H1N1 Vaccine - Page 4
Old 10-30-2009, 09:19 PM   #61 (permalink)
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The problem has been with too much fear in previous years, with no real reason to raise the alarms. That makes it tough to take things seriously when there are reasons.
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Old 10-30-2009, 09:22 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Old 10-30-2009, 11:48 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Some of you make me laugh... Guys giving factual information about the vaccines are now Fear Mongering? You have it completely backwards...

I was sitting at the golden griddle, and on the wall is the selection of newspapers.. national post, sun and the star. On the front page of ever single one reads: 13 YEAR OLD HOCKEY BOY DEATH BY SWINE FLU - father grieves and pleads for you to get your kids vaccinated". I mean really? Front page of every newspaper? Out all the cases of swine flu.. They pick this one..a generic ontario hockey family, that hundreds and thousands of familys across the country can relate too.. And obviously it worked, seen by someones post here.

Do you think it was really necessary for Obama to make this a national emergency??? Way more people have died from crossing the road too soon this summer... Why don't they address that and make it a national emergency? The government controls the media and the media controls you, period.

Most of the repercussion of the vaccine have already been posted.. but all go ignored because the simple minded cannot fathom why people would do this to them and their children.. they just pass it off as conspiracy by crackpots.

So why do they want to do such a thing? Well one: Profit.. its called Machiavellianism. That is something you already see in the drug industry and vaccines. Take ADHD for example..
ADHD has been proven to be a very popular neuro disorder caused by flu Vaccines in children.. it is the Mercury just like it is with Autism. the Pharmaceutical company "Eli Lily" Made 660 Million dollars in one year from one of their drugs that treated ADHD... well guess what.. Eli Lily also provided
Flu shots with mercury in it CAUSING the ADHD... so they are making money causing the problem and making money fixing the problem. That is just one example.. think of all the other diseases longterm that the drug industry will benefit from the vaccines if the effects you have heard here are true.. Just try to imagine how much money Tamiflu has made off of this. The swine flu vaccine will cost $24.99 per shot.. 600 Million vaccines were ordered originally with more on the way..

You think our health care is getting better over the years? Well why are there so many more hospitals being built.. Shouldnt they be getting torn down? Nope.. its a growing INDUSTRY.
W.H.O, CDC, GAVI wants you in the drug store just as much as Ford wants you at their car dealership. This is something that has been going on for a LONG time, not just from the swine flu "pandemic". You think this is much of a surpise that it would happen in the middle of a recession?? and the U.S economy is already up 4%.. just saying..

I'd give the other big reason this is probably going on and why you shouldnt get the vaccine but you would likely think its even more crackpot and completely disregard all the risks you are taking.

I wont be getting it... you should all do a little research before you do too, could end up saving your life.

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Old 10-31-2009, 12:44 AM   #64 (permalink)
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Do you think it was really necessary for Obama to make this a national emergency??? Way more people have died from crossing the road too soon this summer... Why don't they address that and make it a national emergency? The government controls the media and the media controls you, period.
Funny thing is that Obama hasn't gotten his little girls, his wife or himself vaccinated. His reason? He can't get the stuff, there's none available. Imagine, the leader of the biggest super power in the world can't get his hands on the vaccine? Right... Just like he can't get his hands on his American birth certificate either.

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I wont be getting it... you should all do a little research before you do too
I'm not one to believe in conspiracies but damn, microbiologists are highly specialized and as such its pretty bizarre that the deaths of 40 of them, who had been working on vaccines and bio weapons, in the last four years have dropped dead... Some murdered, some dieing under mysterious causes... Just saying. Its unusual.

Last edited by Apollo; 10-31-2009 at 01:14 AM.
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Old 10-31-2009, 01:57 AM   #65 (permalink)
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I agree. I'm sure a bunch of highly qualified researchers in the MEDICAL FIELD who do this for a living know what they are doing.

