 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:21 PM   #94 (permalink)
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Lol.... apparently you haven't talked to many women then?

There are some who care... but there are more that don't.... and at the end of the day as long as you know how to use it she ain't complaining.
That last statement is obvious, but like i said most woman find it looks odd, at least when they first see one. Doesn't mean they won't sleep with you or be creeped out. My girlfriend recently saw a uncircumcised penis for the first time, she's an artist and draws nude models in class. Anyway, she was taken aback at how it looked she said it looked like it had been choped in half and the skin was just hanging there where the head should be. lol
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:30 PM   #95 (permalink)
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:40 PM   #96 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Ligeia View Post
Please explain why it is off. Remember that the primary purpose of that argument was to suggest that the two reasons he had provided in support of circumcision worked just as well for a pinky finger, and yet he considers removing a pinky finger to be ridiculous.

What would you call removing hundreds of nerve endings that compliment the function of the penis? Reduced functionality seems like a perfectly accurate description to me.
You don't need foreskin for the every day functions of life.

Losing a pinky would require you to adjust all kinds of aspects of your life. You might not be able to do some of the things you could before.

I'm not sure what your sources are, but from what I've read there has been a ton of clinical studies done on penile sensitivity and most of them show very little difference between uncircumcised and circumcised.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:54 PM   #97 (permalink)
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I actually found one big problem with the pinkie comparison.

Musicians need it for their craft. You can't play the piano the same with a missing pinkie. Same goes for the guitar on your fretting hand.

There are probably other jobs too. Like what about a stenographer?


A better comparison would be to use the pinkie toe. That thing is useless.
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Old 02-06-2010, 07:14 PM   #98 (permalink)
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I actually found one big problem with the pinkie comparison.

Musicians need it for their craft. You can't play the piano the same with a missing pinkie. Same goes for the guitar on your fretting hand.

There are probably other jobs too.
Gee ya think.
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Old 02-06-2010, 07:34 PM   #99 (permalink)
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Gee ya think.
pray tell Einstein, what millions of other jobs are physically impossible to do with a missing pinkie finger?
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Old 02-06-2010, 07:47 PM   #100 (permalink)
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I'm not sure what your sources are, but from what I've read there has been a ton of clinical studies done on penile sensitivity and most of them show very little difference between uncircumcised and circumcised.
1 - You obviously did not read through the whole thread before posting. When I had an earlier exchange with 'trane, I quoted the conclusions of a study, and posted a link to where you can find the article in a pdf format, just in case people have difficult accessing the article via the medical journal's website.

2 - I'm showing you one of the most respected studies, quoted repeatedly by doctors. Show me the studies you are referring to. I'm genuinely interested. Are they from respectable academic journals? Or are we talking about bullshit that was funded by a political/religious group and then published in a non-peer reviewed article format. That has happened with Rabbi's trying to justify circumcision as an AIDS preventative.

Furthermore, in the article I am linking you to, the authors discuss the methodology of "previous studies" and explain why they are flawed. So, that leads me to ask if your clinical studies were published after 2007. Were they? If not, then the Sorrels study already took it into account when publishing these findings.

If you can find the time to track them down, I respectfully request that you show us your studies. Not trying to be a dick, but people are talking a lot of shit in this thread and not backing it up.

3 - In another post, I'm going to get to the functionality aspect, since several people think the loss of a foreskin doesn't matter in terms of functionality. It might not be that simple.

Here is part of the findings of a study published in the British Journal of Urology International:

Quote:
In conclusion, circumcision removes the most sensitive parts of the penis and decreases the fine-touch pressure sensitivity of glans penis. The most sensitive regions in the uncircumcised penis are those parts ablated by circumcision. When compared to the most sensitive area of the circumcised penis, several locations on the uncircumcised penis (the rim of the preputial orifice, dorsal and ventral, the frenulum near the ridged band, and the frenulum at the muco-cutaneous junction) that are missing from the circumcised penis were significantly more sensitive.
LINK

Last edited by Bill Haverchuck; 02-06-2010 at 08:42 PM.
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