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Old 09-14-2009, 12:20 PM   #14 (permalink)

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Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 256

Originally Posted by 'trane View Post
cory - so your point is that every choice is just a rational/emotional computation and thus not a choice at all.

that's complete nonsense. here are a couple of reasons why:

1. humans make irrational choices all the time. not only is logic not consistently applied, but sometimes it's disregarded entirely.
I never said logic had to be consistently applied. What I was trying to convey is that what we choose to do is either the result of emotion/feeling, or it's the result of pure logic, or maybe it's a little bit of both. Also, I forgot to mention random action - when we make a choice arbitrarily without reason or emotion.

you can also have multiple logical answers to a question or multiple illogical answers to a question, and people pick and choose from those possibilities all the time.
Well, if your faced with the dilemma of many choices, and none appear any more logical or appealing than the other, then it's just the toss of a coin. It's just random.

simply stating that it is logic that guides us doesn't mean there is only one answer, and it doesn't mean that humans actually apply it in the first place.
I never said they did! Most of the time it's emotion and feelings which guide us. We do what feels good.

2. some choices are beyond logic. how does one rationlaize sophie's choice, for instance? human's rely more on emotion than logic, and emotion can give all kinds of responses.
When it comes to emotions/feelings, it's actually pretty basic - "negative and positive" Meaning, we are either involuntarily attracted or repelled.

further, emotional responses are not predetermined. i may change my mind, i may be unsure of something when i proceed,
This is because of your logic, your reasoning. You are thinking about consequences, hidden implications, etc.

and i may have conflicting emotions that don't necessarily work in a coherent world view.
Conflicting emotions are the result of your logic/reasoning getting in the way of the pleasurable immediacy that you are tempted by.

you can't compute that as there is no balancing factor.
I think you are straw-manning me.

with emotions, we keep things separate in our minds and don't rationalize them. in the end, i may choose to act emotionally or logically or irrationally as might suit my whim.
Bullshit, pal. It's all about securing your own happiness, don't deceive yourself.

people do this all the time. these are all choices
people are trying to find security and happiness.

we compute, but it doesn't always give clear answers,
Again, never said it did. But it does give us a reason to act. But it's true, a lot of time humans don't need reasons to act, like children and animals, they just do what feels good, without regard for consequences.
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