You guys are all paranoid and know nothing in comparison to them about medicine... nothing. We are a bunch of raptor's basketball fans.

Go to pubmd.com and read some articles on the flu and what it is. Don't waste your time on wikipedia and emails sent by radical theorists who don't study this stuff.


Exactly. There is a lot of stupidity in this thread.
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Old 10-31-2009, 10:07 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Speaking of doing a little research, someone needs to do some research on the link between thimerosal and autism, or thimerosal and adhd (in fact, the anti-vax crowd has given up the claim that thimerosal causes autism and instead typically argue the "too many vaccines, too soon" hypothesis). No causal link established, just a couple shoddy studies showing a correlation in a small sample; please try again. As I've posted probably ten times now, I encourage anyone interested in this issue to follow sciencebasedmedicine.org, where they review the literature and studies in detail for vaccines and a whole host of other information.

As part of their ongoing scam, the evil doers of big pharma have helped extend the average lifetime of humans to nearly 80 years now, and improved the quality of life for almost everyone I know (including myself). Kind of ironic that it is more cost-effective for taxpayers to get a shot than it is to be reactive in treating the flu, meanwhile people are arguing that this is a cash grab.

Here's an interesting article of note with respect to the epidemiology of the H1N1 flu.

Last edited by Ligeia; 10-31-2009 at 11:12 AM.
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Old 10-31-2009, 11:28 AM   #67 (permalink)
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The swine flu is a virus. The vaccine is a dead swine flu virus placed in your body (the formaldehyde and stuff for anyone who knows chem is to keep this virus dead). This tricks your immune system into believing you have the real live swine flu virus in your body, and it produces antibodies (which fight off the flu for us) that target the swine flu. Thus, when the real swine flu comes to us, we already have the necessary antibodies to fight off this flu. This strengthens our immune system. This is the REASON why this works.

This is not pscyhology or sociology etc. where everyone in the class has a right answer and it's good to discuss. If you have no idea what the flu is or anything else in medicine, leave it to the experts.

If you say, oh we don't want to leave all the power in the hands of the experts, they can screw us over. Then go make a real difference, go to a university and take some biology and chemistry courses and data analysis courses and you'll understand what these researchers are doing.

You can't just pull up bull shit off the internet that you don't understand, have no idea what mercury etc. does to the body, and have no idea what these doctors are talking about and just spread propaganda for the sake of "making a difference". You're like the people who protest, who have no idea what they are protesting against.
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Old 10-31-2009, 01:56 PM   #68 (permalink)
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Speaking of doing a little research, someone needs to do some research on the link between thimerosal and autism, or thimerosal and adhd (in fact, the anti-vax crowd has given up the claim that thimerosal causes autism and instead typically argue the "too many vaccines, too soon" hypothesis). No causal link established, just a couple shoddy studies showing a correlation in a small sample; please try again. As I've posted probably ten times now, I encourage anyone interested in this issue to follow sciencebasedmedicine.org, where they review the literature and studies in detail for vaccines and a whole host of other information.

As part of their ongoing scam, the evil doers of big pharma have helped extend the average lifetime of humans to nearly 80 years now, and improved the quality of life for almost everyone I know (including myself). Kind of ironic that it is more cost-effective for taxpayers to get a shot than it is to be reactive in treating the flu, meanwhile people are arguing that this is a cash grab.

Here's an interesting article of note with respect to the epidemiology of the H1N1 flu.

here... you can watch mercury's effect on neurons right under a fucking microscope yourself and be the judge.. this is a study done by uni. of calgary.
here is a lecture done by David Ayoud M.D, a radiologist, which was done well before swine flu, but gives plenty of substantial evidence on not just the Mecury induced Autism/ADHD, but goes further to show how thin the studies are by pro thimerasol organizations. He goes on to explain what companies fund what organizations, and in what way the benefit, as well as what other companies they fund.. it is more interesting than it sounds and is worth listening to..

basically every study done which is pro thimerasol is also connected to the profits of vaccines..



