Homeless in Toronto
Old 04-19-2010, 05:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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came back to TO, seeing way too many on the streets

thoughts?
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:38 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Cool your back in TO. Still the same?

Anyways, there have alwasy been alot. Especially in the downtown area.
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:50 PM   #3 (permalink)
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^ Good book.
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Old 04-19-2010, 05:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurk View Post
Cool your back in TO. Still the same?

Anyways, there have alwasy been alot. Especially in the downtown area.
yeah, Im back
visited 4 years ago and there wasn't a lot then
you think they'd fix it since they're near important places
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:01 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Yeah, you notice em more when the weather is nicer.

It's sad.
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Old 04-19-2010, 06:03 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
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you think they'd fix it since they're near important places
wow...
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Old 04-19-2010, 09:34 PM   #7 (permalink)
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wow...
He used to have a Glenn Beck avatar. Just saying...lol
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Old 04-20-2010, 01:26 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Unfortunately, I don't really see a solution to it that is possible.

You can't fine them or throw them in jail because they have no traceable money and jail is a better alternative many times to being where they are. So we know we can't discourage this kind of things successfully.

So then you look at options that are costly to the city. You have places they can go to eat and sleep. Unfortunately, many homeless prefer to live on the street than there. Why? I've heard a million reasons, but regardless, they have it better being on the street.

The only way to get the ones that are not mentally ill off the streets is to stop people from giving them money. At some point in time they WILL turn to city run services, which might I add, you're already paying for. Why are we paying for services that aren't being used?

Decrease in the value of being homeless. People can't keep giving money away. It is LUNACY how much some of these people make. They also pay no tax on the money which basically is income to some of these people. Some people PRETEND to be homeless because there is THAT much money is in it. No wonder they don't want to use the shelters. You could have your own place just by panhandling.

Sure, most aren't faking it but the fact of the matter is there is a greater economic benefit to being homeless than using a shelter.

Then you have to deal with the mentally ill. Unfortunately, that is just a funding issue. Need to get them into the CAMH. Which is already a fucking shitshow. Need a little more funding there.
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Old 04-20-2010, 06:44 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Part of the reason for the growth too is that a lot of the homeless come from other parts of the province because panhandling is more profitable or perceived to be more profitable in Toronto.
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Old 04-21-2010, 01:28 AM   #10 (permalink)
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You can never actually eliminate poverty, but you can definitely make a contribution.
VOLUNTEEER!
not to advertise it - but i do, and it makes me feel pretty damn good about myself.
Big Brothers Big Sisters of Canada - National Web Site
Youth Assisting Youth
City of Toronto: Shelter, Support and Housing Administration

A lot of people talk about their concern for the homeless ppl in Toronto, but most don't do shit about it.

Yay and Big Bro/Sis
- match up with someone much younger then you who is going through some serious struggles
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Old 04-23-2010, 10:53 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuzzy View Post
You can never actually eliminate poverty, but you can definitely make a contribution.
VOLUNTEEER!
not to advertise it - but i do, and it makes me feel pretty damn good about myself.
Big Brothers Big Sisters of Canada - National Web Site
Youth Assisting Youth
City of Toronto: Shelter, Support and Housing Administration

A lot of people talk about their concern for the homeless ppl in Toronto, but most don't do shit about it.

Yay and Big Bro/Sis
- match up with someone much younger then you who is going through some serious struggles
I commend your efforts especially with big brothers because I think that is the time you have a chance to really make an impact.

Unlike many others, I do not care about homeless people, not one bit.

I DO feel bad for the mentally ill, that just happens to include some homeless.

While I do believe there are sometimes unfortunate circumstances that end up with people being homeless, I also question how it really happens if you are sane.

I often wonder how someone who is sane ends up, and stays homeless. Every reason I can think of comes down to someone lacking personal responsibility. I think most people that end up homeless deserve it.
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Old 04-23-2010, 11:05 AM   #12 (permalink)
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....must not post....

...must stay out of political debates.....
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Old 04-23-2010, 11:47 AM   #13 (permalink)
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i want to point out that the percentage of homeless people in toronto that are mentally ill or that have disabilities is very large, and the people who are sane and homeless are very often there because of something - like abuse, like poverty, like lack of education, like prejudice - that is completely beyond their control and is very often temporary or transitional.



