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Old 05-22-2011, 12:54 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 'trane View Post
you're going to drop loose change on us like it's research? give me a break.
Care to contend w/points the research done within it? Care to elaborate on your defense of the official story/9-11 Commission?

Or if that's too much of a thread derailment or if you deem is too much to ask of you, then we can always keep the thread on track and you can begin again by backing up or contesting the logic behind Obama saying what he did against Israel, as I requested of those who disagree w/my views here, seeing you were content to disrespect my response to yet another arrogant poster here.

Originally Posted by Scully View Post
Obama is trying to play hard ball with a state the has reneged and balked on every attempt to create an equatable situation. I think you could argue for the own benefit, with the vast majority of the surrounding countries (attempting) establishing themselves as democratic there is no government system forcing the peace. Syria and Egypt have for long time reaped rewards for standing along Israel when their populations may in fact lean quite strongly toward supporting Palestine. With out those strong leaders keeping their populations in check borders maybe hard to contain. Like we saw last week with Syrians crossing into Israel, for the first time in decades. Israel is the weakest its been in years, with moral standing for occupation dwindling. Netanyhue is nationalist who allows his pride and vain self interest to stand in the way of the peace process. Obama is just setting the Price high so as negotiations proceed they don't stray to far. Applaud Obama for this strong talk. BY the way Reagen was the first one to propose the return to the 67 boarders, its not not a new concept. Also 6 days war wasen't some grand victory, the surprise attacked those countries, destroying their Air forces while they were on the ground before an official declaration of war was given.
Your post has made me look at the situation from broader angles, but I must maintain a few things.

And those things are that how is Israel supposed to attempt to create an equatable situation when the opposition, Hamas, doesn't recognize Israel's right to exist? I understand what you wrote about Syria & Egypt, but how does what Obama say 'tame' the potential fires in that situation (b/c from my POV, what he said looks like it can inflame the situation)?

And who appointed Obama to be the referee so as negotiations (between Israel & Palestine) don't stray far? I guess it's arguable that b/c USA has historically had a presence in the situation that it was right for Obama as president to do so, but the political climate is completely different from previous presidents, as the Middle Eastern countries are seeing for themselves that they're getting further to democracy w/o America helping them get democracy juss fine (stated more eloquently than I can write in this link here: Obama aims for the right side of history - CNN.com ...not that I agree w/the entire piece as I believe its wise to reserve judgement for now regarding revising the '67 boarders), and Obama doesn't command nearly the respect -both in international politics & Congress, even within the Dems- that previous presidents had (and hence my words that all he is saying and doing is for to collect money for the 2012 election).

I haven't researched Reagan opening talks regarding the '67 boarders, but I'll take your word for it. I'm sure presidents from '67 till 2000 have done what they could to try to ease the tension between Israel-Palestine. And I must disagree w/your assessment of the 6-day war. I don't believe an outright declaration was needed for Israel to react as it's not too often where multiple surrounding countries all line up at the same time to destroy one country (hence the war declaration was implied). Especially since the leaders of those lands for centuries didn't recognize Israel's right to exist and had shown time again how angry they were at Israel becoming a nation again in 1948.

Thank you for saying things politely & seeking to broaden my views on the subject. I still feel justified in claiming the things I have, but I'm glad to have read your post and thus now have more tools to help me think more effectively upon the subject.

Last edited by bladeofBG; 05-22-2011 at 12:57 AM.
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