And just for the whackjobs that say you get more mercury in fish:
fish 730-1450ppb of mercury
flu vaccines: 50,000ppb mercury

keep in mind that this bypassing normal digestive tract/immune system going directly into your blood stream.. along with the cancer virus, polio virus, 2 strains of flu virus,.
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Old 10-31-2009, 07:01 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Don't really want to argue for or against getting the H1N1 vaccine ... all I will say is that I got my shot at Sick Kids on Thursday. Arm was very sore but that's about it.
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:03 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Old 11-01-2009, 04:57 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Old 11-01-2009, 07:15 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Regarding the recent videos Appollo posted, I'd just like to remind people that you can also find doctors who deny evolution. Is anyone here going to be stupid enough to deny that evolution is a scientific fact? Probably not. But you can find the odd doctor who'll do it. The point is, some doctors are incompetent or will go against the grain for ideological reasons. The thing you need to keep in mind when dealing with these kind of debates is, what do the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of doctors say? There will always be some doctors on both sides of the debate who have a political agenda, and will distort things a bit by preying on old fears and suscpiciouns, even if those fears have been put to rest by new studies and research. Although they are supposed to follow ethical guidelines, a few docotors will always say stupid shit. But what do the majority of doctors in the middle have to say? There are tens of thousands of doctors in a single country alone, yet world wide you only hear a small group of doctors speak out against vaccines. In terms of %, we're talking about a very small number.

Now, as for the first two videos appollo posted, the people being interviewed are total barneys. News stations like Fox News and Russia Today love to make stories out of this stuff for ratings. It goes both ways, Fox can make a panic out of the flu, but also make a panic out of protecting yourself from the flu. Scared Americans = good shoppers and TV watchers.

Sometimes there are real mistakes made by doctors and the government, I'm not suggesting everything they do is great. However, real journalism probes deeper and holds the people they interview more accountalble by asking tough questions, fact checking the responses...etc... Appollo, do you realize that Russia Today is not real journalism? I'm basing that on more than just this story. They consistantly try to paint the American government in the worst light possible, it feeds their viewership and agenda, much like Alex Jones. They slant as many stories as possible to make it look like the government is trying to hurt or kill you. They frequently have people on who make drastic claims without backing up their shit. Nurses? Why the hell are they giving you statistics on nurses? If there was a poll on doctors, don't you think that would be more relevant? Don't you think they'd offer that up, if it confirmed there was a real threat from the vaccine? Instead, when it comes to doctors, all you get is anecdotes, no real polls. They offer anecdotes to make it look like there's a story. Nurses are not researchers in the field, and many of them have limited knowledge of these matters, even though nurses serve a very valuable role and their profession is noble. And when Madsen talks about studies and research, he provides no specific names of the people he has spoken to or the studies proving what he is alledging. As for the anti-vaccine movement, I don't give a shit what a bunch of soccer Mom's, Hockey Dad's, and Jenny McCarthy think about vaccines. Here's an anecdote for Madsen: my doctor got the vaccine.
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Old 11-01-2009, 08:39 PM   #73 (permalink)
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People get vaccines all of the time, and they aren't that big of a deal.

People are making too big of a deal about this because of a couple youtube videos and google.
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Old 11-01-2009, 09:33 PM   #74 (permalink)
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People also get new unexplained diseases all the time.. which symptoms are treated by big pharma...


I don't understand why people believe these types of theories are so far off...

Its proven that the world population is far too great by the amount of those starving, even here in north america we have an overgrowth of homeless, and no industries are having issues finding people for work.. so its easy to understand why the government would want to inhibit population growth as well as boost the economy through big pharma.. The U.S economy is already up 4% this quarter.
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Old 11-01-2009, 11:01 PM   #75 (permalink)
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People also get new unexplained diseases all the time.. which symptoms are treated by big pharma...


I don't understand why people believe these types of theories are so far off...