10-20% of toronto's homeless population are dual diagnosis of severe mental health problems and substance abuse. that's just the dual diagnosis and severe mental health issues... http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:1772152

up to 40% of homeless poeple in toronto have some form of mental illness.

add to that people with disabilities, and people with dual diagnoses of disability and mental health disorders, and you are looking at a majority of homeless people in toronto that are there because they are part of an extremely vulnerable population.

there is also the group of people with moderate intellectual disabilities - people that may not seem any different than you and i, but who lack some of the education necessary to manage independent lives, often because they were institutionalized for the majority of their lives until recently. the deinstitutionalization of ontario's developmental services facilities has led to a lot of success stories, but has also led to a great number of people entering the ranks of the homeless because they were not given any support or education early in their lives.

Quote:
The 1960s and 1970s also saw an international movement towards deinstitutionalization..., moving them out of asylums and other facilities, and releasing them into the community. Studies found that the vast majority of those who had been placed in asylums could be healthy and productive members of society if placed in the community and provided with the proper care and medication.

Thus over these decades the number of people confined to mental institutions fell dramatically from just under 70,000 to about 20,000. However, while great savings were made by shutting down empty institutions much of this money was absorbed by general government funds, and did not make it into community care.

No assurances were made that those discharged had access and were taking the medication they needed. While some of those discharged did integrate with the community, a significant number estimated at around 75% did not. Many of these individuals became homeless. Today up to 40% of homeless have some sort of mental illness.[17]
17. Murphy, Barbara. On the Street: How We Created the Homeless. J. Gordon Shillingford, c2000.

another huge subset of homeless people in toronto is the group that is fleeing abusive situations and has nowhere to go because they lived in poverty to begin with. they seek women's shelters, respite beds and the like, which are all overcrowded. all of these folks are considered homeless as well.


i think you would find that the percentage of homeless people in toronto that are in that situation due to choice or to factors within their control is extremely low.

Quote:
Homelessness is actually a chronic problem for only a small minority of people, the vast majority of individuals are "one-time only" shelter users or experience episodic homelessness. However, the distinctly different subgroup of individuals who are "chronically homeless" consume about half of shelter beds and available resources at any given time.[2]

Many of "the homeless" who make use of homeless shelters are also employed.[7] Individuals and families are simply priced out of private housing markets. In 2000, about 22% or 2.5 million Canadian households fell below the minimum amount required to afford a basic home, gauged at $25, 920. Five years later, this number rose to 26% or 3.2 million households.[8]
-that is quoted form wikipedia, but these are the sources:

2 Laird, Gordon (2007). "Shelter-Homelessness in a growth economy: Canada's 21st century paradox." A Report for the Sheldon Chumir Foundation for Ethics in Leadership. [1]

7. Housing Works: A Special Report 2007. Giving voice to the crisis [www.endhomelessnessottawa.ca]

8. Shapcott, M. (2008). New income numbers confirm growing income inequality; One-in-four Canadian households below fair housing income; New figures underline urgent need for national housing strategy. Wellesley Institute Backgrounder: Growing Income Inequality
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Old 04-23-2010, 03:20 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Am I crazy or have things not been substantially improved? Maybe I just don't go downtown enough anymore. I don't know. I can remember not needing to go downtown to see homeless people though.
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Old 04-23-2010, 03:42 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Am I crazy or have things not been substantially improved? Maybe I just don't go downtown enough anymore. I don't know. I can remember not needing to go downtown to see homeless people though.
You're crazy.
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Old 04-23-2010, 03:59 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Squeegy kids used to be the worst. Especially the cunts that would just start cleaning your window after you would decline them.
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Old 04-23-2010, 05:12 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Squeegy kids used to be the worst. Especially the cunts that would just start cleaning your window after you would decline them.
Like the ones that would clean it with spit?

Yeah.

In my old neighbourhood, I knew some of the homeless people who would be panhandling at Church & Wellesley. One guy was always really nice, full of compliments or jokes, even if you didn't have any change to spare. I think he liked me and SJ cuz we weren't douchebags.
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Old 04-23-2010, 07:26 PM   #18 (permalink)
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What ever happened to that lady who pretend to be homeless and panhandled from morning to evening and at the end of the day her son would pick her up in a fancy sports car?
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Old 04-23-2010, 11:12 PM   #19 (permalink)
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What absolutely kills me is any kind of outrage over the questionable means or necessity of panhandlers, while guys that skullfuck all of us with their market-oriented bamboozling get huge bonuses for their brilliance at stealing the ground from beneath all of our feet.

And don't tell me there isn't any connection. There is a direct connection. As a society we have misplaced values and misplaced anger to go along with displaced people.
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Old 04-23-2010, 11:15 PM   #20 (permalink)
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+1 lx.
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