Its proven that the world population is far too great by the amount of those starving, even here in north america we have an overgrowth of homeless, and no industries are having issues finding people for work.. so its easy to understand why the government would want to inhibit population growth as well as boost the economy through big pharma.. The U.S economy is already up 4% this quarter.
Nobody said big pharma doesn't try hard to make a buck. It's a logical fallacy, though, to conclude that because pharmaceutical companies make money vaccines must be bullshit. There are a number of products produced by pharmaceutical companies that are not that beneficial or pose risks. It all comes down to cost/benefit analysis when you decide to take a product or not. Time and time again, vaccines have been proven to have a high benefit, because the chances of getting ill from the virus the vaccine is combating is greater than the chance of an allergic reaction. Pharmaceutical companies try to make money, but they also save lives. The truth is not always black and white; the world is full of grey. Both things can be true: pharma makes a profit and saves lives.

Yes, the population of the globe is getting out of hand. But people like you cherry pick evidence and ignore things that contradict your world view. For example, if there was really a conspiracy to cut down the population in 3rd world countries, the pharmaceutical companies would stop providing cheaper medication to the third world where things like Polio still exist and AIDS is killing people by the millions. Western governments have been subsidizing medication and providing foreign aid that keeps those people alive. You need to look at both sides of the issue, not just the facts that confirm what you want to believe. Like I said, mistakes happen, and pharmaceutical companies and governments do fuck up sometimes, but not everything is a conspiracy. Humans fuck up sometimes, so why would institutions run by humans be error free? The key is to demand solid, peer reviewed evidence when it comes to matters of science. You should also think critically about your sources of information. The funny thing is, many of the people who are against vaccines are against them in order to make money. It's ironic when people like you complain about big pharma making money of the swine flu, because that's exactly what fake news organizations and pseudo science websites do. They exploit ignorance and fear in order to keep people coming back to them for more information. There's bullshit on both sides of the fence, that's why you need to scrutinize sources and sift your way through the information before yelling conspiracy.
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Old 11-02-2009, 12:30 AM   #76 (permalink)
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Ten characteristics of conspiracy theorists - a look into the mond of conspiraloons, nutjobs and tin foil hatters

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Old 11-03-2009, 11:56 AM   #77 (permalink)
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this whole thing is blowing out of proportion now...
i had to deliver these test certificates to someone at work, and whenever i meet him - in the past - we shakes hands and exchange pleasantries. this time however, i go to shake his hand and he jumps back, gives me a once over (to see if i'm looking sick or have any signs of sickness), then after i pass his "sick-test", he gingerly shakes my hand quickly.
i was a bit offended by this.
people are freaking out and its going a bit overboard now dont you think?
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Old 11-03-2009, 12:03 PM   #78 (permalink)
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Last I checked, my body was a fine tuned and amazing marvel of nature, much like a lot of ours are. I can create an immunity myself. But thats just my choice.

I know there are at risk people out there, and a tiny percentage of people that are healthy that might succumb to a Flu virus, I am willing to take that risk, but I will try not to endanger others.

I think it's a personal choice, and it's healthy to know your options, and your RISKS. Yes, there are Risks with any Vaccine, and risks with avoiding that same vaccine.

Stay healthy.

Get your sleep

Eat well.

And stay clean.

If you're sick, stay home, even if its a bit, fuck it, there is a pandemic, your boss will understand and respect your decision. Play your XBOX.

We cannot be a culture that basis it's existance on fear, nor shall we move forward with any efficieny as a society if we move forward with apathy and a lack of knowledge. So read, and learn, and read more than one point of view.

We all have the ability to control our lives, as well as compassionately care for others. So lets do more of that, and less hating what we do not understand or agree with.

Cheers

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Old 11-03-2009, 12:04 PM   #79 (permalink)
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Old 11-03-2009, 12:06 PM   #80 (permalink)
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heh, yes, and respect Bee's!

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